Next Stop Cooperstown: Clayton Kershaw Announces His Retirement

Jordan Godfree-Imagn Images

The end of an era is coming to Los Angeles. On Thursday at Dodger Stadium, Clayton Kershaw announced that he will retire at the end of this season, and thus will make the final regular season home start of his career on Friday night. The news isn’t exactly a surprise, given that the 37-year-old lefty has been working more or less year-to-year while occasionally musing about retirement since his three-year, $39 million contract expired after the 2021 season. When Kershaw notched his 3,000th strikeout on July 2, it was generally understood as the final major milestone of his illustrious 18-year career that will one day be celebrated in Cooperstown. Just days later, commissioner Rob Manfred named him to the NL All-Star team as a “Legend Pick.”

On Thursday morning, Kershaw sent a group text to his teammates, telling them of his decision to retire. Teammates Freddie Freeman and Max Muncy both revealed that the pitcher had told them of his plans about a month ago, but swore them to secrecy. On Thursday afternoon, the Dodger released a statement regarding the iconic southpaw’s impending announcement.

At his press conference, Kershaw expressed measures of gratitude and relief, his voice occasionally cracking as he thanked the organization and his family. He said that he and his wife Ellen had been discussing his retirement all year. “Usually we wait until the offseason to make a final call, but almost going into this season, we kinda knew this was going to be it,” he said. “So [I] didn’t want to say anything in case I changed my mind, but over the course of the season, how grateful I am to have been healthy and out on the mound, being able to pitch, I think it just made it obvious that this was a good sending-off point.”

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With 222 career victories, 3,039 strikeouts, 11 All-Star selections, five ERA titles, three Cy Young Awards (2011, ’13, ’14), an MVP award (2014), a Pitching Triple Crown (2011), a no-hitter (June 18, 2014), and two World Series rings (2020 and ’24), Kershaw is a surefire first-ballot Hall of Famer who will be eligible for election on the 2031 BBWAA ballot. He is 20th all-time in S-JAWS, second among active pitchers behind Justin Verlander, who has one more point (66.1 to Kershaw’s 65.1) in about 700 more career innings. Kershaw’s 2.54 ERA is the lowest of any integration-era pitcher with at least 2,500 innings:

Lowest ERA Since 1947 (Minimum 2,500 Innings)
Player Years Innings Pitched ERA
Clayton Kershaw 2008–2025 2,844 2/3 2.54
Whitey Ford 1950–1967 3,170 1/3 2.75
Jim Palmer 1965–1984 3,948 2.86
Tom Seaver 1967–1986 4,783 2.86
Juan Marichal 1960–1975 3,507 2.89
Bob Gibson 1959–1975 3,884 1/3 2.91
Pedro Martínez 1992–2009 2,827 1/3 2.93
Don Drysdale 1956–1969 3,432 2.95
Mel Stottlemyre 1964–1974 2,661 1/3 2.97
Warren Spahn 1947–1965 5,102 1/3 3.08

Adjusted for ballpark and league scoring levels, Kershaw’s ERA- is the lowest using those same parameters, barely nosing out Martínez:

Lowest ERA- Since 1947 (Minimum 2,500 Innings)
Player Years Innings Pitched ERA ERA-
Clayton Kershaw 2008-2025 2,844 2/3 2.54 65
Pedro Martínez 1992-2009 2,827 1/3 2.93 66
Roger Clemens 1984-2007 4,916 2/3 3.12 70
Whitey Ford 1950-1967 3,170 1/3 2.75 75
Randy Johnson 1988-2009 4,135 1/3 3.29 75
Greg Maddux 1986-2008 5,008 1/3 3.16 76
Roy Halladay 1998-2013 2,749 1/3 3.38 76
Max Scherzer 2008-2025 2,957 1/3 3.19 76
Kevin Brown 1986–2005 3,256 3.28 78
Justin Verlander 2005-2025 3,557 1/3 3.32 78
Bob Gibson 1959-1975 3,884 1/3 2.91 78

If you’re wondering about the rankings of another three-time Cy Young-winning Dodgers lefty, Sandy Koufax pitched to a 2.76 ERA and 75 ERA- in 2,324 1/3 innings; at a 2,000-inning cutoff, he would rank fourth in ERA and seventh in ERA-. Kershaw is tied with outfielder Zack Wheat and shortstop Bill Russell for the most seasons played with the Dodgers (18), and he holds the franchise records for strikeouts and pitching WAR (78.7 fWAR, 77.6 bWAR) while ranking second in wins only to Don Sutton (233).

After reaching free agency following the 2021, ’22 and ’23 seasons, Kershaw mulled the possibility of leaving the Dodgers to sign with the Rangers, his hometown team. But between his various offseason rehabilitation programs, the 2021–22 owners’ lockout, and the Rangers’ financial uncertainty regarding their cable television deal, staying with the team that drafted him out of Highland Park High School with the seventh pick in 2006 — a round that accounts for eight Cy Youngs between Kershaw, 10th pick Tim Lincecum, and 11th pick Max Scherzer — always made more sense. When he reported to Camelback Ranch in February, Kershaw admitted that he may have previously undervalued the possibility of spending his entire career with the Dodgers:

“I don’t think I put enough merit on it at times, what it means to be able to be in one organization for your entire career. You look at people throughout all of sports that have been able to do that, and it is special, it is. I don’t want to lose sight of that. Getting to be here for my whole career, however long that is, is definitely a goal.”

It’s been an amazing run in Los Angeles. Kershaw first turned heads during spring training in 2008. In a March 9 Grapefruit League game against the Red Sox, 10 days short of his 20th birthday, he threw a curveball that buckled the knees of Sean Casey and awed broadcaster Vin Scully, whose nickname for that big-bending pitch stuck: “Ohhh, what a curve ball! Holy mackerel! He just broke off Public Enemy Number One. Look at this thing! It’s up there, it’s right there, and Casey is history.”

Kershaw began that season at Double-A Jacksonville, making 11 starts before being called up to debut against the Cardinals on May 25, 2008. In his prime, he pumped his fastball in the mid-90s — it averaged 95.0 mph in his rookie season, and was still at 94.3 mph as of 2015 — but that famous curveball and its similarly devastating cousin, his slider, are the pitches that have earned him a spot in the pantheon. According to Baseball Savant — which covers the entirety of his career via PITCHf/x and Statcast — batters have hit .145 and slugged .216 with a 36.5% whiff rate against his curve, and hit .183 and slugged .292 with a 38.8% whiff rate against his slider; the former was strike three 753 times, the latter a jaw-dropping 1,332 times.

Though he flirted with adding a changeup here and there, and over the past three seasons has dabbled with an effective splitter, Kershaw’s three-pitch combination, coming from an extremely over-the-top arm slot (62 degrees as of 2020, the first year of Statcast’s measurements in that area, and 56 degrees as of this season), with a familiar hesitation at the top of his delivery, was enough to befuddle batters. His .211 batting average allowed is the second lowest at the 2,500-inning cutoff since integration, nestled between Nolan Ryan (.204) and Martínez (.214), while his 65 OPS+ allowed is second to Martínez’s 61, ahead of Clemens’ third-ranked 68. That dominance drove his success, and that of the Dodgers, for the better part of the past two decades. If the team holds on to win the NL West this season, it will be its 14th division title in his 18 seasons, and its 15th playoff berth.

Kershaw’s announcement comes at a time when he has begun to scuffle a bit; over his last three starts, he’s yielded 10 runs and walked nine in 13 2/3 innings, and he hasn’t lasted six innings since his August 15 start against the Padres — a memorable outing in which he helped the Dodgers halt a four-game losing streak and reclaim a share of first place in the NL West. Even so, he has generally pitched well this season despite working with a fastball that has averaged just 89 mph, topping 90 only a handful of times per start.

After undergoing a pair of offseason surgeries — one to repair the torn meniscus in his left knee, the other to remove a bone spur and repair a ruptured plantar plate in his left foot — Kershaw didn’t make his season debut until May 17. But aside from a start skipped just before the All-Star break, he’s taken the ball on turn, though almost always with five or six days of rest. In 102 innings, he’s pitched to a 3.53 ERA and 3.59 FIP, offsetting a career-low 17% strikeout rate by holding batters to a 4.1% barrel rate and generally avoiding the long ball. The solo homer he allowed to the Padres’ Ramón Laureano in that August 15 outing is the only one he’s served up in his last 60 1/3 innings dating back to July 2. That was the night he struck out Vinny Capra of the White Sox with the 100th and final pitch of his night — a slider on the outside edge of the plate, naturally — to give him an even 3,000 for his career.

That strikeout made Kershaw the 20th pitcher to reach 3,000 but just the fourth left-hander, after Steve Carlton, Randy Johnson, and CC Sabathia. While Kershaw was the fourth-fastest pitcher to reach the milestone in terms of innings pitched, getting there turned into quite a slog due to his injuries, which have prevented him from making 30 starts in any season since 2015 and sent him to the injured list at least once in every season since.

Kershaw finished the 2021 season, his age-33 campaign, needing just 330 strikeouts to reach 3,000, which based on his 2019–21 performances looked doable across a pair of 25-start seasons. While he pitched his way onto the NL All-Star teams in both 2022 and ’23, with ERAs of 2.28 and 2.46, he totaled just 46 starts and 274 strikeouts in that span, leaving him 56 strikeouts shy of the magic mark. With last season bracketed by his recovery from November 2023 surgery to repair the glenohumeral ligaments and capsule of his left shoulder on one side, and the aforementioned left leg surgeries on the other, he made just seven starts totaling 30 innings, with just 24 strikeouts. He was not on the active roster during the Dodgers’ run to a championship, and at the team’s victory parade in Los Angeles, he exclaimed, “I didn’t have anything to do with this championship, but it feels like I have the best feeling in the world — that I get to celebrate with you guys!”

As for what comes next for Kershaw after Friday’s start, it’s not yet clear. Barring an injury, he will almost certainly be on the postseason roster, but unlike the past two Octobers, the Dodgers are headed toward the playoffs with their best starters healthy and effective. Indeed, since the All-Star break, the Dodgers have the majors’ best rotation in terms of both ERA (3.27) and FIP (2.99); the latter mark is nearly three-quarters of a run better than that of the second-ranked Phillies (3.70). Every starter but Kershaw is missing bats galore:

Dodgers Starting Pitchers Since the All-Star Break
Player GS IP K% BB% HR/9 ERA FIP
Yoshinobu Yamamoto 10 63 1/3 32.0% 8.6% 0.57 2.56 2.55
Tyler Glasnow 10 59 1/3 29.3% 10.3% 0.91 2.88 3.49
Emmet Sheehan 8 52* 30.3% 8.7% 1.21 3.46 3.51
Clayton Kershaw 10 51.1 17.1% 7.1% 0.18 3.68 2.93
Blake Snell 8 46 1/3 34.1% 9.2% 0.58 2.53 2.37
Shohei Ohtani 8 32 33.1% 5.3% 0.84 3.94 2.27
*Includes two bulk relief appearances totaling eight innings.

There’s no question that Glasnow, Snell, and Yamamoto will start for the Dodgers this October, and all signs point to Ohtani being the fourth. The team has kept the two-way superstar on a short leash in his first season back from his second UCL reconstruction surgery; only twice has he reached the five-inning mark or gone past 70 pitches. Though the Dodgers have considered the possibility of using Ohtani in relief à la the 2023 World Baseball Classic championship game, that prospect is complicated by the fact that removing him would cost the team its designated hitter spot — thus requiring Ohtani to play the outfield in order to remain in the game, something he hasn’t done since 2021. Manager Dave Roberts all but shut that alternative scenario down earlier this week, saying in part, “[T]o think that now it’s feasible for a guy that’s just coming off what he’s done last year, or didn’t do last year, to then now put him in a role that’s very, very unique… You potentially could be taking on risk, and we’ve come this far, certainly with the kid gloves and managing.”

As for the other two starters, Sheehan has been brilliant lately but may face an innings cap given in his first year back from Tommy John surgery. Both he and Kershaw could be used as multi-inning relievers, possibly able to go three or four innings after a starter goes five or six, which would help to mitigate a bullpen that’s been torched for a 5.43 ERA this month. “I feel that there’s a place for him on our postseason roster,” Roberts said of Kershaw on Thursday. “I don’t know what role, but I think that the bottom line is, I trust him. And so, for me, the postseason is about players you trust.”

The postseason has often been a fraught subject when it comes to Kershaw. His 4.49 ERA in October is nearly two full runs higher than his regular season mark, and his 3.81 postseason FIP nearly one run higher than his regular season one (2.85), with his home run rate almost doubling, from 0.74 to 1.39. At times he’s been let down by his offenses and his bullpens, as is the case for just about every starting pitcher given enough opportunities. At times he’s been let down by his managers; think Don Mattingly leaving him in to allow eight seventh-inning runs in the 2014 Division Series opener against the Cardinals. At times he’s been let down by his opponents’ skullduggery and his own hubris; in the wake of commissioner Rob Manfred’s investigation into the Astros’ 2017 sign-stealing scheme, Kershaw expressed regret in early 2020 that he didn’t heed warnings to change signs with a runner on second base in Game 5 of the World Series, during which he allowed six runs. And of course, at times Kershaw has been let down by his own failing body; he retired just one out of eight Diamondbacks in the Division Series opener in 2023 while pitching through the shoulder issues that led him to undergo surgery less than a month later.

While his postseason heroics never reached the level of a Gibson or a Madison Bumgarner, Kershaw has had some shining moments in October. He made a dominant pair of starts against the Braves in the 2013 Division Series, allowing one earned run in 13 innings. He came out of the bullpen on one day of rest to record a two-out save in Game 5 of the 2016 Division Series against the Nationals, after closer Kenley Jansen had thrown 2 1/3 innings; Kershaw followed that with seven shutout innings against the Cubs in Game 2 of the NLCS. He struck out 11 while allowing one run and three hits in seven innings against the Astros in the 2017 World Series opener at Dodger Stadium, where Houston’s notorious trash cans were out of reach. He spun eight shutout innings with 13 strikeouts against the Brewers in the 2020 NL Wild Card Series clincher, and authored two gutty wins in that year’s World Series against the Rays, the second of which, in Game 5, came after Tampa Bay’s bizarre walk-off win in Game 4 and set up the Dodgers’ chance to clinch.

Regarding Kershaw’s career, one other blemish can’t escape mention. Twice in the past three seasons, he has upstaged the Dodgers’ annual LGBTQ Pride Night, and it’s cost him some amount of goodwill. In 2023, he publicly pressured the Dodgers to rescind an invitation to the Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence, a drag troupe that describes itself as a “leading-edge Order of queer and trans nuns.”

The Dodgers at first heeded the calls of Kershaw and others to disinvite the Sisters, only to reverse course after they received backlash for canceling on them. But Kershaw’s comments did force the team to accelerate its announcement of its Christian Faith and Family Day, for which the pitcher served as the primary organizer. “This has nothing to do with the LGBTQ community or Pride or anything like that,” he said at the time. “This is simply a group that was making fun of a religion — that I don’t agree with.”

It might have been easier for some to overlook Kershaw’s reaction to the Sisters as an isolated incident had it not been for this year’s Dodgers Pride Night on June 13, when Kershaw altered his cap, which featured the team’s interlocking LA filled in with the colors of the rainbow. On it, he wrote “Gen. 9:12-16,” an Old Testament verse that, as Michael Elizondo at True Blue LA notes, has been “frequently used by homophobic Christians to denounce the LGBT community as their appropriation of the rainbow is allegedly blasphemous.” On a night meant to celebrate diversity, Kershaw instead chose a message of defiance and intolerance.

Particularly in these politically polarizing times, with LGBTQ+ rights under daily attack by the Trump administration, Kershaw’s move was divisive and disappointing, but it went unchallenged on the Dodgers beat even as the photo of him wearing the altered hat went viral. As best I can tell, he’s never publicly commented on the matter, so if a picture is worth a thousand words, he’s left that image to be his statement on the subject without offering any alternative interpretations. Three months later, the cap controversy was still being referred to on social media as news of Kershaw’s retirement announcement began to circulate.

Kershaw is not without his imperfections, his impact in the game not without complication. Inarguably, he has defined one of the most fruitful eras in Dodgers history while carving his own niche, not only as one of the best pitchers of his generation, but of all time. His public persona has been marked by his charitable foundation, Kershaw’s Challenge, which according to its web page has raised $23 million “to support at-risk children and families around the globe,” as well as his comments denouncing racial injustice in June 2020, in the wake of the murder of George Floyd. Yet it also carries with it his Pride Night remarks and protest at a moment of profound vulnerability for the LGBTQ+ community. To appreciate Kershaw’s immense legacy is to view him in his totality, the greatness, the disappointments, and everything in between, all taken together.





Brooklyn-based Jay Jaffe is a senior writer for FanGraphs, the author of The Cooperstown Casebook (Thomas Dunne Books, 2017) and the creator of the JAWS (Jaffe WAR Score) metric for Hall of Fame analysis. He founded the Futility Infielder website (2001), was a columnist for Baseball Prospectus (2005-2012) and a contributing writer for Sports Illustrated (2012-2018). He has been a recurring guest on MLB Network and a member of the BBWAA since 2011, and a Hall of Fame voter since 2021. Follow him on BlueSky @jayjaffe.bsky.social.

170 Comments
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alang3131982Member since 2016
11 months ago

Meh, dude is a huge loser.

PhilMember since 2016
11 months ago
Reply to  alang3131982

Yup, 96 losses.

Still, he has 222 wins.

frankenspock
11 months ago
Reply to  alang3131982

Baby’s first internet troll.

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  frankenspock

He means as a human being, not a pitcher.

Hello BaseballMember since 2021
11 months ago
Reply to  drewsylvania

Also not correct. Keep trying thought police

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  Hello Baseball

You’re late, brigadier. No soup for you.

drplantwrenchMember since 2024
11 months ago

hes certainly a hall of fame pitcher and deserves it, but he’ll always be a giant jerk to me to upstage LGBT groups with the dumb guise of “religious persecution”. Good riddance to him

BipMember since 2016
11 months ago
Reply to  drplantwrench

He wasn’t the only one to object to that group, and he only objected to that group, not the whole event, and he hasn’t publicly spoken against the event in any other way, nor in the other years it happened. If he was against the event itself, as everyone assumes, why did he wait until then to say anything?

I mean, you’re entitled to feel however you feel. But to me it’s crazy to take a guy who is so respected in the sport, has accomplished so much on the field, has otherwise been a stand up person (good family, no hint of mistreatment, charitable actions), never even publicly supported Trump or anything, and expresses like the tamest possible reservation about a Pride night event and now it’s “good riddance.”

Idk buddy, f that, the sport is not better without guys like Clayton Kershaw.

drplantwrenchMember since 2024
11 months ago
Reply to  Bip

it wasnt just that group, its also making the event about him, about writing bible verses used by christofascist homophobes on his hat, just being a hypocritical bad person. having a “good family” doesnt negate any of those things

i love baseball, but i will never let baseball accolades excuse bigotry. good riddance indeed

Hello BaseballMember since 2021
11 months ago
Reply to  drplantwrench

christofascist? I like made up words too. For a community with so much pride, you guys sure need constant reassurance

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  Hello Baseball

You demonstrate further ignorance with every post.

Lanidrac
11 months ago
Reply to  drplantwrench

That particular group is highly debatable, and I can certainly see his point. At the very least, it’s not a “dumb guise.”

airforce21oneMember since 2026
11 months ago
Reply to  drplantwrench

This! People I disagree with are obviously immoral and should be cancelled immediately. Part of the problem here is his white privilege: he needs to check that immediately.

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  airforce21one

Sometimes, people you disagree with *are* immoral. Or, at least, too ignorant to realize their actions are immoral.

snakestl
11 months ago

I hope Clayton takes Pride in his career accomplishments.

carterMember since 2020
11 months ago

Great player, legitimately one of the greatest of all time. I have a feeling he gets in the postseason somehow this season, a start wouldn’t surprise me.

Regarding the other things it’s unfortunate. But we also have to recognize that he shares an opinion with a large % of ballplayers. Certainly the majority of US born (probably 2/3rds) and likely the majority overall. The difference is most those players keep their mouth shut, hence why Kershaw is sort of the face of it.

I still personally feel like we can celebrate the player, and he’s a pitcher that legit could be considered on a per game (except postseason) the greatest of most of our lifetimes.

frankenspock
11 months ago
Reply to  carter

One thing that fans don’t like to acknowledge is just how conservative most pro athletes are. MLB is probably 90% Trump voters.

sadtromboneMember since 2020
11 months ago
Reply to  frankenspock

I’d say it varies a bit by sport, but I would guess MLB is probably the most conservative.

RobertMember since 2017
11 months ago
Reply to  sadtrombone

It’s got to be that or hockey

chartsengrafs
11 months ago
Reply to  frankenspock

When you hit triples, you wonder why can’t everyone else can’t be born on third base.

Last edited 11 months ago by chartsengrafs
PressXToJason
11 months ago
Reply to  frankenspock

But at least most (and I mean MOST – for instance it was News when Charlie Kirk had Michael Busch and Matt Shaw pose for pictures with him earlier this year on the field at Wrigley – players tend to understand that celebrating people who think racial minorities, women, and LGBTQ+ folk shouldn’t have equal rights is a bad move for people who are paid to be publicly liked) let Pride Night – ONE night set aside for us each year – go by without openly trying to tear it down. Not only has he chosen to do so, he’s done it on two out of three chances, and I’m pretty sure he wasn’t active for the third. If he wants to display his homophobia the other 80 home games of the year, he can. He could have those verses on his hat any time he pleases. But he chooses to do so only when it’s our one night, which makes it obvious that it’s not about his faith or any kind of theoretical substantive problem.

Lanidrac
11 months ago
Reply to  frankenspock

Many conservatives are not Trump voters, you know.

Last edited 11 months ago by Lanidrac
PhilMember since 2016
11 months ago
Reply to  carter

Regarding your first point, I’ve wondered if they could piggy back him with Ohtani – Ohtani goes 4 innings, Kershaw goes 4, and then whatever reliever isn’t a dumpster fire that day. Ohtani and Kershaw are stylistically about as different as you can get, without one being a knuckleballer – and maybe that would make his stuff play up more?

Roger McDowell Hot Foot
11 months ago
Reply to  carter

Granting your premise for the moment — though I think it’s arguable: I could imagine there might be a lot of conservative Christian ballplayers who aren’t bigots — there is still a pretty big difference between being a bigot in the privacy of your own thoughts and being a public advocate of bigotry!

carterMember since 2020
11 months ago

Agreed!

David Klein
11 months ago

I remember when Kershaw came up Joe Torre compared him to Sandy Koufax and I’m sure I’m not the one that rolled my eyes but Kershaw ended up being better than Koufax and really all but what 15-20 or so at most pitchers in baseball history? He took a lot of criticism for his playoff performances but he’s easily one of the top five pitchers I’ve ever seen. He was a force of nature during his peak and even a metronome it is too bad he’s had so many injuries what his last half decade plus because who knows how much more he would have done but he’s had an amazing career and his baseball legacy is of an all-time great no question.

Last edited 11 months ago by David Klein
sadtromboneMember since 2020
11 months ago
Reply to  David Klein

It’s hard to compare Sandy Koufax to anyone because he three of the best pitching seasons of all time, another three years as a “normal” league ace, and that’s it. There are players who have that I think there are aspects of the careers of Pedro Martinez, Doc Gooden, Jacob deGrom, and Bob Gibson that are like that. But I’m not sure anyone has had a career quite that extreme.

Kershaw has a more conventional case. Between 2011 and 2015, Clayton Kershaw had four out of the five best seasons for a starting pitcher in major league baseball, and then had the lowest ERA- in sixteen years in 2016 to top it off. And he also has 3000 strikeouts and another five or six years where he ranged from “good” to “very good”.

BipMember since 2016
11 months ago
Reply to  David Klein

My greatest “what if” of his career is what if he had finished the 2016 season healthy. That was going to be in the conversation for greatest starting pitching season of all time.

CC AFCMember since 2016
11 months ago

Update: Jay Jaffe’s writings will no longer be appearing until he apologizes and donates a meaningful sum to Clayton’s family and preferred charities. This action has been taken because Mr. Jaffe accurately described Clayton’s actions that do not reflect well on Clayton.

StuSheaMember since 2018
11 months ago
Reply to  CC AFC

His will not be the last shoes to drop!

FrodoBeck
11 months ago

I honestly cannot believe that you just refuse to let this asinine pride stuff go, and have to mar every single Kershaw article with it.

baseballtimeintexasMember since 2024
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

You know who else could have let this Pride stuff go, so people wouldn’t bring it up? Clayton Kershaw

FrodoBeck
11 months ago

Could he have? It seems like pride stuff was literally put in front of him on an annual basis, so I don’t think he could let it go.

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

Blame the people who hate LGBTQ+. If they didn’t hate there would be no need to spread awareness.

PressXToJason
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

One night a year. He managed not to wear the verses on his gear any other nights. Seems like he was the one antagonizing.

TrevorCap
11 months ago

Yeah, I mean he clearly wanted people to know and note his opinion so it would be against his wishes for people not to note he’s a homophobe. It’s important to him that everyone knows that!

sadtromboneMember since 2020
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

I am fairly certain people care about this because the hat thing undermines his previous statements about it being about religion and nothing else.

A lot of people don’t like homophobic statements but they especially don’t like being gaslit about it.

jrla25
11 months ago
Reply to  sadtrombone

Hey sad trombone, can we get an update on the Dodgers should trade Michael Bush for Jorge Mateo because that’s what his value is? I think a top 20 prospect and top 5 prospect is more valuable than a designated runner. Thanks

sadtromboneMember since 2020
11 months ago
Reply to  jrla25

You’ve had a year and a half to needle me over this and you’re just doing it now?! Buy a membership, then we’ll talk.

jrla25
11 months ago
Reply to  sadtrombone

Buying membership doesn’t make your constantly wrong Dodger takes right. Let’s see we have the Busch is only worth Jorge Mateo, Zyhir Hope is not a real prospect, 2023 NLDS was changing of the guard and it’s Arizona’s division now, they paid too much for Scherzer and Turner. You love to make comically wrong takes then boast about paying too much do so

Roger McDowell Hot Foot
11 months ago
Reply to  jrla25

I just wanted to say thank you for being the one person angrily derailing this comment section in an unpredictable direction

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  jrla25

Rent-free in your head

FrodoBeck
11 months ago
Reply to  sadtrombone

It’s not gaslighting, it clearly is about religion and nothing else. Pride is in direct contradiction with his religious beliefs.

I truly do find it astonishing that Jay can look at 18 years worth of material for a top 5 pitcher of all time and yet cannot allow himself to ignore things that hurt his delicate sensibilities.

I can’t possibly imagine why fangraphs might have a hard time expanding its readership or continues to have money issues, it’s a conundrum for sure

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

You’re the snowflake here, smoothbrain.

ichiro262Member since 2024
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

There’s a big difference IMO between “my religious belief is that being LGBTQ+ is wrong so I’m not going to be gay or trans” vs. “my religious belief is that being LGBTQ+ is wrong and I expect other people to live their life differently because of my belief”.

If the only thing were the Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence thing, I’d be inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt that he actually thought their whole thing was making fun of religion. It isn’t and he could’ve easily figured that out before talking shit about it, but I could chalk that up to him being a bit ignorant and uneducated in a way that doesn’t color my opinion of him.

The “I’m gonna write over the pride hat with a bible verse that’s commonly used as an anti-LGBTQ+ rallying cry” is worse for me and paints it as more of a “I want to remind people that I don’t think gay people should exist”.

All in all it’s pretty mild as far as athlete transgressions go, but does make me think of him as (at least) kind of a dick.

Lanidrac
11 months ago
Reply to  ichiro262

Nobody thinks gay and trans people shouldn’t exist (well, hardly anyone). They just think they should refrain from the lifestyle. And even if they do live the lifestyle, they don’t hate the people who do so. Love the sinner, hate the sin.

Last edited 11 months ago by Lanidrac
PhilMember since 2016
11 months ago
Reply to  Lanidrac

I’m sorry but “Nobody thinks gay and trans people shouldn’t exist (well, hardly anyone)” is completely contradictory to “They just think they should refrain from the lifestyle”. If you don’t think gay/trans people should be able to live their life as gay/trans, then you are saying they shouldn’t exist.

If I were to say I have no problem with people being Christian, but every church should be levelled, no one should be allowed to wear any Christian iconography or symbols in public, and any media depictions of Christians are also banned, then I do really have a problem with Christians.

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  Lanidrac

Yeah, this just shows that you haven’t been paying attention.

AlbyMember since 2017
11 months ago
Reply to  Lanidrac

You get to live your lifestyle, they get to live theirs, right? Right? You judgmental people who can’t mind their own business are the problem.

“The lifestyle.” You mean “their life.”

Last edited 11 months ago by Alby
PressXToJason
11 months ago
Reply to  Lanidrac

The president called for a day of mourning for a guy who said that gay people should be stoned to death. In the last two weeks.

puddleMember since 2017
11 months ago
Reply to  Lanidrac

“refrain from the lifestyle”

Embarrassing to still call being gay or trans a “lifestyle” in the year of our lord 2025.

Anyway, Christians really should take the “remove the log from your own eye before focusing on the speck in another’s” verse a lot more seriously, because… *gestures at everything happening around us*

sadtromboneMember since 2020
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

I think that if you want to stick your fingers in your ears and scream “I can’t hear you!” at the top of your lungs you will not understand why people feel like they got duped with his explanations back in 2023. It’s explained in the article, it’s explained at the link to True Blue LA, but I can’t make you read it if you don’t want to.

Last edited 11 months ago by sadtrombone
drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  sadtrombone

This.

I can’t decide how often it is ignorance or denial or deliberate gaslighting.

FrodoBeck
11 months ago
Reply to  sadtrombone

It seems equally impossible to ever convince 95%+ of the readership here that Kershaw doesn’t hate gay people, so it seems we’re at an impasse

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

You’re not even understanding the arguments we’re making.

PressXToJason
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

He gave plenty of attention to his play. Maybe you can only keep two paragraphs worth of reading in your brain at one time, it would explain plenty of your issues, but Jay did, in fact, give Kershaw plenty of praise. He called him one of the all time greats! What is he supposed to do, go all state-controlled-media on us?

FrodoBeck
11 months ago
Reply to  PressXToJason

2 paragraphs about it is exactly 2 many. It’s a baseball website

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

Rent-free.
Your head.

PressXToJason
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

Yes, we know two paragraphs is more than you can read.

MikeMember since 2022
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

Have you read Jay’s stuff before? He writes awesome, comprehensive accounts of players’ careers and legacies. He digs into their backgrounds prior to joining organized ball and touches on the imprint they leave behind, all in service to the individual’s lasting impact on the game.

Ultimately, the characters of the sport are what inform our relationship with it, and the stats and ball facts are just language in service to that goal. Acknowledging the full character of a human being who played this game enriches our understanding of that player and the game, even if it doesn’t always paint them in a positive light.

People arguing that Kershaw is a POS because of some things he did and people arguing that those things shouldn’t even be mentioned are both missing the point.

This is a tribute. So let’s do the man we tribute service by painting him in 3d, not as a caricature that placates our fantasies.

FrodoBeck
11 months ago
Reply to  Mike

Slandering someone bc they don’t agree with you isn’t a tribute. It’s disgusting

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

Narrator: Frodo did not know what the word “slander” meant

hurricanexyzMember since 2016
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

To be clear, the claim that “it’s just about religion” was not that Kershaw only hates queer people because of his religion! Rather, he was trying to suggest that he has nothing against queer people, and only objected to the Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence because they were mocking the Catholic Church (not because of, y’know, the drag thing).

Which is clearly not true.

FrodoBeck
11 months ago
Reply to  hurricanexyz

Well, it’s clearly true. You just can’t seem to grasp it

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

Dunning-Kruger effect

hurricanexyzMember since 2016
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

If that’s true, why did he also protest pride night this year, when the Sisters were not involved?

FrodoBeck
11 months ago
Reply to  hurricanexyz

Because that’s also in contradiction with his religion. Obviously

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

So his religion is the entire contents of what he believes?

Do you realize the apologist slippery slope that comes with that notion?

Hello BaseballMember since 2021
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

Most writers are Libs, and most Libs can’t let anything go, or have anybody with an opinion different from their identity politics soaked world view. You’re surprised?

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  Hello Baseball

By all means keep demonstrating how little you know.

“Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and to remove all doubt.”

FrancoeursteinMember since 2020
11 months ago

“This is simply a group that was making fun of a religion — that I don’t agree with.”

This is a reasonable stance that the average baseball fan would agree with.

tarvisMember since 2019
11 months ago
Reply to  Francoeurstein

Which is noted by Jay in the following paragraph, with a somewhat damning caveat:

It might have been easier for some to overlook Kershaw’s reaction to the Sisters as an isolated incident had it not been for this year’s Dodgers Pride Night on June 13, when Kershaw altered his cap, which featured the team’s interlocking LA filled in with the colors of the rainbow. On it, he wrote “Gen. 9:12-16,” an Old Testament verse that, as Michael Elizondo at True Blue LA notes, has been “frequently used by homophobic Christians to denounce the LGBT community as their appropriation of the rainbow is allegedly blasphemous.” On a night meant to celebrate diversity, Kershaw instead chose a message of defiance and intolerance.

Last edited 11 months ago by tarvis
FrodoBeck
11 months ago
Reply to  Francoeurstein

Jay write an article about Kershaw without bringing up pride challenge: impossible

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

Sounds like you have delicate sensibilities.

FrodoBeck
11 months ago
Reply to  drewsylvania

Because I want a baseball website to consist of articles talking about baseball? If I want to read nonsensical political drivel, I can go so many other places. But this is what people on the left can’t seem to help themselves from doing – destroying every space possible by injecting things where they don’t need to be

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Cool Lester SmoothMember since 2020
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

Facts don’t care about your fee-fees, snowflake.

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

Oh, you no doubt consume copious amounts of drivel.

puddleMember since 2017
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

You are welcome to not read anymore. It’s a very simple solution.

AlbyMember since 2017
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

Boo hoo. One snowflake does not make a blizzard.

PhilMember since 2016
11 months ago
Reply to  Francoeurstein

Is it? Even accepting that the Sisters were mocking the Catholic church, I don’t think religions should be exempt from jokes. How many baseball fans have laughed at South Park, for example. (Granted a team doing a South Park night would be… well, it would sure be something.)

There is also a Major League team literally named after Catholic priests – and their mascot is a guy cosplaying as a monk. To me, there is always a little bit of making fun of with a mascot – it might be light hearted, but it still isn’t treating it with a great deal of respect and solemnity. One person’s joke is another person’s blasphemy is another person’s nothing burger.

Lanidrac
11 months ago
Reply to  Phil

“South Park” is a disgrace to television, particularly when it mocks religion.

The Padres mascot is a much better example of religious jokes that don’t actually go too far.

I have no idea what the Sisters actually do, but it’s quite possible that they could be taking the joke too far.

Last edited 11 months ago by Lanidrac
AlbyMember since 2017
11 months ago
Reply to  Lanidrac

Why shouldn’t religion be mocked? A bunch of people scared of death, unable to admit that the universe is random and that once they’re dead they’re gone. Eminently mockable, yet most of us refrain to spare your delicate sensibilities.

PC1970Member since 2024
11 months ago
Reply to  Francoeurstein

I would.

I am a lapsed Catholic, parents were/are Catholic, still are & I went to a Catholic grade school & church every Sunday while growing up. Quit going as soon as I went away to college & never looked back.

That said, I cringed a little reading about the Sisters. & I don’t think I would feel differently if they were dressed as priests, rabbis or imam’s. Easy to laugh at if you’re not religious, but, a line that could easily be offensive if you are. To the point that I almost can’t believe the Dodgers would think it’s acceptable as in-game entertainment. Feels like a bad idea all the way around.

(& yes, I have been to drag shows before in New Orleans & Key West.Had a great time both times..Trust me, i’m not easily offended, but, there’s a time & a place..& not sure an MLB game with a bunch of kids attending is the place.).

The cap thing this year, though, is a very bad look by Kershaw & unacceptable. & yes, it completely changes the tenor of his objections to the Sisters.

sadtromboneMember since 2020
11 months ago
Reply to  PC1970

Yeah, this is it. There is definitely space to be offended by a bunch of nuns in drag without being overtly bigoted, especially if you’re Catholic. Kershaw isn’t Catholic, but it’s plausible anyway and he (and his publicist) worked very hard to thread the needle there originally. The cap thing this year undoes his explanation for that, and now we know what the earlier situation was about.

I don’t think this will have any impact on his Hall of Fame candidacy. And if he shuts his mouth for the next five years then I am confident it won’t have any impact at all. But plenty of people are going to remember how he went out of his way to do this, and it’s not surprising it’s at the top of our minds because this happened three months ago. It’s maybe the most newsworthy thing he’s done all year.

Last edited 11 months ago by sadtrombone
drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  PC1970

Agree with sadtrombone (and your post, of course). I think there is a difference between:

a) being offended by something in a given moment (due to circumstances, knee-jerk reaction, or even “I find x activity disgusting and I would never do it”)

and

b) “x activity is a blight on society, the people doing it should never do it anywhere because it is offensive to everyone,” and supporting the demonization of their lifestyle

I mean, I am a cis guy, I find the notion of sex between men gross, but if people want to do that, what’s the problem? Ditto things like holding hands in public, etc.

And I get that Pride parades feature lots of over-the-top stuff. While I don’t enjoy the over-the-top stuff, I *do* enjoy seeing people who are repressed by society defying that repression publicly.

AlbyMember since 2017
11 months ago
Reply to  Francoeurstein

Who are you to speak for the “average baseball fan,” as if there were such a thing? I tolerate religion even though it’s a demonstrably destructive force in this country. You could try reciprocating.

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  Alby

Some of it is destructive, some of it isn’t. If it were 100% a destructive force, I’d oppose it at every turn, I’d have no tolerance for it.

booondMember since 2019
11 months ago

Great pitcher, shit human being.

FrodoBeck
11 months ago
Reply to  booond

Top 5 pitcher all time, wonderful human being

Philip ChristyMember since 2016
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

Why are you so anti-gay?

FrodoBeck
11 months ago
Reply to  Philip Christy

I’m not anti-gay. I just don’t care at all about them like I equally don’t care about straight people either

Why can’t baseball be about baseball

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

List your beliefs or shut the **** up. Are you his publicist?

FrodoBeck
11 months ago
Reply to  drewsylvania

Why are you so obsessed with me

Cool Lester SmoothMember since 2020
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

No reason to blame him for reacting to the continuous stream of dumbassery you’ve inflicted on everyone reading this comments section.

FrodoBeck
11 months ago

Injecting common sense into awful places is worth the effort

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

You demonstrate both ignorance and stupidity with every post.

I understand the desire to inject what you believe is right into awful places–

–you are injecting ignorance and stupidity into an excellent place. If only you had any idea you were doing that.

FrodoBeck
11 months ago

You are too, it seems

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

You keep replying with weapons-grade garbage and illogic, and you just admitted you don’t care about anyone but yourself.

We have a duty to attempt to educate regressives such as yourself. We want a better world. But you don’t. You seem to be immune or allergic to knowledge *and* only care about yourself. So the best reaction to you is scorn and ridicule.

I mean, you’ve earned it.

FrodoBeck
11 months ago
Reply to  drewsylvania

I find it very flattering, so thanks

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  FrodoBeck

Narrator: Frodo did not, in fact, find it flattering, as he was frothing at the mouth a few minutes ago.

Johnnie TMember since 2024
11 months ago
Reply to  booond

Aside from a few snippets, I don’t think any of us REALLY know enough about Kershaw to say if he is a good or bad person, or like most of us, somewhat in between..

Cool Lester SmoothMember since 2020
11 months ago
Reply to  Johnnie T

Fair – I’d stick to “jackass” myself.

PC1970Member since 2024
11 months ago
Reply to  booond

You mean other than the $23M he has raised for charity.

I don’t agree with his stance on LGBTQ+ either, but, it’s more complicated than that.

sadtromboneMember since 2020
11 months ago

I realize that people don’t love Kershaw they way they love CC Sabathia, who had this incredible personality and one of the most memorable stretches of pitching in the latter months of 2008. But if Sabathia got in with 85% of the vote on the first ballot, there’s no suspense here at all. The only real question is whether he’ll get closer to 93% or 99%.

tarvisMember since 2019
11 months ago

I think this write up is a fairly proportional response … an overwhelmingly positive and glowing memorial of Kershaw’s career, with an accompanying conclusion on the sometimes disappointing stances an otherwise universally lauded, generational player took.

I do not think much, or any of this will likely come back up when he is HoF eligible, nor will it prevent his (likely near-unanimous) inclusion on the first ballot, but it is, as Jay notes somewhat resignedly: Disappointing. For a player notably quiet, these choices–so oversized in their impact–will not age well, unlike, I hope, Clayton.

JupiterBrandoMember since 2020
11 months ago
Reply to  tarvis

Kershaw only made his homophobia known within the past few years, he can certainly show himself to be far worse throughout the next five

sadtromboneMember since 2020
11 months ago
Reply to  JupiterBrando

I’m pretty sure all he has to do is not say anything. While I personally would expect him to do that, I am far less confident of that for any given athlete than I was a few years ago.

Cool Lester SmoothMember since 2020
11 months ago
Reply to  sadtrombone

That’s all Curt Schilling needed to do!!!

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  JupiterBrando

He can choose to be Schilling or Tim Thomas. I wonder what he will choose.

StuSheaMember since 2018
11 months ago
Reply to  drewsylvania

Those are the only two choices? God help us.

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  StuShea

Hopefully he will have a mea culpa moment.

howieloader
11 months ago

Probably more “Hall of Very Good” than “Hall of Fame”.

David Klein
11 months ago
Reply to  howieloader

He’s at around 80 war and has the counting ststs as well this is an asinine post.

PhilMember since 2016
11 months ago
Reply to  howieloader

Obvious troll is obvious, and I know I’ve swallowed the bait… But…

Lowest ERA- of all MLB starters, minimum 1000IP (there are 3 Negro League pitchers with lower). If Kershaw isn’t in your HoF, then you don’t think any pitcher should be in there.

howieloader
11 months ago
Reply to  Phil

I said it just for the downvotes.

MichaelMember since 2020
11 months ago

I’m glad Jay has the editorial freedom to paint an accurate picture.

TonyMember since 2017
11 months ago

I liked Clayton better before I knew he was a bigot!

cashgod27Member since 2024
11 months ago

Not surprised when I saw the byline, but I think it’s a shame that we’re inviting people to remember legacies not based on what they did on the field, but on their personal religion and politics.

What a wonderful thing it is that we’ve been able to witness perhaps the greatest starting pitcher ever in a time where we’re fully able to contextualize it – to not only watch every pitch, but to see what each one was, what it did, and why it was so great. I don’t think any other pitch in MLB history is going to have quite the legacy of Clayton Kershaw’s curveball because of it. It’s not based in myth, but permanently on display.

bookbookMember since 2019
11 months ago
Reply to  cashgod27

This isn’t about personal religion. Kershaw chose to make his homophobia part of his Dodgers persona, and a meaningful part of his story as an mlb pitcher. He deserves accolades as a baseball star. He’ll go in the Hall of Fame nearly unanimously, and deservedly so. His flaws are absolutely also relevant.

cashgod27Member since 2024
11 months ago
Reply to  bookbook

I personally don’t see it as anything far beyond him expressing sincerely held religious beliefs

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  cashgod27

As if “religious beliefs” should excuse anything.

We should *not* respect any belief just because it is supposedly a “religious” belief. Nor should all religions be respected. I know someone who was born into a cult where the entire, openly-stated goal is to brainwash and make children submit, physically if necessary. Am I supposed to respect this cult?

And before anyone says “it’s a cult, not a religion,” the only difference between a cult and a religion is number of adherents.

cashgod27Member since 2024
11 months ago
Reply to  drewsylvania

First of all, trashing someone’s religion is not a good way to win an argument.

And second of all, obviously there are some things which are objectively horrible that cannot be excused by religion. I just think you really have to have a bold definition of “horrible” to think Kershaw has done any of those.

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  cashgod27

Point missed, twice.

ichiro262Member since 2024
11 months ago
Reply to  cashgod27

I agree that it’s him expressing his sincerely held religious beliefs. AND I believe that those beliefs are homophobic. Life is complicated, people can believe what they want, and people can (and do) disagree all the time.

But part of the thing is that you don’t have to say what you think all the time. When your deeply held belief is that someone else is bad (or is literally going to hell for the harmless-to-others way they live their life), it’s still dickish to make a point of saying that on the night when they’re celebrating themselves.

cashgod27Member since 2024
11 months ago
Reply to  ichiro262

It’s not just a night we’re they’re celebrating themselves, it’s a night where Kershaw is mandated to wear something in solidarity with a movement he doesn’t support. I guarantee if he wasn’t made to wear the rainbow hat he would not have written anything. And it wasn’t even blatantly offensive, it was just him writing his interpretation of wearing a rainbow hat.

PressXToJason
11 months ago
Reply to  cashgod27

Most players have religious beliefs. Kershaw is one of a handful who have ever specifically made them a big deal to try to get attention on Pride Night, and on multiple occasions, too.

jrla25
11 months ago

A blemish on his career in discord servers. Nobody in reality cares.

Philip ChristyMember since 2016
11 months ago
Reply to  jrla25

I don’t think you understand what the word “reality” means

jrla25
11 months ago
Reply to  Philip Christy

Yeah it’s the real world not article comments. You and Jay can complain about the ovation he gets by 56,000 people tonight and won’t see a single person upset about disliking a weird group of drag nuns 2 years ago.

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  jrla25

Doubled-down derp

Philip ChristyMember since 2016
11 months ago
Reply to  jrla25

Do you think we’re bots or something? Yeah, guess what he’s gonna get the most fans clapping for him at Dodger Stadium, do you consider that fully representative of the real world? Genius-level brain here guy

jrla25
11 months ago
Reply to  Philip Christy

Amusing how important the alphabet cult thinks they are. Nobody outside of left wing comment forms looks at Kershaw in the same light as you

PressXToJason
11 months ago
Reply to  jrla25

The “alphabet cult” just wants to exist. You think they shouldn’t get to exist in public, for even one day, like you do every day.

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  PressXToJason

Exactly this.

The people who respond like jrla25 does, live in a world of privilege and have no bleeping idea.

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  jrla25

There *is no alphabet cult*.

You’re clearly a sick person. Get offline and learn about people.

basically baseballMember since 2024
11 months ago

Nothing more exciting than never having to hear about this homophobic misogynist right wing wacko again.

stealthstephenMember since 2017
11 months ago

Such a great look at a career with such an immensely stupid close to the article. The man won the Roberto Clemente Award and raised millions of dollars for charity who teammates swear by as a fantastic clubhouse presence gets thrown to the side. Instead, the key thing the reader should know about him off the field is the Jay Jaffe finds his Christianity offensive to his sensibilities as a writer. Without even going into the extremely benign nature of the particulars of the two “incidents” Jaffe brings up, this is NOT a Curt Schilling situation. Even the article itself uses the transitive property of blame to say that other people have used the bible verse in a bigoted way and therefore Kershaw must be guilty of doing the same. Just such a waste of what was to that point an excellent Fangraphs style look at a Hall of Fame career.

PressXToJason
11 months ago
Reply to  stealthstephen

There are plenty of wonderful Christian players who don’t have to make themselves the center of attention on Pride Night each year.

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  stealthstephen

Narrator: he did use the bible verse in a bigoted way

Philip ChristyMember since 2016
11 months ago
Reply to  stealthstephen

Very poor reading comprehension bro

ichiro262Member since 2024
11 months ago
Reply to  stealthstephen

I don’t think you’ve read any or Jay’s other write-ups. They’re comprehensive. They look at performance as well as media and off-field stuff when it’s of note. The tone of this article was nothing like those of players who have done seriously bad things.

This is more of a “if he hadn’t gone out of his way to be kinda a dick to gay people on multiple occasions, it wouldn’t be a footnote of his story and it’d be a lot easier to say he’s a really great guy. And that kinda bums me out.”

Nobody’s saying he’s a Schilling or a Rose, or anything like that. It’s just that he expressed his opinions in a kinda classless way, and that’s a little bit lame.

stealthstephenMember since 2017
11 months ago
Reply to  ichiro262

@Ichiro262, I appreciate your response as unlike the others it is a fair critique. I actually have read a bunch of his write ups and really generally like his work and prose, it is just that this one I think really misses the mark in a rather spectacular way. A few reasons for this.

  1. The pieces usually are comprehensive but this one really is not. The reason it is not is it ignores nearly everything about his off the field charitable work that is far above and beyond standard MLB player giving and gives it just one sentence. It includes mission trips, building and maintaining orphanages in Africa, among many other things. He also actually won the Roberto Clemente award which was entirely excluded, however Jay Jaffe’s version of Kershaw’s role in two Pride night events gets a full four paragraphs (His entire postseason career got just two…).
  2. Regarding the full four paragraphs, Jaffe’s versions of what actually happened and Kershaw’s role in the events is not factually accurate. He says that “The Dodgers at first heeded the calls of Kershaw and others to disinvite the Sisters”, yet there actually is not any evidence that Kershaw was among the people who pressured them the first round. It was Marco Rubio and Catholic organizations. Jaffe also says he “Publically pressured” the team to rescind the invite and links to it appears the same article twice, but that just has the quote that he has elsewhere in the article about how he wanted to do Christian Faith and Family Night and wishes they hadn’t invited them, and NOT that he pressured them not to do a 3rd 180 and un-invite them again. So while trying to be “comprehensive” as you put it he actually is making outright errors.
  3. In the second instance we have even more evidence of poor logic to get to his preferred conclusion. Jay Jaffe does in fact use the transitive blame property to say that because a Bible passage has been used in a derogatory way the mere listing it on a Pride Cap therefore must be that as well, saying it is a message of “defiance and intolerance”. That is MILES further than even the True Blue LA piece he quoted goes. The passage is about God not killing everyone via flood again post Noah’s Ark. It makes no reference to sexuality and just discusses what a rainbow means to Christians. And Kershaw choosing NOT to make a statement or a scene about it means that Jay Jaffe is choosing to put the worst possible spin on a situation that he freely admits he doesn’t have evidence from Kershaw about.

In combination, the article takes his small part in a larger two way disaster of a PR issue the Dodgers caused, and one Bible Verse about Noah’s Ark written on a hat, and turns that into a important consideration about him rather than something that you could squint and say deserved a sentence or two that are actually accurate if we are being extremely generous.

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  stealthstephen

Whatever mental gymnastics lets you remain avoidant.

ichiro262Member since 2024
11 months ago
Reply to  stealthstephen

@stealthstephen thanks for the measured response. I agree with some of your points — I think a more balanced article would have spent more words on his charitable work and maybe a few less on the pride night stuff given that there were more words on that than his playoff performance. In fairness though I think that part is longer because it’s more nuanced and he didn’t want to butcher it (you only need a few words to get the point across that he mostly sucked in the playoffs).

And I think it’s fair that someone might disagree with his editorialization on the pride night saga (though I find it to be about right, other than “public pressure” being a bit of a strong word choice for what he did and maybe he only said it once and not twice.

I still think “quoting bible verses at gay people on pride night” is classless — there’s such a dark history of that being a precursor to terrible violence and discrimination. Either he’s living under a rock and had no idea about that, or he kinda knew but felt like it was the right thing to do anyways.

I think a favorable interpretation would be that he’s ignorant but well-meaning. But I think it’s also fair to say he’s made it pretty clear that he believes a whole bunch of Dodgers fans are going to hell for the who they are and the way they were born. Which might be fine to people who believe exactly the same things he does (and it’s absolutely covered legally by freedom of religion and speech), but feels pretty icky to pretty much everyone else.

Last edited 11 months ago by ichiro262
stealthstephenMember since 2017
11 months ago
Reply to  ichiro262

@Ichiro262, I think I was with you to some degree until your last paragraph. Because some Christian groups have said that Gay people are going to hell, you are implying that because Kershaw is Christian he must believe that. But again, that is something he has never said at all. Which brings us back to the transitive property of blame once again. It is very possible to be a Christian and NOT believe that.

Jesus himself literally makes no mention of homosexuality that is recorded in the Bible. And while it is very true that people have used other writings in the Bible as a way to discuss being gay as a sin, even if they are correct (lets be clear I do not believe that they are) in that interpretation, that does not mean Gay people are going to hell given the whole Jesus dying to forgive sins concept that is arguably the central premise of Christianity. So where Kershaw falls on theology would be a question you have to ask him not super impose onto him based on a passage about Noah’s Ark that is about rainbows as a symbol and NOT about being Gay. This seems to be something that Jaffe, yourself, and others in the comments feel is very fair but given more than half of Christians support Gay Marriage feels very unfair to me.

Now to be clear, I understand there is an extremely fraught history here, I just think when you are discussing a specific person’s actions that requires being correct on the specifics, and not super imposing other people’s actions onto them. Both are points Jaffe fails on in this article.

To me the most likely interpretation goes like this:

  1. The Dodgers make a mess out of two 180s around giving an award to a group in the Sisters, who do a lot of good work, but also do some highly controversial things that do appear to be mocking religion (although they claim they are not) as part of their charity work.
  2. Kershaw decides the right response is NOT to pressure the organization to dis-invite them but instead just bring back a previous event that he used to participate in (he does say that he wishes they hadn’t honored the group but as Jaffe does note goes out of his way to say that he does NOT have an issue with the Dodgers doing pride night and it is group specific.
  3. in 2025 the Dodgers take Faith and Family Night away again, and so as a very quiet protest to that, he adds a Bible verse about what the rainbow means to him to his hat. He purposefully does not comment on that as to not throw the organization under the bus or make the situation about him (The True Blue LA piece Jaffe quotes actually does make mention of this as a possibility Jaffe just chose to ignore it).

So the true critique would be that Kershaw, wrongly believes that LGBTQ groups and Christian groups should both get a game, and doesn’t understand that majority groups should not get singled out in a positive way because of historic power imbalances. And also given that, when people do Hunky Jesus competitions or other things that seem to mock his religion even if they are well intentioned, he just needs to “stick to baseball”.

That would not warrant any mention in any other article, certainly no extra editorializing by Jay Jaffe.

PressXToJason
11 months ago
Reply to  stealthstephen

The reason he gets criticized for it is because he only cites the exact verses that the hate groups cite, the ones which say we should be stoned to death. And he only displays them on Pride Night. It’s pointed. His faith is a cudgel.

ichiro262Member since 2024
11 months ago
Reply to  stealthstephen

@stealthstephen some good and fair points here. Didn’t realize they took away the faith and family night in 2025, which definitely adds context to him putting a bible verse on a hat.

I’d argue he could have done that on any night, and that choosing to do it on Pride night sure made it look like he was protesting pride night, not just protesting getting rid of the faith and family night. Or at least that he was connecting the two.

The fact that he connected to certainly places “he has negative attitudes towards LGBTQ+” people as more likely than a random transitive property association. If, for example, he is a Christian who support gay marriage, I think he would have made a public comment about that when he got blowback for the bible verse on the hat.

But also we should pump the brakes on assuming too much about his views, in either a negative or a positive way. Like yeah, Christians believe lots of different things and he’s never said anything that’s proven he believes gay people go to hell.

Again, for me it all comes back to: he uses pride night as an opportunity to quote the bible at LGBTQ+ people. Which I find to be generally shitty. But also maybe it wasn’t intentionally shitty, and he’s had many opportunities to do worse (and hasn’t).

For me, that means I’m not writing or saying anywhere that he’s such an amazing guy on and off the field. And I still think it all makes sense as a footnote to an article about him, especially because I’d imagine a lot of LGBTQ+ Dodgers fans (fairly) feel differently about him after all of it.

But I think it’s also a stretch to say he’s a terrible person, especially when he’s also done meaningful and important charitable work off the field.

norcalblueMember since 2024
11 months ago
Reply to  stealthstephen

thank you for taking the time to write

guyarrigoniMember since 2024
11 months ago

warren spahn=almost 2 kershaws + battle of the bulge and a bridge at remagen in the world (war) baseball classic participation awards?

zekepMember since 2025
11 months ago

Athletes are not role models…and neither are Fangraphs writers; I’m not looking to any ML pitcher or baseball writer for moral guidance, no matter how good of a “person” they or others consider them to be. Perhaps we should keep it simple and just celebrate his illustrious work ethic and performance as a ML pitcher, period. Thats why I pay for a membership – but I won’t for much longer if Jay and others feel the need to lecture me on which players are bad guys because they hold differing values.

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  zekep

You imply that values are equal morally. They aren’t.

zekepMember since 2025
11 months ago
Reply to  drewsylvania

No…I’m not implying anything about the morality of any values, and to answer some others here who invoke the “morality clause” in the HoF voting I’ll offer this: most commenting here and the “average fan” has zero idea of the values that drive elite MLB players, namely an insane and likely unhealthy amount of competitiveness mixed with some level of narcissism. So…as I said earlier, personally (disagree with me as you will), I don’t need or want moral advice/debate/analysis from Fangraphs or any other baseball website. Kershaw is arguably the greatest pitcher of his generation and perhaps of all-time. Let’s celebrate THAT, and all of the sweat and blood every 5 days, 18 seasons, and the drive and determination that went into that. Period.

PressXToJason
11 months ago
Reply to  zekep

It’s not “differing values” – plenty, probably a large majority, of MLB players are surely anti-LGBTQ+ – but that his public “values” are that some of us should not get to live as who we are. He cites the same verses as those who say gay people should be stoned to death. And that’s not an accident. The Bible is full of life-affirming passages. But he and his ilk never mention those, because his only beliefs are that others should have to live the way he wants them to.

ichiro262Member since 2024
11 months ago
Reply to  zekep

Jay is a hall of fame expert. Hall of fame voting guidelines include a character clause which is frequently invoked (if mostly for cheating and fringe candidates).

So when he’s writing about a player’s HOF credentials, I think giving color to who they are as a person and what notable non-baseball moments they’ve had is super relevant. It also makes the pieces more human and less just a collection of numbers.

In Kershaw’s case, he talked about the positive non-baseball things (his charitable efforts and speaking out on racial injustice). And he also talked about a few times he’s made Pride night at Dodgers stadium all about himself in a way that’s controversial at best and bigoted at worst.

I think some of y’all are just SO sensitive about reading anything you don’t agree with. Really shouldn’t be a big deal.

Lanidrac
11 months ago

I think it’s just as newsworthy that Justin Verlander has announced that he intends to continue pitching next year.

PhilMember since 2016
11 months ago
Reply to  Lanidrac

I assume he signs with the Orioles to complete the “Teams in Orange” set.

(Though player retiring is obviously more newsworthy that player continuing to be a player.)

elisbedwynn
11 months ago

Kershaw’s greatest crime, evidently, is actually taking his faith seriously, rather than wear it as an accessory. The Bible, to the true believer, isn’t a cafeteria buffet that allows you to pick and choose your preferred moral lessons. To affirm that is effectively to worship yourself, because it requires no conviction, no change. Rather, to the true believer, it’s an attestation of the actual works of God in history. This is a hard thing that cuts against the sensibilities of modern people, whose highest level of moral insight is generally: “just be nice.” And so it’s preposterous to writers like Mr. Jaffe that one can, on the one hand, disavow a particular lifestyle, for particular reasons, and on the other not harbor any hateful feelings towards its practitioners. And really, in failing to see or accept the distinction, it reveals one’s own hatred of Christians.

For a community that prides itself on analytics, and understanding the hidden game of baseball, I would encourage anyone that would like to apply the same approach to ancient literature, (and how it differs in its metaphysics to modern literature), to read the book “Through New Eyes” by James Jordan. It’s not enough to read the Bible and judge it by the standards of modern people two thousand years removed from its writing. Ancient people saw the world very differently than modern people. Even modern Christians fail to articulate what they only intuit while reading the Bible. Mr. Jordan does a good job cutting through the noise.

StuSheaMember since 2018
11 months ago
Reply to  elisbedwynn

Actually, like most Christians, he DOES pick and choose what he believes from the Bible.

sadtromboneMember since 2020
11 months ago
Reply to  StuShea

I would be stunned if there was anyone out there who didn’t. Do you know how complicated your life would be if you did? Even if you assume that each and every religion isn’t a knot of contradictions (which they are, despite heavy editing and commentary to try to make it not so) you would be so weighed down with behavioral restrictions and unusual beliefs you couldn’t function in the modern world.

I mean, I have met people who try and they basically can’t hold a steady job. It’s the equivalent of a full-time job to make sense of it all, much less actually do it.

StuSheaMember since 2018
11 months ago
Reply to  sadtrombone

I’m not sure that what you’ve written doesn’t actually make Kershaw seem worse. So he picks the parts of the Bible that are about judging others? How very like Jesus.

sadtromboneMember since 2020
11 months ago
Reply to  StuShea

I’m re-reading what I wrote, and I don’t think what I wrote is relevant to the broader conversation, just to your specific point. So I probably shouldn’t have written it.

I think the whole thing of sincerely held religious beliefs is a distraction anyway. People want to defend free expression during a baseball game but then declare a discussion of that expression off limits. It’s not like we are snooping around in his text messages or anything.

Cool Lester SmoothMember since 2020
11 months ago
Reply to  StuShea

And he opts out of the “Love and Acceptance” parts.

Adam SMember since 2016
11 months ago

Obviously many people don’t like it, but it would be totally irresponsible to write about a player’s career and ignore any controversy around him, especially if it happened in the context of the baseball season, if not literally on the field.
It would be like writing about Bonds and ignoring steroids because nothing has been proven and he was never suspended.

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago

We are profoundly, unbelievably, sick and tired of the ignorance and hate. At the same time, Kershaw undoubtedly had an amazing career. Thank you, Jay, for standing up.

keenejMember since 2024
11 months ago

It’s hard for me to get too angry with Kershaw. It is uncomfortable but ballplayers are generally a conservative lot, so I find it unsurprising Kershaw has spoken out. He is not alone in that regard. He’s toed the line between “respectfully disagreeable” to “disrespectful.” I find it hard to believe he’s not bigoted towards non-cis, non-straight people, but until I have definitive proof I’ll choose to believe he’s just quite devout.

StuSheaMember since 2018
11 months ago
Reply to  keenej

Why not both?

johansantana17Member since 2026
11 months ago

Best pitcher ever and will forever be my favorite athlete. Congrats Kershaw!

CheeseballMember since 2016
11 months ago

A 4 paragraph excursion into the culture wars?

https://xkcd.com/386/

drewsylvaniaMember since 2019🏆 MVP
11 months ago
Reply to  Cheeseball

It’s that, but these days it’s also about the vast enablement of people trying to erase other people for the “crime” of trying to live. We have an obligation to oppose that, and it’s a higher leverage game these days.