Oakland Acquires Improbable, Inevitable Future MVP in Trade

In January of this year, the author of this post, following some statistical perambulations, arrived at the conclusion that Max Schrock, a 13th-round selection out of the University of South Carolina during the most recent (2015) draft, would someday win an MVP award. The basis for that conclusion: no SEC batter in 2015 had produced numbers more similar to Josh Donaldson’s — during Donaldson’s own final year as a collegiate player (also in the SEC) — than Schrock. And Donaldson himself had just collected an MVP award in the American League. So, by a very liberal application of the transitive property, I concluded that Schrock would as well.

There were, of course, a number of reasons to suppose that Max Schrock would not win an MVP award in the major leagues. There remain a number of reasons. Chief among them is probably this: the best player of the current era — and possibly any one’s era ever — has received only one MVP award during his first four seasons in the majors and faces a non-negligible chance of extending that record to one in five years. If Mike Trout is capable of just a 20% conversion rate on MVP awards, everyone else’s chances are dramatically lower.

Moreover, there’s the matter of Schrock himself. Because, here’s a type of prospect who rarely develops into a perennial MVP candidate: a 5-foot-8 hitter. And here’s another kind: an infielder who’s incapable of playing a competent shortstop. And here’s a third sort: a player who’s selected in the 13th round. How many 5-foot-8, 13th-round second basemen have been recognized as their respective league’s best? I lack the requisite ambition to perform the search. But none seems like a reasonable answer. Let’s assume none or somewhere close to none. Indeed, even Josh Donaldson, whose ascent to stardom is regarded as improbable, is a former first-round selection. And features physical attributes that suggest the ability to hit for power. And offered, as a young player, the possibility of defensive value as a catcher. (And continues to offer it as a markedly above-average third baseman.) Schrock possesses none of these redeeming qualities.

But ever since that mid-winter’s post celebrating Schrock’s virtues, he’s acquitted himself almost perfectly, first recording the lowest strikeout rate among all Low-A batters and, more recently, recording almost the lowest strikeout rate among High-A batters — while also producing a roughly league-average isolated-power figure at both levels. That combination of extreme contact and satisfactory power — combined with the capacity to occupy a place on the more challenging end of the defensive spectrum — is a deceptively valuable one. Players who’ve paired those skills at the major-league level have been almost uniformly helpful.

What do those major-league seasons look like? Regard, a table featuring all the qualified players over the first half of this decade who recorded an elite strikeout rate (under 11%, in this case, which accounts for roughly 10% of batters each year) and exhibited roughly league-average power (.130-.160 ISO) and produced a positive positional adjustment. Note: catchers have been excluded because their positional adjustment renders them otherly.

Max Schrock Comparables, 2011-15?
Name Team Season PA K% ISO wRC+ Pos WAR
Jose Reyes Mets 2011 586 7.0% .156 142 5.6 5.9
Robinson Cano Mariners 2014 665 10.2% .139 137 1.4 5.2
Ian Kinsler Tigers 2014 726 10.9% .145 103 2.4 5.2
Jose Altuve Astros 2015 689 9.7% .146 123 2.2 4.5
Andrelton Simmons Braves 2013 658 8.4% .149 91 7.0 4.5
Dustin Pedroia Red Sox 2012 623 9.6% .160 114 1.9 4.5
Jose Reyes Marlins 2012 716 7.8% .146 110 7.3 4.1
Jimmy Rollins Phillies 2011 631 9.4% .131 103 6.1 3.6
Ian Kinsler Rangers 2013 614 9.6% .136 104 0.7 2.6
Martin Prado D-backs 2013 664 8.0% .135 104 0.8 1.9
Average 9.1% .144 113 3.5 4.2
*Excludes catchers.
**Also possibly excludes reason.

I don’t feel comfortable declaring that a solid campaign by Martin Prado represents Max Schrock’s floor. Although, to be fair, I don’t feel comfortable doing anything else, either. And, to continue being fair, it’s important to note that, however authoritative this table renders the conclusions it renders, it’s merely one form of prospect-related alchemy. Upon whatever method one relies for analyzing/projecting prospects, it’s still difficult to identify which good prospects will actually become good players.

You Aren't a FanGraphs Member
It looks like you aren't yet a FanGraphs Member (or aren't logged in). We aren't mad, just disappointed.
We get it. You want to read this article. But before we let you get back to it, we'd like to point out a few of the good reasons why you should become a Member.
1. Ad Free viewing! We won't bug you with this ad, or any other.
2. Unlimited articles! Non-Members only get to read 10 free articles a month. Members never get cut off.
3. Dark mode and Classic mode!
4. Custom player page dashboards! Choose the player cards you want, in the order you want them.
5. One-click data exports! Export our projections and leaderboards for your personal projects.
6. Remove the photos on the home page! (Honestly, this doesn't sound so great to us, but some people wanted it, and we like to give our Members what they want.)
7. Even more Steamer projections! We have handedness, percentile, and context neutral projections available for Members only.
8. Get FanGraphs Walk-Off, a customized year end review! Find out exactly how you used FanGraphs this year, and how that compares to other Members. Don't be a victim of FOMO.
9. A weekly mailbag column, exclusively for Members.
10. Help support FanGraphs and our entire staff! Our Members provide us with critical resources to improve the site and deliver new features!
We hope you'll consider a Membership today, for yourself or as a gift! And we realize this has been an awfully long sales pitch, so we've also removed all the other ads in this article. We didn't want to overdo it.

For the moment, however, what Oakland has done it to trade away a left-handed reliever for a promising young player. And it seems unlikely that believing said young player will become an MVP has any chance of materially hurting anyone.





Carson Cistulli has published a book of aphorisms called Spirited Ejaculations of a New Enthusiast.

35 Comments
Oldest
Newest Most Voted
Adam Bragman
10 years ago

Lotta cajones calling anyone a future MVP. I like it.

t
10 years ago
Reply to  Adam Bragman

You know who isn’t a future MVP? Mylz Jones.

phoenix2042Member since 2016
10 years ago

I feel that this occasion warrants Carson metaphorically putting his money where his mouth is; if Schrock does ever win an MVP award, Carson should be honor-bound to… do something. Go on, Cistulli, make a wager!

MustBunique
10 years ago
Reply to  phoenix2042

If Schrock does win an MVP, each of us donates $1 to this site on the internets. If he doesn’t, Carson donates the opposite of $1, which perhaps could be a dirt dauber, to the exact opposite site of this one, through regular mail.

TimothyMember since 2016
10 years ago

Saw the headline, was 100% sure this was a Cistulli article.

TrevorCap
10 years ago

So since the A’s have gone after Semien, Cotton, and now Shrock, will you finally admit that you, Carson Cistulli, are secretly a member of Billy Beane’s inner circle and are advising him on potential trade candidates?

baltic wolfMember since 2016
10 years ago
Reply to  TrevorCap

Lmao! Yeah, you’ve got him cornered now and he has no choice but to ‘fess up!

whobob
10 years ago
Reply to  baltic wolf

The A’s have eliminated scouting from their budget, replaced it with FanGraphs.

Dooduh
10 years ago

He’s a little. Analysis I would want to see if the history of players 5’8″ or less in the game. Guessing that over the past 50 years, we could count on one hand the number of players 5’8″ or less who’ve accumulated more than 5 fWar in their careers.

Brian ReinhartMember since 2016
10 years ago
Reply to  Dooduh

1. Quite a few players 5’8″ or less have had successful careers. Jimmy Rollins, Dustin Pedroia, Jose Altuve, Joe Morgan, Pudge, David Eckstein. There are 5 Hall of Famers at 5’6″ and a total of 14 guys in the Hall at 5’7″ or under.

2. Your phrasing “he’s a little” is strange given what it means to be “a little”: “Used to describe someone who roleplays as an age younger than they are in a BDSM dynamic.”

carterMember since 2020
10 years ago
Reply to  Brian Reinhart

My sister is the executive producer for Little People, Big World and that is also how they refer to people there. They say, “He’s a little”, which is actually endearing in the little people world.

Beer
10 years ago
Reply to  Brian Reinhart

Guess we should have been calling you the Well-Versed Englishman…

ChippersJonesing
10 years ago

I thought of Carson Cistulli when I read the name Max Schrock; it’s possible I spend too much time on this website. 😐

Viva MontenegroMember since 2016
10 years ago

He’s no Mylz Jones though.

clance
10 years ago

Small second basemen without much draft pedigree who becomes an mvp candidate? Sounds an awful lot like mookie betts although he’s doing it as an outfielder but only out of necessity. There’s one example right there

Concerned Reader John
10 years ago
Reply to  clance

Mookie Betts is a Fringe Five alumnus.

CJ03
10 years ago

yes but how long until they trade him to the Blue Jays?

Joshua Miller
10 years ago

5’8, two-bagger, MVP…Dustin Pedroia

DoyersFan
10 years ago

Feels like current Mike Trout is like post-shaq/pre-pau Kobe Bryant. Clearly the best player but awful team keeps costing him the MVP’s he deserves

Concerned Reader John
10 years ago
Reply to  DoyersFan

More like Shaq. Clearly the best but not recognized as such by dumb sportswriters.

LHPSU
10 years ago

Shaq had a major weakness. Mike Trout doesn’t.

ShauncoreMember since 2019
10 years ago

Working in Shrock/Cistulli’s favor: after the upcoming award, 50% of all the AL MVP’s since 2015 have played in the A’s organization at one point

Aaron
10 years ago

I feel like I have no idea what percentage of fangraphs readers share my obsession with Carson Cistulli.

JamesFanMember since 2018
10 years ago

“If Mike Trout is capable of just a 20% conversion rate on MVP awards, everyone else’s chances are dramatically lower.”

I disagree. If Mike Trout actually had a 100% conversion rate (justifiably so), then everyone would else would have a ZERO chance of winning. Schrock only has any chance BECAUSE Mike Trout isn’t always being picked.

Math – mutually exclusive events…

victorvran
10 years ago
Reply to  JamesFan

this was my thought. I think that anyone has a better chance of winning an mvp in their career if the best player in the league isn’t always awarded it

OddBall Herrera
10 years ago
Reply to  JamesFan

I may be missing something here, but the statement reads to me that ‘if even Trout only gets it 20% of the time, all the other (presumably inferior) players’ odds must be lower than that. Makes sense to me.

JamesFanMember since 2018
10 years ago

If you assume that all the odds of all players in the American League add up to 100%, then you LOWER ALL OF THEM, it won’t equal 100% any more.

Since the odds of having an MVP are 100%, by artificially lowering the best player’s odds, you are by default artificially increasing everybody else’s odds because the total still has to equal 100%.

Walter
10 years ago
Reply to  JamesFan

This makes way to much sense for a comments section, even a fangraphs one.

TwinPeaks
10 years ago
Reply to  JamesFan

Trout ends up not winning because Miggy needed an MVP and Trout was a rookie his first year. Miggy had an insane year Trout’s 2nd year, and I really have no idea why he didn’t win last year other than that the Angels suck.

The year Trout actually won the MVP was his worst year statistically!

baltic wolfMember since 2016
10 years ago

What I can’t figure out is how they come up with the defensive numbers for players like Ty Cobb, Arky Vaughn, Joe Jackson, Sherry Magee, et al.

In that link that Cistulli provided labeled in bold as “and possibly any one’s era ever” it will show you how some of these great players ranked defensively. But how did they arrive at these numbers? Was there sufficient footage through newsreel films of their games to come up with these numbers or are they relying on the testimony and memories of players from those eras? Obviously videotapes of games didn’t exist back then.

whobob
10 years ago

So basically, Max Schrock will be just another obstacle in preventing the best player of our current era from getting the MVP.

pmagner11
10 years ago

5-8 2B as MVP? Jose Altuve is 5-6.

CJ03
10 years ago
Reply to  pmagner11

That means he’s 2 inches more likely to be MVP, right?

Mustachioed Scout
10 years ago
Reply to  CJ03

Unfortunately, it means that he has far too much physical projection and will likely flame out of baseball.

Tooele Dave
10 years ago

So the moral of the story is that Max Schrock either will or will not win an MVP. I support this 100%.