Pat Venditte Arrives
The A’s and Red Sox are both last-place teams so perhaps you weren’t riveted to your screen Friday night when the two met for the first of a three-game set in Boston. If not, you missed the major-league debut of a 29-year-old relief pitcher. Your life is undoubtedly sadder now. But have no fear because you’ve stumbled upon this here article which will fill you in on said 29-year-old relief pitcher. Settle in for some fun!
We’re not in the habit here at FanGraphs (or, really, anywhere else) of cataloguing the debuts of old relievers, but this one is odd enough to be special. Pat Venditte threw his first major-league pitch Friday night left-handed. It was to Brock Holt the first batter he faced. Then, after Holt grounded out to first base, he threw the first pitch to Hanley Ramirez, the second batter he faced, right-handed. That’s because Pat Venditte is a switch pitcher.
We can start off with this:
That’s the last switch-pitcher, Greg Harris. So, you know, this stuff isn’t easy. Unlike Harris, Venditte has been switch-pitching his whole life so he can actually throw it to the catcher with both arms! But actually, he’s even better than that.
Switch-pitching is a unique skill, but not so much that Venditte was rushed to the majors. The Yankees picked him in the 45th round of the 2007 draft. He didn’t sign, so they picked him again next year, this time in the 20th round. He started his career with the Brooklyn Cyclones Staten Island Yankees and, internet famously, faced a hitter named Nick Giarraputo. Giarraputo was a right-handed hitter so Venditte faced him right-handed. Giarraputo singled and that brought up Ralph Henriquez. Henriquez is, of course, of course, of course, a switch-hitter. So the next seven minutes of the game were basically this:
Eventually either Henriquez got bored of walking back and forth or the umpires made the decision for him, but eventually he batted right-handed and Venditte pitched right-handed. This episode, and many future episodes like it, led to the Pat Venditte Rule which says the pitcher must visually indicate with which arm he is going to throw and then the batter may pick from which side to hit. It should be called the Anti-Venditte Rule.
Still, early on in his career Venditte had his own rule, which is kinda neat. He didn’t have much more than that, though. You might think, with the kind of conviction it takes to draft a guy twice, that the Yankees would be excited about him. If so, they barely showed it. New York made him really earn each minor-league promotion, and despite his minor-league success (a career 10.0 K/9 and 4.00 K/BB) it’s not hard to guess why. It’s because Venditte doesn’t throw hard from either side. He’s an upper-80s guy if he rears back, but mostly he’s in the mid-to-upper 80s, 86, 87 mph, and guys like that need to prove it at every level. If Venditte could throw 95 but walked the park from both sides he’d likely have been taken far more seriously as a prospect. But he didn’t, so it took three years for Venditte to stick at Double-A and two more after that to reach Triple-A. He was, at that point, 27. Along the way he suffered a right shoulder injury but rather than become a full-time southpaw he rehabbed and returned as, well, Pat Venditte. He did pitch through the injury as a lefty though.
Last off-season he became a free agent and signed with the A’s. Because of course. I hope someone is writing a script for this. Brad Pitt can reprise his role as Billy Beane and Paul Rudd can play Venditte in Ambidextrousball. Someone figure out a role for Chris Pratt, quick!
After 33 innings with Triple-A Nashville to start 2015, Venditte got called up. He pitched two innings in Friday’s 4-2 loss in Boston and then faced Dustin Pedroia to close out the Boston eighth after the Oakland bullpen had set Sunday’s game afire. Watching Venditte during those outings you can see why scouts would be reticent to believe in his stuff. First of all, he’s the same pitcher as… himself. He throws the same speed, roughly, from both sides. He might have an extra mph or two from the right side but mostly he’s not going to be called a hard thrower from either side. He has strong control with both arms, which you’d expect from someone with his velocity at the major-league level, but even so his margin of error isn’t much. Aroldis Chapman can miss his spots with regularity and still get batters out because he throws 103 mph. Pat Venditte can’t miss his spots with any regularity or he’ll be back in Nashville.
Here’s what he looks like from both sides.
In addition to having the platoon advantage whenever he isn’t facing a switch-hitter, Venditte throws sidearm, with arm action almost parallel to the ground. It’s easy to see how this would be difficult to face for a same-sided batter. Red Sox broadcaster Jerry Remy indicated he thought Venditte dropped down further from the left side than he does from the right but despite repeated viewing I wasn’t able to discern whether that’s true or not. Either way, Venditte is like a LOOGY and a ROOGY in one package. In fact, that’s exactly what he his.
His out pitch is a slurvey curveball. I’ve seen it referred to as a slider but he generally throws the pitch in the low 70s which is usually curveball territory (sliders are thrown harder). What’s more, he throws it the same from both sides. It’s from about the same arm angle as his fastball though the snap alters the arm action during the release, but both the fastball and curve are thrown from the side. This gives the curve a wide break across the plate, with more horizontal movement than vertical.
Venditte had some success against Boston hitters, retiring seven of the eight he faced. He did give up some hard contact — a fly ball to right field off the bat of Mookie Betts springs to mind — but nothing crushed or lined too hard. Also he got a bunch of ground balls, which came in handy after a Hanley Ramirez ground-ball single during his first inning of work. He then induced Mike Napoli to ground to second base. It began a double play that got Venditte out of the inning. In addition to strikeouts at the minor-league level, Venditte was quite adept at getting grounders, a skill that will serve him well in the majors, especially if his strikeouts don’t fully translate.
Venditte is a novelty, and is fun to watch, but he’s unlikely to be a force in pen. He can get outs as he has showed in his two appearances, and it won’t get old watching him switch his glove to the opposite hand to face a new batter, but his margin for error will always be extremely low, even with the platoon advantage 90 percent of the time. Still, there are guys who carve out good major-league careers with similar stuff, and Venditte has twice their similar stuff so maybe he can stick around. We should be so lucky.
I’m not positive, but I believe he was originally throwing from a higher arm slot on his right side prior to his shoulder injury, but then dropped down to the same slot he has on his left to simplify things somewhat.
He also threw significantly harder from the right side before his injury. He was at 90-93 regularly with a high-3/4 slot. Now, as Kory correctly states, he’s at about the same 85-88 with both arms.
Nice summary. I’ll be rooting for Venditte’s career, because he can pitch with both hands at an elite level, which is amazing.
Something related that was brought up in the Sunday Notes comments: why does the Venditte Rule require the pitcher to declare a hand first, rather than the batter? Has anyone ever heard an explanation?
My guess is that it’s simply because switch-hitters are common and have always enjoyed the platoon advantage, and so MLB decided not to change that for some switch-pitching anomaly.
Another interesting thing about Venditte is that we’ll want to analyze/project him totally separately right-handed and left-handed.
We should be keeping track of velocity / pitch type / plate discipline / heat map numbers totally separate for each hand. He could lose velocity or get an arm injury or lose the feel for his curve with one hand, but be totally fine with the other. His right arm has more mileage on it than his left, so maybe his left arm will have a longer career. Do the coaches/trainers maintain separate pitch count and usage logs for the two arms?
My baby brother switched arms when he hit his pitch count in Little League a couple years ago, so I assume they must.
Seems legit. TIL the A’s pitching coach moonlights as a little league coach for babies.
“Something related that was brought up in the Sunday Notes comments: why does the Venditte Rule require the pitcher to declare a hand first, rather than the batter? Has anyone ever heard an explanation?”
It’s consistent with typical pinch-hitters / relief pitchers. You choose the pitcher and then the team decides whether or not to pinch-hit for that batter. The pitcher has to pitch to that batter, you can’t go back to the bullpen.
Same idea with this.
It seems to me that the reason for that rule is the delay in game. It takes a lot of time to get a new pitcher in the game and ready to go. It takes a few seconds to get a new batter in the box. So if the offense announces a pinch-hitter, then the defense brings in a new pitcher, then the offense brings in a substitute pinch-hitter, no problem. Let the manager waste a bench player if he wants. But not the other way around, because it takes too much time.
That’s not the case with Venditte. Venditte can swap his glove from hand to hand as quickly as a switch-hitter can hop between sides of the plate.
He can probably switch faster because the hitter needs to go back to the dugout to get a replacement helmet, as we saw Blake Swihart do after a miscommunication in the first opportunity for the Venditte rule to take effect.
There were complaints, of course, that MLB, switch hitters, their agents, etc, were intentionally hamstringing Venditte. They wanted the rule to be changed so that Venditte only had to get into a “set” position on the mound, rather than telling the batter what he was going to throw with.
That would force the Hitter into the batter’s box since the rules have always stated a batter cannot switch boxes in the middle of a pitch.
Venditte was slated to learn to throw from a neutral position where he had his glove and the ball in both hands, ready to go into a wind up in either direction. If the hitter stepped out or called timeout then, the Hitter, not the Pitcher, is delaying the game.
Pace-of-play were under discussion at the time, and the Yankees were well aware that by the time it came into effect, Venditte would be well on his way in the Majors.
After all, the batter is not allowed to refuse to get in the batter’s box to extort the pitcher for information – whether it be his arm angle, the type of pitch, its location, etc.
All of that was shelved once Venditte got blind-sided by a Rule which – let’s be honest – doesn’t make sense until you realize that the Rule has nothing to do with pace-of-play and everything to do with how labor-relations and business works in the MLB.
Because the agents of MLB switch-hitters and MLB officials and marketers saw Venditte as a threat to them down the line.
The original idea with Venditte was that he would learn to hold his glove and ball in a neutral position on the mound – neither left nor right – then slip it on quickly in his wind-up motion, similar to what Jim Abbott did – though it would be much easier for Venditte considering Abbott slipped his glove on AFTER he delivered a pitch (and Abbott was born without a right hand).
Needless to say, Venditte was slated to be a unique weapon against switch-hitters who were not used to seeing same-side pitchers.
They couldn’t very well demand that he declare
The problem?
Venditte didn’t have multi-millionaire advocates already in the MLB system. Current MLBers and officials, needless to say, protect their current client interests. Seriously, what chance did Venditte have against Boras, Tanzer, Selig, and the like? Venditte had no representation, and switch hitters were far more numerous and lucrative clients than a lone switch pitcher.
So once Venditte was drafted and signed by the Yankees, the Anti-Venditte rule came down pretty quick. The incident with the first switch-hitter and the rationalization of pace-of-play was just a farce to put some plausibility be3hind the rule.
Because when you think about it, the rule doesn’t make any sense. Why should the pitcher have to TELL the switch hitter what hand he’s going to throw with? Why can’t Venditte just get on the mound in a neutral position, have the hitter get in the batter’s box, and then start his wind-up with a seamless slip of the glove like Jim Abbott? Only Venditte would have it easier than Abbott – albeit he was starting learning the move a little later.
If the Hitter steps out in the middle of the pitcher’s motion and calls time, it is the hitter that is delaying the game.
Why is the rule written in such a way as to prevent Venditte from using his superior talent?
It may not seem fair, but it’s just the business reality: Switch-hitters and their agents (and the agents of future switch hitters) were simply terrified of Venditte and what he might have signified. It is not a mistake, I think, that future would-be switch pitchers will wonder if it’s worth going to the trouble of learning to switch-pitch considering there is so little reward – despite the immeasureable talent it takes to accomplish it.
If Venditte announces he is throwing Right, then the team throws in a pinch hitter, can he switch? What if it is mid-at bat and there is an injury to the batter?
I believe the rule is that he declares when the batter is announced. So pinch-hitting doesn’t change anything. I also believe he’s allowed to change arms once per at-bat (and the batter is allowed to switch sides). Not sure the purpose of that rule, but maybe it’s to take into account a mid-at-bat injury to the batter or Venditte.
“The pitcher is not permitted to pitch with the other hand until the batter is retired, the batter becomes a runner, the inning ends, the batter is substituted for by a pinch-hitter or the pitcher incurs an injury.”
So he could switch in the middle of an at bat only if he one of his arms is injured or if the batter is switched.
And then the injured arm is out of the game – he can declare his right arm hurt mid-AB, and finish said AB lefty, but he can’t go back to the right arm the rest of the game.
Correction: He started his career with the Staten Island Yankees, against the Brooklyn Cyclones. The Cyclones are the Mets farm team in the NY-Penn League. I wish the Yanks had given him a September call-up. Also I hope FanGraphs will track Venditte’s splits pitching as both a righty and a lefty.
Darn it! That’s true and I knew that (I’ve written about Venditte before). Apologies for the error.
One would think that durability would be good for him, less mileage on each arm. Also, he might take twice as long to warm up in the bullpen.
I wonder if his control is affected in he pitches from one side for several batters, and then has to switch to the other side? Pretty sure he wouldn’t get any additional warm-up throws for that situation and opposing managers have considered exploiting it.
FYI, the battle against Henriquez came when Venditte was pitching for the Staten Island Yankees. He was never a Brooklyn Cyclone, they are a Mets farm team.
If the situation demanded (ie injuries or trades) I wonder if the A’s would be brave enough to use him as a closer? The one unique thing about a closer (once you remove all the psychobabble BS) is that the closer doesn’t get pulled for a platoon advantage. Everybody else in the bullpen may get yanked, but (epic meltdowns aside) the closer is in there for the duration of the 9th no matter which way the batters are batting. A pitcher with no platoon disadvantage is thus an interesting closer candidate. Of course, that’s not the only requirement, and Venditte’s small margin for error would give most managers ulcers when protecting a one-run lead. But for the rest of us, wouldn’t it be fun?
No good reliever gets pulled for platoon advantage, closer or otherwise.
They’re not going to yank Betances, or Wade Davis, or Osuna, or Carson Smith until either they get into trouble, or their inning is over.
The only reason it never happens to the closer is that the closer is, with the occasional exception of a 1996 Mariano Rivera or a 2014 Dellin Betances, unequivocally the best reliever on the team. Only middle relievers get pulled for platoon advantage.
If he’s lights out against both righties and lefties, maybe. But there may be a legitimate concern about his ability to remain effective with TWO different deliveries, and he might not get too many chances to fail as a closer.
I think ultimately his best role is to be used like a top-notch lefty specialist, but with the chance to face more batters. His ability to switch sides means you neutralize the other team’s ability to send in a right pinch-hitter, which is the downfall of so many pure LOOGYs. If Venditte pitches well, a manager would love to have a guy like that pitching 100 or so innings of middle relief per year.
Yeah, the guy’s got almost no shot at being a closer. He really just doesn’t have the stuff for it.
His goal is almost certainly to be both Mike Myers and Chad Bradford, and that’d help him last a long, long time in this league, which would be fucking awesome.
This guy is a minor league journey man and you are already talking about platoon advantage closer? Do you realize the A’s signed him as a minor league free agent? which means the Yankees did not want part of him no longer? This guy is exciting because he can switch pitch, but that’s all, he might not stick in the big leagues very long.
Yeah. No way in hell he’ll ever become a closer.
Fortunately Pat’s not in that flaming underground detention league. As far as up in the MLB goes, does the name Stu Miller mean anything to you? I’ve often wondered why Pat hasn’t been stretched out into being a starter. Just consider the idea of
Cy Young award winner Randy Jones in stereo.
I’m so, so glad that Venditte made the majors. He’s something that it’s entirely possible no one will see for the next 50 or 100 years.
It’s only been 20 years since Greg Harris.
Greg Harris threw something like 6,000 pitches right handed and 3 left handed, all of the latter in his final season.
Greg Harris threw left-handed for one inning. Because he wanted to for fun, and the season was already lost, and his manager said “why the hell not?”. He did not do it because anyone thought it was an effective tactic.
Also, Greg Harris threw like a girl left handed.
If he is facing a non switch-hitter, does he have to throw with one hand the entire at-bat or can he throw with both hands? You would think if the batter is not going to change his stance that it would not cause an issue right? I would think that even if a hitter mashes one hand it could be a complete mind-f*** to have a pitcher throw from opposite hands in consecutive pitches. So much guessing as to what they will throw and it would look so different from the last pitch.
I cited the rule above. He can only switch hands in the middle of an at-bat if Venditte gets an arm injury (then he’s disqualified from using that arm the rest of the game), or if the batter gets substituted.
I hope Venditte sticks around. I had a what-if question. I’ve thought about this for a long time. What if there was an elite starting pitcher who can switch pitch? I was wondering what is the best way to use him? Would it better to have him use both arms during a start OR have him pitch one game with one arm and the next game with the other arm? In the latter situation can such a pitcher make perhaps 50-55 starts per season?
The arm isn’t the only part of the body that gets fatigued. I really doubt he could pitch every three days, like you suggest.
The only reason Venditte is effective is because of the platoon advantage. If he had to regularly face lefties with his right hand, or vice versa, his stuff is so mediocre he’d probably never would’ve been drafted nevermind make the majors. So by having him throw a whole start with one arm, you’re kind of defeating the purpose of Pat Venditte.
All that, and what Eric the Clown said.
I wasn’t referring to Venditte. I was referring to an ELITE STARTING pitcher who could switch pitch. How would he best be used? I’m talking about a starting pitcher who was All-Star caliber with both arms. As for pitching on 3 days rest, pitchers of previous generations pitched on 3 days rest all the time.
My bad. Reading comprehension fail.
I find it hard to believe anyone could become so effective with both arms. But even so, I think the entire purpose of switch-pitching is to exploit the platoon advantage. You’re suggesting instead using it as a way to get more innings out of a guy. When was the last time you saw any trend in baseball towards maximizing how much a guy gets used? Things always move towards specialization and less usage, particularly with pitchers.
He actually has an advantage over most switch hitters as well given they are usually stronger from one side so Venditte can force them to their weaker side.
I have a feeling he will tend towards throwing right handed unless special circumstances arise because it’s his dominant, more accurate side and he throws harder.
I think the Venditte rule is totally backwards.
A batter should have to pick a side first, and then the pitcher should throw however he wants. Making a pitcher declare what arm he’s going to use ahead of the pitch takes part of the advantage he might have out, and frankly, makes the game less interesting.
In the original instance that spawned the rule, it wasn’t Venditte causing the delay. It takes him all of two seconds to switch gloves. But a hitter might need a different helmet, a different foot/elbow protector, etc.
Why would you want to give more advantage to the player who’s already expected to win the matchup? Even the best hitters are expected to make outs about 60% of the time.
Also, you mention taking away part of the switch-pitcher’s advantage, but how is that any different than taking away a switch-hitter’s advantage?
The rule is to prevent delay of game situations, right? It takes him 5 seconds to switch gloves. The rule already prevents him from getting warm up pitches when he switches arms (completely agree with that part of the rule), so the amount of delay caused by Venditte would be very minimal.
The batter on the other hand might need a different helmet, different protective gear, and has to physically move sides of the plate, all of which is more time consuming. A switch hitter could still pick which side he wants, he should just do it ahead of the pitcher.
Also, what would happen if the pitcher squares up w/o a glove on his hand in a fashion where the batter can’t tell which way he’ll pitch?
The pitcher has to visually declare to the umpires, the batter, and the runners which side he’ll pitch from before each at bat. The MLB made sure to remove the possibility of a miscommunication.
What possibility of miscommunication? Is there anything functionally different between a lefty and a right throwing a pitch?
I don’t know why you think that a switch-hitter needs different equipment facing different pitchers.
As the Venditte/Giarraputo video shows, it doesn’t take any time at all for the batter to switch sides and doesn’t take any time for the pitcher to switch hands. It’s a non-factor.
You have to force one side to give in to the other. It’s a completely arbitrary decision as to which side should concede the platoon.
Tell that to Blake Swihart. In the game on Friday he was prepared to bat against Venditte as a righty, Venditte declared he would pitch right-handed. Swihart had to go back to the dugout to change his gear.
If you ask yourself, who takes longer to switch, it’s not arbitrary. It’s very easy for an MLB pitcher to switch gloves, but an MLB (not some single A stuff) hitter has a lot more gear.
In the video linked above, it’s trivial for the batter to switch sides because he’s wearing a helmet with two ear flaps. That’s not because he’s a switch hitter – it’s because minor league hitters share helmets, so they use the cheap, one-size-fits-all kind.
Major league hitters, however, use helmets with one ear flap, and most switch hitters have two helmets. Switching sides at the big league level would often require the battery to swap helmets. Major league hitters also often wear protection on the arms and knees that face the pitcher, which again would need to be swapped.
So, yeah, it’s a little easier to make Venditte swap hands than it is to make the batter switch sides.
I agree. I hate the rule as well. Venditte should also be able to switch which arm he’s throwing with as many times as he wants to during an at-bat. The rule against this is terribly artificial – it’s not like a pitcher can’t throw side-arm one pitch and over the top the next. This is just another form of arm-slot change, basically.
I actually think he or the A’s should petition to get the rule changed.
Fun Fact: There is a pitcher in the upcoming MLB draft who is also ambidextrous: Ryan Perez of NAIA Judson University.
Second Fun Fact: He throws in the low 90’s from the left side and up to 90 from the right side.
Third Fun Fact: Re-read the second fun fact because that’s incredible.
Yeah, that’s absolutely amazing.
ISTM Venditte’s best value might be as an innings-eater in the pen. Two arms mean half the workload (at least on the arms), so it seems to me he might be a guy that can comes in and give you 2 innings instead of the now-usual 1. Even if he’s just mediocre, you can use a guy like that in lower-leverage situations and keep your better relievers fresh.
FINALLY, the piece I’ve been waiting for!