Trading Uggla

In the aftermath of Dan Uggla rejecting their contract offer for four years and $48 million dollars, the Florida Marlins have reportedly put their second baseman on the trade block. It is an interesting move for what might indicate about Uggla’s current value, his potential landing spots, and where the Marlins see themselves.

Uggla’s primary selling point as as player has always been his bat, and 2010 was the best offensive season of his career with a .381 wOBA (.287/.369/.508). We don’t want to assume any player is going to repeat the best season of his career, especially not one who will be 31. Uggla’s 2011 ZiPS projection puts him at about +20 over 700 plate appearances. Both the metrics and scouts agree that Uggla is a poor defensive second baseman; 5 runs below average would seem to be fair, possibly generous, as an estimate of his true talent in the field. 3.5 WAR seems like a decent projection for Uggla in 2011.

It is hard to know how the free agent valuation will play out; at about $4.5 million dollars per marginal win, Uggla’s “open market” value would be about $16 million. 80 percent of his market value (a typical amount for a player’s third arbitration season) would be around $13 million dollars. Given the uncertainty in both the estimation of both the talent and likely salary, let’s put his surplus value at between two and six million dollars. Assuming he isn’t resigned, Uggla is going to be be a free agent after 2011 , so potential draft pick compensation needs to be taken into account. Uggla would be a Type A free agent if were on the market this season, and is likely to be after 2011. Still, anything can happen, so is general agreement with this data, let’s put his additional value due to draft pick compensation between three and six million dollars. Putting that together with his surplus value over his contract, we get between five and $12 million dollars in surplus; in terms of prospects, at the very worst that is a low-end B prospect. Teams rarely trade A prospects any more, and probably wouldn’t for Uggla, but he could potentially be worth something like a high-end B prospect and either another lesser B prospect or a couple of good Cs. It is probably somewhere in between those two… assuming the Marlins are after prospects.

There isn’t space here to speculate on all the teams that should or could be interested in Uggla. Some have suggested that Uggla could move to third to increase his options, but he (or at least his agent) has shown resistance to this in the past, and I personally don’t think he’ll be any better at third than at second (I’m open to being convinced otherwise). Given his age and contract status, a potential trade partner should probably be a team that has a good shot at contention in 2011 and that needs a second baseman. There are many possibilities, I’ll deal with just two that have been floated. The Tigers have been mentioned as a possible suitor for Uggla, and they do have a hole at second, and they’re usually willing to trade prospects (with the Marlins!) for established players. One intriguing (and puzzling) rumor involves the Toronto Blue Jays. One on hand, Uggla is “their kind of player” (DINGERS!), the Jays will probably continue to be competitive in 2011, and they do have plenty of pitching depth if that is what interests the Marlins. On the other hand, I’m not sure they are quite ready to cross the line from “competitive” to “contending,” pitching depth can disappear in a hurry, and given their division they need to make sure that even “win now” moves don’t interfere with a continual rebuilding plan. On that last point, the potential draft pick compensation from Uggla could come in handy, but it would need to offset whatever talent the Jays give up to get Uggla in the first place. Finally, the Jays would need to either sell low on current second baseman Aaron Hill (a poor man’s Uggla) or move him or Uggla to third base.

What does this say about how the Marlins see their situation? The 4/48 offer seemed fair to me, perhaps too much given his age and the Marlins’ budget — they definitely shouldn’t go any higher than that. S trying to trade Uggla in itself makes sense, but for what? I assumed above they would be looking for prospects because that’s what the Marlins usually do. But that may not be the case — after all, if they were willing to sign Uggla for 4/48 and trade Cameron Maybin for relievers (!), maybe they are seriously trying to contend in 2011. It isn’t unrealistic: the Phillies aren’t getting any younger, the Braves aren’t a juggernaut, the Nationals are still a ways off, and the Mets’ mess will probably take a little while to clean up. The Marlins have been quite respectable the last couple of seasons, but they have never been much more than that since 2003. Trading Uggla potentially opens up second base for Chris Coghlan, and they have some very talented players, but they would need to add some pieces. If they don’t plan on contending in 2011, why offer Uggla the big contract covering his likely decline years? If they do want to contend, why not keep Uggla whether he takes the four-year contract or not, and take the draft picks after the season? There is a third option, though — to try and contend by getting major league talent back for Uggla to help in areas of need (third base, outfield, pitching). The question then is whether the Marlins could get the right players back in a trade and have enough money left in their budgeted to add the remaining necessary parts. The front office generally does a good job with the resources they are given, but it would be nice to see that sort of commitment to winning from ownership given how they suckered the taxpayers have a new stadium coming (and their shoestring budget). I won’t be holding my breath.

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Matt Klaassen reads and writes obituaries in the Greater Toronto Area. If you can't get enough of him, follow him on Twitter.

30 Comments
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Dan
15 years ago

The Cubs seem like they could be a potential suitor. Blake Dewitt is their current 2B, who Uggla would be a pretty large upgrade over. They also have enough good prospects that I’m sure the Marlins could find something they like.

hgjghgjjh
15 years ago

I will be disappointed if the Jays trade for Uggla. No need to give up prospects for an aging, poor fielding 2B. They can fill the hole of losing E5 through their minor league roster. Admittedly, Brad Eamus isn’t the best option, but i’d rather suffer for a year than give up good prospects for short-term success. Uggla isn’t putting the Jays over the top thats for sure.

Torgen
15 years ago
Reply to  hgjghgjjh

Manny wouldn’t put the Jays over the top either, but what about Manny and Uggla?

SC2GG
15 years ago
Reply to  Torgen

Man, that would be ugly…

camisadelgolf
15 years ago

You have the draft pick compensation listed as ‘between three and six million dollars’. Does that include the money itself that would be required to sign said draft picks? If the value of a pick is $3M but requires $2M to actually sign the prospect, wouldn’t it mean that the value of the pick is $1M?

Mike Savino
15 years ago
Reply to  camisadelgolf

And, yeah, I think they account for that. If you think about it…$2MM ain’t all that much. If the drafted player is just a 1.0 WAR player for just one season, he’s pretty much covering the signing bonus plus a few extra million dollars.

Mike Savino
15 years ago

Padres! Padres! Padres! Padres!

You realize the Padres were one win away from beating the eventual world champs out of a playoff spot with Lil’ Davey Eckstein manning second? And with Adrian Gonzalez leaving after next season, they pretty much have to shove their chips in the pot.

amiright?

Joe
15 years ago
Reply to  Mike Savino

Not necessarily. The Padres should still have a larger plan in mind. Not a one-year plan.

Mike Savino
15 years ago
Reply to  Joe

I don’t think those two things are mutually exclusive. Realistically, what will happen to this team’s offense once Adrian leaves? They’ll be terrible, no matter who’s pitching. So, 2012 is probably shot anyway and so is 2013. Probably. Barring some miracle where the farm system is totally awesome.

We know that there won’t be any really excellent teams coming out of the NL West for the next few years anyway. The way I see it…why build on the Marlins/Toronto model of 80-85 wins every year? Take a shot, hopefully make it to the tourney and spend the next few years with buyer’s remorse. I’m okay with that…I think. 😀

this guy
15 years ago
Reply to  Mike Savino

Dealing Agonz is going to result in acquiring at least 2 elite prospects, but you’re sort of right. This is certainly one of the sweet spots for the Pads to make a run. The Giants will basically be the same team, the Dodgers are still waiting for Kemp, Billingsley, Loney and Co to break out, while Kershaw tries to show he can survive 400+ consecutive innings as a top SP, the Rockies weren’t able to win even with a miracle season from Jimenez, and the Dbacks are in shambles.

Replacing Garland’s innings won’t be as easy as it sounds, but they are looking pretty good for 2011. Wouldn’t be a bad time to take a shot at Uggla, who will be vying for a big pay day.

that guy
15 years ago
Reply to  this guy

I wouldn’t call Jimenez’s season a “miracle”. He pitched pretty poorly for most of the second half.

this guy
15 years ago
Reply to  this guy

That’s the miracle. He was never as good as his first half suggested.

Evan
15 years ago

It’s been said that the Marlins think Uggla will hold up for a few more years, plus they want him in the fold for the new stadium to sell the public on the stadium and Uggla. The club also anticipates moving away from a shoestring budget with the new stadium, but I’ll believe it when I see it.

Torgen
15 years ago

Aaron Hill isn’t really a poor man’s Uggla. Hill has two Fielding Bible awards (2007 and 2009). How many Fielding Bible award votes has Uggla received? I suspect it’s 0.

giantsrainman
15 years ago

What about the Giants? They could move Sanchez to 3B where he has played before and rather well I might add. The Giants could overpay in talent with Pablo Sandoval with the Marlins balancing this out by taking Rowand and his remaining 2 years and $24M contract.

Mike Savino
15 years ago
Reply to  giantsrainman

This isn’t serious is it? Pablo Sandoval is coming off a terrible season and his good season was BABIP driven.

Not to mention, the Marlins don’t want to take on salary. That is why they are shopping Uggla.

Forrest Gumption
15 years ago

How does this scenario look?

A’s get: Jason Hammel & Logan Morrison
Rox get: Dan Uggla, Conor Jackson
Fish get: Dexter Fowler, Kevin Kouzmanoff, Ryan Sweeney & Trevor Cahill

A’s get a replacement for Cahill and a much needed good COF hitter
Rox get the 2 players they have been listed to covet, and can move CarGon to CF.
Fish get a legit 3B, CF, another OF and a front line SP.

This seriously looks like a win for all 3 teams to me.

R M
15 years ago

This isn’t fantasy baseball..what reason do the Marlins have to make that trade? Even if we say Morrison is just worth Cahill (which definitely isn’t the case) you get Uggla for 2 role players and an OF prospect who hasn’t even proven he can hit in the majors.

Patrick
15 years ago

No way the A’s move Cahill. Hammel isn’t even half the pitcher Cahill is. Replace him with say Gio Gonzalez and have the Rox send the A’s E. Young Jr. and it starts to look a lot better.

Also, if I’m the Marlins I non-tender Kouzmanoff after that deal. He made 3.1mil last year and is up for an arbitration raise. That’s rough.

Mark
15 years ago

No way do the A’s bite on this deal.

RoMo
15 years ago

Logan Morrison alone is worth more than that package. Fowler, Kouzmanoff, and Sweeney are worthless and Cahill had a low era but his FIP was 4.19 so his stock seem a lot higher than his real value.

ghosthornMember since 2019
15 years ago
Reply to  RoMo

Cahill had an interesting year. His FIP was higher than his ERA, yes, but remember 2010 was just his age 22 season, and his second season in the majors. He can get better. And while his BABIP was insanely low in 2010 (.238), he’s always been a great groundball pitcher, so he might be able to keep his HR/9 low and his LOB% up.

For Oakland, I don’t see how Morrison would be more of interested than in-house option Chris Carter. Sure, Carter’s a year older than Morrison, and he strikes out a ton, but he’s hit for massive power at every level so far–something Morrison has NOT done.

Even though I agree that Sweeney and Kouz are sort of non-entities here for the Marlins (or for any team?), in the end I think it’s the A’s who’d have no interest in acquiring Morrison, especially if it involved giving up Cahill.

george bush jr
15 years ago

Big rumors coming out that by the end of the week Dan Uggla will be joining the San Francisco Giants in return for Loria’s favorite son Cody Ross.

mike wants wins
15 years ago

Twins? That would be sweet. Like they’d deal for a guy that doesn’t play the “Twins’ way”.

Span, ?, and a legit prospect for Uggla. He can move to LF or DH (or play 2B).

FL needs a CF, and the Twins have some decent pitching prospects. I’d happily include Baker or Blackburn in this deal, but I don’t see the Twins doing that. KLAW points out the Twins’ pitchers aren’t the kind of pitcher FL likes, though.

The Twins can afford him, no problem, when Kubel and cuddery and Nathan come off the books in 2012.

DIVISION
15 years ago

Uggla is perfect for Toronto.

He fits in with their culture and for all the talk about his fielding, on a team like Toronto, he’ll more than make up for it with his slugging.

Plug him in and watch the HR parade continue in Toronto.

Of course the Marlins want prospects………..they’re always building up for their next playoff run/payroll dump.

You would think a state with as many people as Florida, both the Marlins and Rays would garner more support.

Amazing………..

Geoff
15 years ago
Reply to  DIVISION

Jays don’t need more boppers. We need some speed that can scrape their way on base any way possible, swipe a bag here and there, and score when the boppers come up. Uggla is the last thing we need. I’d rather spend less on a guy like O. Hudson if they are moving Hill to 3rd. We’d have some pretty solid fielding at that point.

Undocorkscrew
15 years ago

The Braves could definitely use a right-handed power bat in the middle of their lineup, they’ve got the chips to make a deal. But I don’t see them being major players. If Chipper was retiring, I could see it. But trading for Uggla means moving him to LF or moving Prado to LF, neither has played the outfield, although Prado does play the outfield in winter ball.

I think he can be had for Minor, Dunn, and Infante. Gives them a decent 3B candidate(since Coghlan would be moving to 2B), more pen help, and a high-upside starter under control for 5 more years. All inexpensive pieces, although if something like that happens I would prefer an extension, but no more than 3 years.

Holier
15 years ago
Reply to  Undocorkscrew

Wow, you could be strangely close to the truth, and without even the best trade piece. Who are you working for?

joedubatl
15 years ago

hey great insight here, looking back. i like the deal for both teams.