Aaron Sanchez’s Place in Toronto’s Rotation
Aaron Sanchez wants to be a starter. Most pitchers want to be a starter. Jesse Chavez and Gavin Floyd want to be starters, too, and they all might deserve it, which is the current conundrum in Toronto. Not that having too many qualified starters is a bad thing, per se, but it presents the team with some tough choices, choices that could complicate things down the line.
At the very least, Toronto can feel good about their depth. The top of their rotation might not match the firepower of their contending peers, but they’ll be sending two seemingly competent starters to the bullpen at the end of Spring Training, with Drew Hutchison heading to the minors as perhaps the eighth starter on the depth chart.
As I’m writing this, I’ve come upon a tweet by Jon Heyman who was present in Blue Jays camp the other day and reported that Chavez is set to the head to the bullpen, so in fact it looks like the last rotation spot is down to two. And Chavez to the pen makes sense anyway; he’s had the worst spring of the three, for what it’s worth, but more importantly, he’s done the swingman thing in the past. Each of the last two years, he’s seamlessly shuffled between relieving and starting — not something everyone can do — and so he doesn’t necessarily need to be stretched out right now to be able to contribute to the rotation later down the line. And Chavez will need to contribute to the rotation later down the line. Pitching is fickle.
So we’ve got Gavin Floyd and Aaron Sanchez, and in that same Heyman tweet I linked, he seemed to suggest Floyd has the leg up on the last spot. Sometimes with Twitter, it’s hard to tell what’s being reported and what’s being speculated, but there’s clearly some sort of sense that Floyd could be the leader in the clubhouse.
It could be as simple as this: Floyd has been superb thus far in Spring Training, and Sanchez was superb in the bullpen last year after bombing as a starter. Floyd also has proven the ability to turn over lineups in the past, albeit four years ago. After appearing in seven games out of the bullpen for the Indians last year, the club was willing to bring him back as a reliever, but Floyd expressed a strong desire to return to a rotation, so he hit free agency in search of a club willing to give him an opportunity to start again.
But while Floyd has been great this spring — 2.19 ERA with 11 strikeouts and three walks in a measly 12 innings — Sanchez has been better. Now, we all know about the conventional wisdom regarding spring stats, and so we know that Sanchez’s 1.35 ERA, while impressive, is mostly meaningless. But strikeout and walk rates stabilize the quickest of any pitcher stats, and Dan Rosenheck’s work in The Economist last year showed that, for the guys at the extreme ends of the spectrum, they can matter a little.
Well, Sanchez has struck out a quarter of all the batters he’s faced this spring. He’s walked just three of 78. Not only does Sanchez have the second-largest sample of any pitcher this spring, he’s got some of the most extreme numbers, and that 3.8% walk rate feels even more significant, given what we know about Sanchez. The problem with Sanchez has never been the stuff, it’s been the command. The fastball, even as a starter, can touch 98. The amount of run he gets on the sinker is sometimes silly. The curveball flashes plus. The problem is that he hasn’t been able to put it over the plate; as a starter last year, Sanchez had a 13% walk rate.
If you can’t throw strikes, you can’t throw strikes. This spring, Sanchez has thrown strikes, and there’s no real way to fake that. The once-lanky hurler, who checked in at 6-4, 200 pounds last year, put on 25 pounds in the offseason in an effort to smooth out his mechanics, and he claims the weight has done wonders. He’s spent the spring focusing on improving his curveball command and developing his third pitch, his changeup, which makes the minuscule walk figure even more impressive — if he’s throwing more breaking and offspeed stuff than usual, you’d probably expect the walk rate to go up before you’d expect it to go down.
Beyond all the spring stuff is the more important consideration, and that’s future role. What is Gavin Floyd’s future role with the Blue Jays? There probably isn’t one. Sanchez is 23, and was just rated the organization’s top prospect by Baseball America two years ago, as a starter. The stuff is undeniable. If Sanchez can stick in a rotation, he’ll provide Toronto with tremendous present and future value. It’s far more important to the organization to know whether Sanchez can stick as a starter than it is to know whether Floyd can stick as a starter. Either could fail in April and put the team in a hole. Either could continue to pitch well. The information on Sanchez is just worth more.
And an Opening Day bullpen assignment for Sanchez feels like a season-long sentence. At that point, it’s tough to go back, unless the team’s comfortable sending one of their most talented pitchers down to the minors during a contending season to get him stretched out to start. He’s stretched out now. Anyone can transition to fewer innings if they struggle. And if that happens, Chavez has proven he can be ready to start on a moment’s notice. Hutchison will be around. Floyd doesn’t have to be a factor in this.
The decision, to me, seems easy, though it appears, at least according to Heyman’s report, that it might not be for the Blue Jays. Between Sanchez and Floyd, Sanchez inarguably has the higher ceiling. Both ought to have similarly low floors. Doesn’t Sanchez deserve the chance? Don’t the Blue Jays have more to gain from knowing what they have in Sanchez before knowing what they have in Floyd? Doesn’t condemning Sanchez to a sixth-inning role in the bullpen complicate matters further by making an in-season return to the rotation exceedingly strenuous? This doesn’t have to be difficult. Just put Aaron Sanchez in the rotation.
August used to cover the Indians for MLB and ohio.com, but now he's here and thinks writing these in the third person is weird. So you can reach me on Twitter @AugustFG_ or e-mail at august.fagerstrom@fangraphs.com.
My druthers would be to put both in the rotation, and move Happ to the pen aka never have signed him in the first place.
but I’d agree with your choice of the two – take a looksee at the higher upside option to start, if he falters you can go with one of the safer options.
Happ was the 28th best starting pitcher in the majors last year and this guy wants him in the pen. Clueless.
Clueless would be assuming 11 Pittsburgh sets a new ability standard. Jays fans have good reason to doubt Happ.
Career WAR by season:
1.7
1.0
0.6
1.9
1.1
1.0
3.3 (1.2 in 108ip inAL, 2.1 in 63ip in NL)
Somehow I doubt this guy just figured out how to pitch at age 33.
Why not? I find it interesting how skeptical people still are about players improving themselves these days.
The game has come a long way in just the last ten years, players have so much more information and analysis available to them while training/diet regimens are aggressive and tailored. Sanchez adding 25 pounds of muscle in the offseason is just one recent example of a change that could have meaningful impact on his numbers, Stroman’s determined rehab last season which got him back as a significant contributor before the playoffs is another. Almost everyone wrote him off.
In the past – just going back to the eighties – any 25 pound gains would almost certainly not have been muscle, at least not until the late eighties and the prevalence of steroids. Players didn’t really look to change their approach, if anything most were afraid of changing something and screwing up their game.
That is no longer the case today, a lot of guys are constantly looking for an edge and using whatever tools they can find to improve. So why is it as hard to believe Happ could make a change that sticks?
No one knows whether what Happ did late last season will stick or not, he looks good so far but we’ll find out for sure soon. I don’t expect the same results as he put up with Pittsburgh but also don’t see it as so implausible that he could be a very respectable starting pitcher this season.
Positive long term improvements from players are what I love about baseball, something the Jays have been fortunate to experience often lately with guys like Bautista, Encarnacion, Hendriks, Cecil and even Donaldson to some extent. Perhaps now we will be experiencing it with Goins, Sanchez and yes even Happ.
Well, it’s one thing for guys in their 27-28yr old prime to take a step forward with their first real shot at playing time, and quite another for a guy with a long track record of inconsistency to suddenly figure out something new at age 33.
Happ had a nice streak in against NL lineups and weak offensive teams in general, and still was averaging well under 6ip per start. 10 games of that kind of protected performance isn’t going to make me believe he’s suddenly a different guy than the one I saw for 2 years as a Jay already.
And where did you see that he’s looking good so far? he’s barely pitched against MLBers this spring and when he has he’s been letting guys on base frequently and not getting the Ks. I think he had one game on TV so far, and it was familiar old Happ – get 2 quick outs and then nibble your way into trouble every inning.
Unfortunately for my Jays, I’m guessing Happ is the same 1war pitcher this year that he was his last 2 years with the Jays.
Well unlike you apparently I am not expecting Happ to be an all star, just a solid respectable starter. Kind of like a number four or five starter should be!
I’m not focusing on overall numbers much at the moment, it is spring training after all, but he is controlling walks well and doesn’t appear to be getting hit hard at all. Those are the main concerns with Happ, if he controls those areas he will have success. He will not be a strikeout machine and should not be expected to be, and that’s ok.
Maybe we just agree that we have differing viewpoints here and that’s ok too, but Happ will also be pitching with the benefit of a far superior catcher and defense this season than he had in his last stint with the Jays. I expect this will have no small impact on his numbers for the coming season.
My guess is that the front office feels more comfortable with a proven starter, and didn’t expect Sanchez to improve. Now, they are pondering what to do without annoying either pitcher.
An idea that has crossed my mind is a six man rotation. That way, you can play “weakest link” for the first month, with some extra rest for starters, and the decision can be made with a bit more information.
I like it in the abstract but the problem is that the April schedule is already the lightest, which is why you don’t even need a fifth starter for the first couple of weeks, so you’d really be stretching guys out on extended rest. That would make everyone unhappy for the benefit of one guy.
It is a myth that the april schedule is light. The jays have three off days in april.. Which is the same number of off days as they have in june, august and sept.
he’s somehow been throwing even harder than usual this spring, pitching north of 95 pretty consistently. the little video i’ve caught of him showed the delivery looking very smooth and simple. obviously the K/BB numbers speak for themselves. some of that his clearly him overpowering minor league fodder, but the further we’ve gotten into the spring the less that has been the case.
I certainly can’t see a powerful argument to keep him out of the rotation. not for Gavin Floyd anyways, world’s most boring starter 4 years ago, who has no future with the team.
Definitely Sanchez to the rotation and Floyd to the bullpen. If Sanchez struggles enough to warrant it, they can be switched later.
Sanchez has looked dominant this spring. If he’s not the fifth starter the team is making a massive mistake. Sanchez could be better than Stroman. Floyd is at best serviceable.
At Yatzhee, perhaps, but not pitching.
I’m concerned about his inability to get lefties out as his biggest obstacle to success as a starter. It’s great his control is improved in ST but let’s see how he does when he has to face guys multiple times through the order with other teams stacking their LH bats.
Id worry about his massive splits… He struggles against lefties .380 wOBA last year versus .205 against righties
I know this fits a current narrative on him but I’m not sold it’s completely true. His milb numbers don’t show a massive split (3.75siera vRH, 3.99siera vLH), and his numbers vLH as an mlb RP are good too. It’s something to watch but I’m not convinced he’s as helpless against LHP as some are saying.
He had a 1:1 K:BB as a RP vs lefties last year, I’d hardly call that good.
Did he? I can’t find that double split.
In 2014 his line against LHP was: 11.2ip, 21.7lk%, 10.9bb%, .223woba, 3.34xfip
This is one of those situations where you would want scouting to confirm the statistics. If scouts say that there is a genuine improvement in Sanchez’s command then I agree about giving him priority on the rotation spot. Absent that, I don’t think the statistics from twenty innings of spring training are enough to take someone from a role in which he has been quite successful. Sanchez in Toronto’s bullpen has significant value to the team whereas Sanchez in the rotation may or may not, and it’s worth considering that Floyd not making the rotation likely ends his involvement with the team.
Sanchez’ command improved significantly last year even when starting with him posting a 7.3bb% over his last 4 starts before being injured. And this carried over to his relief work where he posted a 7.1bb%.
Moreover from what I’ve seen this spring (he’s been on TV twice at least) his command isn’t just about not walking anyone, but about hitting his spots. Especially with his curve – which he’s been able to turn into almost 2 different pitches, with one buckling knees and falling in for strikes at the edge of the zone and the other spiking hard into the dirt for swinging misses.
I don’t know if it’s legit yet but IMO it’s more than just his BB% in spring training that’s lending support to it.
Imagine Bartolo Colon threw 98 mph. Yes.
It looks like that Chavez-Hendriks trade was a big mistake now. If you are putting Sanchez in the pen because it makes the pen better why do you trade a very good to elite releiver for a SP with 1 year of control?
If Hendriks was here Sanchez could start and Floyd be the swingman and you would never have had this situation.
Not sure about that. I liked Hendriks in the pen, he was very solid last year but there is a decent chance the Jays will need additional depth at starter and he wasn’t going to be able to give them that. There aren’t a ton of other reasonably cheap yet decent starter options available out there so the deal isn’t so bad in that context.
Chavez will start the season in the pen but is serviceable as a starter if they need him to fill in, especially with that offense. With all of the recent trades there aren’t really any other starting pitcher options in the higher levels of the system at the moment aside from Hutchison if he ends up there as expected.
The best prospects are at least another year away, although there is potential for Connor Greene to be this season’s Osuna/Sanchez and contribute in the bullpen.
Hendriks could give you multiple innings out of the pen so its not like he was a 1 inning guy. If Sanchez goes to the pen then Hutch and Chavez are the 2 guys that make up the SP depth.
If Hendriks was still here then Floyd and Hutch would be the SP depth with Sanchez starting. Not really any different and you lose 3 years of control, not to mention Hendriks was a better reliever than Sanchez.
Well if Hendriks were still here the Jays would be seven deep in proven starters instead of eight. Hendriks might give you more than one inning in relief but he was no longer considered a starter.
That extra starter could make a big difference later this season. I hope it isn’t needed but assuming the Jays do need that depth it is beneficial to have the player already available then try to acquire him mid-season in competition with all other starter-needy teams, and there will be some. It’s like going to the bank for a line of credit when you are broke and possibly even in debt. Chances are the price for a guy like Chavez is higher than a Liam Hendriks then – as much as I appreciated what he did last season.
As for Sanchez, he should be given the opportunity to start this season. He has worked hard to show the team he is ready and deserves the chance to prove it. Floyd will likely get his chance to start at some point and can work in long relief for now along with Chavez. With his injury history this may serve him better anyway.
First off, yes, 4 years of Hendriks > 1 of Chavez. Second of all he wasn’t just “very solid”, he was top 5 in FIP-. He was one of the best relievers in all of baseball.
The Jays have more than enough depth between Stro, Dickey, Estrada, Happ, Sanchez, Hutch, Floyd, and various minor league options. Hendriks in the bullpen would have been far more valuable, especially next year when Cecil/Storen are FA, and Sanchez/Osuna will be in the rotation, and there will be exactly 0 high leverage arms in the pen as of next year.
The Jays would have been far better off with the elite reliever in Hendriks over the swingman in Chavez. And again, what was worse about the Chavez trade was it was a panic move, made on Nov. 20th. You didn’t need to do that depth trade then. You could have waited to see what happened, or signed a guy like Petit or whomever in FA.
What a waste of an elite, underappreciated asset in Hendriks.
I’m with you, my initial reaction when the trade happened was outrage. Hendriks was incredibly valuable for the Jays last season and relievers are the hot commodity of the day.
After some time I started to come around a bit. As I said to Ryan above, the Jays really don’t have much proven starter depth. You throw out “various minor league options” but who are those? Scott Diamond? I like the guy and wish him the best but he is far from a proven effective starter.
The Jays have eight starters they can anticipate reliably decent outings from, and that assumes Sanchez is used as a starter as he should be. There was no guarantee of that at the time Chavez was acquired so he was the seventh starter then.
Having at least seven or eight decent starters is not a luxury, it’s damn near a requirement for a contending team. The Jays have that added security now but without Chavez were at serious risk of having to overpay later in the season if they found themselves short.
I loved having Hendriks on the team but he was found money for the Jays. Let’s not get carried away, he has one valuable season on his resume. I believe he will likely continue to be an effective reliever but it is not a given, just as it is not a given that Happ carries on his new found success this year (although I expect him to).
I wasn’t thinking about the contract situations but even with that the starter depth was much needed and Chavez has provided about the same value or better as Hendriks in each of the past two seasons. How much do you think a starter like him costs the Jays during the season? Look at teams like the Orioles right now who hope to contend but still don’t have five solid starters confirmed yet.
The prices on starters will be higher as games are played, the Jays moving early on him was probably the only reason they got Chavez without giving up someone like Alford, Tellez or a pitcher like Greene. They have a bunch of potential guys to fill Hendriks’ spot in the pen, they may have little chance of being as effective but the Jays have way more options there at the moment than at starter.
“As I said to Ryan above, the Jays really don’t have much proven starter depth. ”
They’ve got 7 legit options, I’m going to agree to disagree here.
“There was no guarantee of that at the time Chavez was acquired so he was the seventh starter then.”
Which is why the trade was so bad in the first place. If it’s March/April and you’re desperate for a SP, maybe you can justify trading a quality asset for a SP (actually, you still can’t justify Hendriks, but at least here you’ve exhausted your FA options). Not 2 weeks after the World Series. Far too early to panic over depth like the Jays did.
I also would have used Osuna in the rotation, be it AAA or MLB, so in my situation, I would have had 8 SP options without Chavez. Of course, by having Hendriks, the bullpen isn’t any weaker, but the upside is you further Osuna’s development and if you put him in AAA, don’t burn a year of service on a guy who would throw 110-120 innings and turn that into an extra prime year of service.
“I loved having Hendriks on the team but he was found money for the Jays. Let’s not get carried away, he has one valuable season on his resume. I believe he will likely continue to be an effective reliever but it is not a given, just as it is not a given that Happ carries on his new found success this year (although I expect him to)”
Oh come on. This isn’t a BABIP situation like Colabello. He went multiple standard deviations above the norm in his velocity increase. This is a legitimate improvement and trying to dismiss it is nonsense. He didn’t fluke his way to this elite season. The only thing that would really prevent him from repeating, or at least performing significantly above average is an injury. There’s no reason to expect regression unless you think he’ll go back to throwing low 90s instead of averaging 95 MPH.
The starter depth argument fails to take into account that had the Jays not spent 4M on Chavez, they could have spent 4M on a similar swingman calibre pitcher. Petit, for example, and kept Hendriks. So the “Jays need SP depth” argument is missing the point – the Jays could have had extra SP depth while keeping Hendriks. They didn’t HAVE to trade Hendriks for SP depth. They could have had both. That’s the mistake. I’m fine with having more SP depth, but they could have had SP depth without getting rid of the best reliever on the team, which includes some pretty damn good RP options.
Nobody is filling Hendriks shoes. Cecil is great, Storen is great, Osuna is great, but none of the other guys replace Hendriks. It’s disingenuous to suggest they can. And worse, is that by focusing on the “SP depth” argument, you’re ignoring that the Jays could have had SP depth while maintaining an even deeper and stronger bullpen than they currently have, while ensuring they’re built to win in the short and long term.
You have to give value to get value. You may not like Jesse Chavez but he does have value, his numbers are not significantly different than those of Mike Leake or Wade Miley. The first guy has a five year $80 million contract and the other was traded for Carson Smith (spare parts also included each way) shortly after the Chavez trade – another top reliever just like Hendriks.
Chavez at $4 million is a pretty good value by comparison. The Jays needed more proven depth and they got it. There is no way Osuna was suddenly going to be converted to a starter, he needs to build up more innings before he is ready for that. I suspect he gets used something like Betances was last season (although that assumes Gibby makes smart bullpen moves – big assumption there).
As for Petit, he is not a proven reliable starter, his best numbers are in relief and I suspect he benefitted from playing in the NL and in a significant pitchers park, his away numbers were terrible last season. There isn’t really a plethora of other starting pitchers available for $4 million either, not that have the same history as Chavez.
I doubt any of this makes a dent, you seem pretty set in your stance and that’s cool. If you’re going to continue on attack mode keep in mind I did say I expect Hendriks will likely succeed again this season, just that he hasn’t put together much history of it yet. There is risk he doesn’t maintain that level of dominance from last season.
The Chavez-Hendriks trade was made before they signed Happ or resigned Estrada. It’s likely they mis-read the market. If they don’t trade for Chavez and either Estrada or Happ don’t sign, then they are suck with both Floyd and Sanchez in the rotation with only Hutch as insurance. Teams use 8-10 starters a year and that simply wouldn’t be enough depth.
Exactly why it was a bad trade. If this trade is made in Feb. you could at least justify it, not 3 weeks after the season ended. You could have used the $4 Million Chavez will make and sign a guy like Blanton or Petit or whoever as depth all the while still having an elite pen with Hendriks included.
Sanchez needs to be given a chance to stick in the rotation, but he should be given the best possible chance, not necessarily the next chance. I haven’t ben able to watch his ST games, but he’s reported to be ‘still working’ on the changeup and having a hard time throwing it for strikes. I think whether he begins the season in the rotation really comes down to whether giving him time in the minors to polish the change will give him a better chance to succeed as a starter and stick in the role. But I think that’s the choice: minors or majors, not starting or relieving. I can’t see using Sanchez as a high-leverage reliever for the year as a realistic option given his high ceiling as a starter.
There may be a possibility that Estrada skips his first start to stretch him out a little more considering he got a later start to his spring.
I think Sanchez should get the fifth spot for a lot of the reasons you’ve stated. One thing that worries me is that his starts this spring have mostly been against AAAA type lineups. Also, the one start I did see from him, the ump was giving him strikes that looked below the strike zone but maybe that could be because of the depth his sinker has shown this spring. Despite any concerns though, I don’t see why he shouldn’t get a shot at the fifth spot as he can potentially add more value for the club as a starter than as the 4th man in the pen behind Storen, Osuna and Cecil.
Floyd will be given the 5th starter gig and it’s going to be an absolute sham. He was a gifted a major league contract because his agent is Mark Shaprio’s father, and all it’s done is put the team in a position to screw Sanchez up even further.
Shapiro should be fired, or forced to pay out Floyd’s contract from his own when they cut him for Sanchez.
Floyd is probably Shapiro’s best move of the offseason, actually. If he’s healthy he’s a darn good pitcher.
It’s the rest of the signings that are suspect.
Floyd is an interesting signing, but giving him a major league contract and, from what I’ve heard, a guaranteed spot on the roster if healthy, if suspect.
well he’s got a $1m bonus that depends on time spent on the roster, so it’s actually cheaper at this point to cut him than keep him.
Shouldn’t this article have some .gifs?
Sanchez has for sure shown his worth this spring. I would like to see him face a few more MLB players as most of his starts have been against scrubs. Unlike Hutch who has seen his share of quality opposition.
Innings cap. If he’s in the starting rotation in April, he’s gonna blow past his innings cap by August. It makes more sense to conserve his arm for a few months and have him down the stretch.
If we are going to read the tea leaves to determine who is leading the race for the 5th roster spot in the rotation, it may be worth mentioning that Sanchez is currently slotted in there on the team’s website: http://toronto.bluejays.mlb.com/team/depth_chart/index.jsp?c_id=tor .
Not subject to the approval of the Toronto Blue Jays. So, not the official site.