Freddie Freeman, Fastballs, and the Hall of Fame

If Major League Baseball awarded MVP honors for the Wild Card Series, then Max Fried, Ian Anderson and the rest of a Braves pitching staff that held the Reds scoreless for 22 consecutive innings would have rightly claimed it, but Freddie Freeman played a significant role in the Braves’ advancement as well. In the bottom of the 13th inning of Game 1, more than four and a half hours into a scoreless standoff that set a postseason record, the 31-year-old first baseman’s single up the middle brought home Cristian Pache, his latest big hit in a season that for all of its brevity has been full of them.

Since the ballots have been cast, that hit won’t affect the voting, of course, but Freeman’s regular season performance has given him a shot at becoming the first first baseman to win an MVP award since Joey Votto in 2010. His performance was all the more amazing given that he tested positive for COVID-19 in early July, and feared for his own life as he battled high fevers. Thankfully, he not only recovered and regained his strength but did so in time to be in the Braves’ lineup on Opening Day. Remarkably, he played in all 60 games, one of 14 players to do so (not counting Starling Marte, who squeezed in 61 while being traded from the Diamondbacks to the Marlins). Freeman hit a sizzling .341/.462/.640, placing second in the National League in all three slash stats and wRC+ (187) behind Juan Soto, who played 13 fewer games due to his own COVID-19 battle.

Big hits? Freeman batted .423/.583/.885 in 72 plate appearances with runners in scoring position, good for a major league-best 264 wRC+ in that capacity. While he finished second in the NL behind teammate Marcell Ozuna in RBI (56 to 53), he led the majors in Win Probability Added (3.17), more than a full win ahead of the 10th-ranked Ozuna.

Additionally, Freeman’s 3.4 WAR led the NL, something no first baseman had done in either league since Votto in 2010, with Albert Pujols (2006 and ’08) and Jason Giambi (2001) the only others to do so in this millennium. Here it’s worth noting that I’m specifically referring to FanGraphs’ version of WAR; thanks in part to the wider spread of values produced by Defensive Runs Saved, Pujols — who in his day was an elite defender — led the NL in Baseball-Reference’s version annually from 2005-10, with Votto doing so in ’17 (Giambi did so in ’01, via a rare positive showing via Total Zone defense). The point stands, in that for a first baseman to lead the league in any version of the stat, he has to go on a rampage offensively in order to overcome its positional adjustments. For Freeman to do so, even in a shortened season, is impressive.

It’s worth noting that via our 60-game span-finder, Freeman had numerous overlapping stretches in 2016 during which he was at least this valuable by WAR, and likewise, stretches in both 2016 and ’17 when he hit at least this well by wRC+. This isn’t a total fluke; he’s just stayed hot all season, with a finishing kick that may help him nab the MVP hardware.

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How did Freeman do it? COVID-19 aside, he may have been in better physical shape. Recall that after the Braves were ousted from the Division Series last year, he underwent surgery to remove a bone spur in his right elbow, a problem that was a likely culprit for a September fade that dropped him out of MVP discussions. During the surgery, Dr. David Altchek found that Freeman had not one but two bone spurs as well as three fragments. Afterwards, Freeman said, “It’s the first time in nine years I haven’t had any pain in the offseason,” so it’s conceivable that for as good as he’s been during his career, the elbow had prevented him from being even better.

From a statistical standpoint, a few things about his 2020 performance stand out. He set career bests when it came to selectivity and contact, swinging at just 28.2% of pitches outside the zone (32.9% last year), connecting with 81.9% of the pitches he swung at (77.9% last year), and whiffing on just 8.5% (11.6% last year); those 2019 numbers are quite representative of his career rates. That selectivity and contact produced a career-high 17.2% walk rate and a career-low 14.1% strikeout rate. He also produced the lowest groundball rate of his career (31.1%), and the second-lowest groundball-to-fly ball ratio (0.85). His overall average exit velocity of 92.4 mph was well beyond 2019 (89.8) as well as his previous Statcast high (91.3 mph in 2016).

One thing that elevated Freeman beyond his usual level of excellence was his utter annihilation of fastballs. Via Statcast, he hit .427 with an .805 slugging percentage and .495 xwOBA against all fastballs (four-seamers, sinkers, and cutters grouped together), ranking second behind Salvador Perez — who saw just over half as many fastballs — in the first two categories and first in the last of those:

Highest xwOBA Against Fastballs
Player Team FB Tot Pit % AB H AVG SLG xwOBA
Freddie Freeman Braves 531 1021 52.9 124 53 .427 .806 .495
Marcell Ozuna Braves 564 1074 52.5 129 52 .403 .783 .488
Teoscar Hernández Blue Jays 445 840 53.0 96 37 .385 .792 .486
Bryce Harper Phillies 543 973 55.8 98 30 .306 .714 .485
Juan Soto Nationals 447 827 54.1 80 25 .313 .638 .470
Salvador Perez Royals 275 563 48.8 69 30 .435 .855 .456
Luke Voit Yankees 471 910 51.8 108 35 .324 .787 .451
Paul Goldschmidt Cardinals 570 978 58.3 113 40 .354 .611 .448
Corey Seager Dodgers 425 807 52.7 113 39 .345 .646 .442
Nelson Cruz Twins 456 846 53.9 94 33 .351 .755 .436
SOURCE: Baseball Savant
Includes four-seam fastballs, sinkers/two-seam fastballs, and cut fastballs.

Freeman averaged a 94.1 mph exit velo on those fastballs, up from 90.5 mph in 2019 and a Statcast high of 92.8 mph in ’16. The story is similar if we limit the picture to four-seam fastballs:

Highest xwOBA Against Four-Seam Fastballs
Player Team FF Tot Pit % AB H AVG SLG xwOBA
Freddie Freeman Braves 295 1021 28.9 69 32 .464 .928 .547
Marcell Ozuna Braves 271 1074 25.2 59 29 .492 .932 .544
Bryce Harper Phillies 320 973 32.9 56 16 .286 .750 .502
Jedd Gyorko Brewers 163 566 28.8 23 9 .391 .826 .485
Christian Yelich Brewers 347 1100 31.5 55 18 .327 .727 .483
Dylan Moore Mariners 239 656 36.4 48 17 .354 .854 .482
Juan Soto Nationals 254 827 30.7 43 12 .279 .558 .482
Evan Longoria Giants 275 794 34.6 61 22 .361 .607 .478
Teoscar Hernández Blue Jays 251 840 29.9 49 19 .388 .857 .477
Pedro Severino Orioles 185 741 25.0 53 20 .377 .698 .472
SOURCE: Baseball Savant

For comparison, here’s Freeman’s body of work against four-seamers in the Statcast era, including his 3.3-mph gain in exit velo relative to 2019:

Freeman Against Four-Seam Fastballs
Year FF Tot Pit % AB H AVG SLG xwOBA EV LA
2015 576 1871 30.8 139 32 .230 .424 .385 91.9 20.6
2016 905 2779 32.6 204 63 .309 .662 .462 92.5 22.4
2017 599 1929 31.1 149 50 .336 .624 .403 89.0 18.7
2018 889 2663 33.4 213 73 .343 .577 .426 90.6 17.8
2019 997 2750 36.3 216 64 .296 .634 .468 90.3 18.1
2020 295 1021 28.9 69 32 .464 .928 .547 93.6 19.7
SOURCE: Baseball Savant

All of this may well be related to the smaller sample sizes from this abbreviated season, but it’s happened nonetheless, and it suggests improved bat speed. Freeman’s performance against other pitch classes is within the ranges he’s established during the Statcast era. Against breaking balls, for example, his .246 batting average is his third highest (down four points on last year), and his .363 xwOBA his second-highest (up 10 points on last year). Against offspeed pitches, his .182 batting average and .303 slugging percentage were both his lowest of the span, but his .395 xwOBA was his second-highest (up 111 points from last year), suggesting that he may have simply had some bad luck on those pitches, which amount to just 47 plate appearances and 24 batted ball events.

Location-wise, Freeman set personal Statcast-era highs with his performance in the upper third of the strike zone (zones 1, 2, and 3), posting a .417 batting average, .792 slugging percentage, 90.7 mph average exit velo, and .415 xwOBA, but we’re talking about just 89 pitches and 24 batted ball events in that sample. Historically, he has struggled with pitches in that area, albeit with a whole lot of year-to-year variance, including batting averages ranging from .145 to .304, slugging percentages from .261 to .543, and xwOBAs from .169 to .378, with the extremes coming on sample sizes of 69 batted ball events for the lower numbers (2015) and 46 for the higher ones (’16), so I’d caution against drawing conclusions on that finding; meanwhile, year-to-year comparisons regarding low pitches, inside pitches, and outside pitches fell within his established ranges and were less noteworthy. More robust is that on 409 pitches ending 108 at-bats in the Shadow area of Statcast’s Attack Zones breakdown — borderline pitches, in other words — he hit .343 and slugged .648, both era highs, though his 91.1 mph average exit velocity and .386 xwOBA were a bit below career bests.

Some of this uptick in performance may owe to a slightly more open stance that Pitcher List’s Dan Richards spotted in mid-2019, an improvement that could have been obscured somewhat by the late-season elbow woes (he hit .264/.365/.389 for a 95 wRC+ in September). It would be nice if we had a full, injury-free season to tell us if Freeman has unlocked a new level of performance, but as with so much else in life, we make do with what we have.

Even before Freeman embarked upon this stellar campaign, he was the subject of frequent questions with regards to JAWS and the Hall of Fame, one of which came up in my September 22 chat and got the wheels turning. Initially, I had planned to include Goldschmidt, Votto, and Anthony Rizzo, all of whose teams qualified for the expanded postseason, as part of a broader piece, but those guys — whose teams all made first-round exits — will have to await another day.

Via Baseball-Reference, Freeman produced “only” 2.9 WAR this year, second in the NL but half a win behind league leader Mookie Betts. That takes him to 38.5 career WAR, with a peak score (best seven seasons) of 31.9, and a JAWS of 35.2. By comparison, the average Hall of Fame first baseman produced 66.9 career WAR, 42.7 peak WAR, and 54.8 JAWS. That leaves Freeman, who just completed his age-30 season, with a considerable ways to go; he’s just 47th among first basemen in JAWS right now, ahead of frequent Era Committee candidate Steve Garvey (38.1/28.8/33.4) as well as the similarly-aged Rizzo (34.3/31.6/32.9) but behind a metric ton of guys who played through their late 30s or even into their 40s but whom Freeman will likely surpass in the coming years.

Towards that end, I called upon Dan Szymborski to provide a rest-of-career ZiPS projection for Freeman, and he obliged:

Freddie Freeman ZiPS Projection
Year Age PA H HR BA OBP SLG OPS+ WAR
2021 31 626 160 30 .299 .395 .549 144 4.9
2022 32 608 154 27 .295 .390 .534 139 4.4
2023 33 581 144 24 .287 .379 .512 131 3.5
2024 34 551 136 21 .284 .372 .495 125 2.9
2025 35 515 126 18 .279 .363 .473 117 2.2
2026 36 478 116 15 .274 .351 .446 107 1.3
2027 37 420 100 11 .266 .338 .415 96 0.5
2028 38 315 73 7 .256 .321 .386 84 -0.2
2021-28 4094 1009 153 .282 .368 .485 121 19.6
Thru 2020 5965 1524 240 .295 .383 .509 139 38.5
Totals 10059 2533 393 .290 .377 .500 132 58.1

Setting aside the WAR for a moment, those don’t look particularly like Hall of Fame numbers, at least for a first baseman. There are enshrinees — I’ll stick with BBWAA-elected ones here — with fewer hits, such as Frank Thomas (2,468), Jim Thome (2,328), Jeff Bagwell (2,314), and Willie McCovey (2,211), but all had much higher home run totals (612 for Thome, 521 for both McCovey and Thomas, and 449 for Bagwell) and better rate stats. All four slugged above .500 for their careers, with all but McCovey topping .400 in on-base percentage as well. Thomas finished with a 156 OPS+, Bagwell 149, Thome and McCovey both 147. At a position where Steve Garvey (2,599 hits, 272 homers, 117 OPS+) and Fred McGriff (2,490 hits, 493 homers, and a 134 OPS+) both ran their course on the writers’ ballot without reaching 45%, and Todd Helton (2,519 hits, 369 homers, 133 OPS+) is off to a slow start (29.2% in his second year of eligibility), that doesn’t bode well.

Projections are not destiny, as I’m prone to say, and Hall of Famers generally don’t get to Cooperstown merely by following their median projections for the final decade of their careers. They exceed expectations, often for years at a time, because that’s what the best players do. Via ZiPS, Freeman has a 49% chance of reaching 2,500 hits, and a 32% chance of reaching 3,000 hits, the latter of which would pretty much guarantee his election. Meanwhile, he’s got a 51% chance at 400 homers, and a 35% chance at 450, though just a 5% chance at 500, a milestone that has become less predictive of Hall of Fame berths in the wake of the steroid era anyway.

Those traditional milestones may be important to Freeman’s case, because on the advanced statistical front, he’ll likely fall short of the JAWS standard unless he produces a few more seasons in line with his best ones. The good news is that Freeman’s 31.9 peak WAR leaves plenty of room for improvement, because he’s got some comparatively middling seasons within; his best seven seasons in descending order of WAR, are 6.3, 5.6, 5.3, 4.7, 4.0, and 3.0 twice. Those last two would be replaced by his 2021 and ’22 ZiPS projections, taking his peak score to 35.2 (the same, incidentally, as that of David Ortiz), and lifting his JAWS as based on the career total above to 46.7. That’s still good for only 25th all-time, ahead of only six of the 21 enshrined first basemen but only one BBWAA-elected one, namely Tony Perez.

Freeman almost certainly has to get into the five-win range multiple times to improve his chances in terms of WAR and JAWS, and yes, it’s a bummer that he was robbed of an opportunity to do so while swinging such a hot bat this year, but in that regard he can stand in line with all of the candidates who missed time due to military service or strikes. Such context is always necessary to add to an evaluation of a player’s Hall of Fame case, but if Freeman doesn’t approach this level again, he’s not getting in anyway. Of the 12 first basemen with exactly three seasons of 5.0 WAR or better, only Thome, Harmon Killebrew, and Orlando Cepeda are in the Hall, the first two thanks largely to their home run totals (Killebrew had 586); Thome exceeds the JAWS standard (57.2 vs. 54.8) and wasn’t far off the peak standard (41.5 vs. 42.7). Among eligible first basemen outside the Hall, Mark McGwire has the most seasons of at least 5.0 WAR, with eight, though it’s not WAR but PED connections that have kept him outside. Keith Hernandez has six such seasons; Helton, Dolph Camilli, and John Olerud five; McGriff, Jack Fornier, Jason Giambi, Don Mattingly, Rafael Palmeiro, and Bill White four. Among active first basemen, Votto has six, Miguel Cabrera five, and Goldschmidt four, though to be fair, they’re all older than Freeman.

So again, Freeman probably needs some big seasons in the WAR department. Odds-wise, he has a 45% chance of getting to 60 WAR according to ZiPS, with a 37% chance of getting to 65, a 27% chance of getting to 70, and a 19% chance of getting to 75. Particularly to get to 65 or higher, it would be virtually impossible for Freeman not to increase his peak score in the process of boosting his WAR. Eyeballing it, I’d guess that based on his odds of reaching traditional milestones — primarily his hit total — Freeman probably has somewhere around a 35-40% chance at a Hall of Fame berth, but based on his odds of reaching the JAWS standard, it’s more like 25-30% (70.0/40.0/55.0 would do it). Those aren’t particularly favorable odds, but they’re not long-shots either; in fact, they’re right in the range of batting averages and on-base percentages. The longer Freeman can keep posting those .300 AVG, .400 OBP seasons, the more likely it is he’ll outdo the projections above and improve his chances of making it to Cooperstown.





Brooklyn-based Jay Jaffe is a senior writer for FanGraphs, the author of The Cooperstown Casebook (Thomas Dunne Books, 2017) and the creator of the JAWS (Jaffe WAR Score) metric for Hall of Fame analysis. He founded the Futility Infielder website (2001), was a columnist for Baseball Prospectus (2005-2012) and a contributing writer for Sports Illustrated (2012-2018). He has been a recurring guest on MLB Network and a member of the BBWAA since 2011, and a Hall of Fame voter since 2021. Follow him on BlueSky @jayjaffe.bsky.social.

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Jack CashionMember since 2019
5 years ago

The JAWS effect: Players that get a dedicated JAWS article receive a 5% bump to their HOF chances

Smiling PolitelyMember since 2018
5 years ago
Reply to  Jack Cashion

Is a Jaffe write-up the anti-Madden Cover?

DDMember since 2020
5 years ago

Jay – does the 2020 season get weighted differently for JAWS? I mean, if he played 162 games at this level his WAR would be more than double, and significantly boosts his JAWS vs others who didn’t have such a limited season schedule to work with.

TKDCMember since 2016
5 years ago
Reply to  Jay Jaffe

In fact, it is exceedingly unlikely that Freeman would have posted a 187 wRC+ in a 162 game schedule.

How about the MVP? I’d think that still basically counts the same.

Cave Dameron
5 years ago

Freddie Freeman is one of the greatest pure hitters of all time.

tung_twista
5 years ago
Reply to  Cave Dameron

If this is a joke, I fail to see the humor in it.
Freeman is 88th in all time by wrc+ through age 31 (min 4000 PA) and
82nd in all time by batting runs through age 31.
Freeman is a great player with a decent shot at making it into Cooperstown, let’s leave it at that.

Cave Dameron
5 years ago
Reply to  tung_twista

As an overall hitter he is great but not elite. But in terms of PURE HITTING he is elite.

Greg SimonsMember since 2016
5 years ago
Reply to  Cave Dameron

What do you mean by PURE HITTING? It’s easy to declare but maybe more difficult to define.

Cave Dameron
5 years ago
Reply to  Greg Simons

Pure:
“not mixed or adulterated with any other substance or material”
or
“free of any contamination”
Hope that helps.

TKDCMember since 2016
5 years ago
Reply to  tung_twista

So, like “one of the greatest” if you are putting 100-150 people in that category, would make sense.

TKDCMember since 2016
5 years ago

If Freeman signs an extension and the Braves are as good as they look like they could be for the length of the Acuña/Albies deals, he will certainly get a pretty big bump. He seems like a guy that will make the HOF if there is a decently colorable argument in his favor.

fjtorres
5 years ago
Reply to  TKDC

The narrative argument?
The Jim Rice one?
Or the Harold Baines one?

TKDCMember since 2016
5 years ago
Reply to  fjtorres

Thinking more like the Kirby Puckett narrative (hopefully without the subsequent DV allegations). Although it’s hard to say how much the way Puckett had to retire played, he was already 36 so really expecting a lot more from him would have been foolish. I also like this narrative because it includes 2 WS wins. I’d like that.

Kevbot034
5 years ago

How much does intangible stuff like “career entirely as a Brave” or “great team guy” and “leader who was through rebuild” actually impact players? Because Freddie is an icon on a legacy team filled with icons historically, which has to count for something.

v2miccaMember since 2016
5 years ago
Reply to  Kevbot034

Well, as this may be a relevant comp, in the case of Dale Murphy, it doesn’t count for enough.

TKDCMember since 2016
5 years ago
Reply to  v2micca

Murphy was killed by a low batting average and perhaps more frustratingly by coming up two dingers short of 400. You could also say he was killed by injuries that led to him leaving the Braves and playing some forgettable seasons in Philly and a downright depressing stint in Colorado.

But he played on one playoff team in Atlanta. This was before the Braves became the team that has won 18 division titles (and 2 wild cards) in the last 29 completed seasons; with an assumption of at least success moving forward, too.

However, by no means is Freddie likely to make the hall if he falls apart in the next few seasons. Factors like these may matter in close cases, but if they carried real weight Don Mattingly would be in the Hall, though again, while he played on the Yankees, those Yankees weren’t the *Yankees*.

Perhaps Bernie Williams is a comp. And perhaps Acuña ends up being the Derek Jeter that sort of sucks away any of the extra credit assuming his career continues to take off.

Now, Freddie seems to be getting more recognition in MVP voting than Bernie Baseball did, but from 96-02, he received MVP votes 6 times, was an All star 5 times, won 4 gold gloves, a silver slugger and a batting title. He played his whole career on the Yankees and had ~50 WAR. He was, to my knowledge, very much liked inside the game. Still, his 287 homers and .297 batting average, short of 2500 hits, not enough to get any real consideration for the Hall.

kojo
5 years ago
Reply to  v2micca

Except Dale Murphy didn’t play for a legacy team. The Braves were a bottom dweller throughout his tenure with the club, generally finishing in fifth or sixth place out of six teams in all but four seasons, winning the division once, coming in second twice, and finishing fourth once.

Freeman, however, is on a Braves team that has since built a legacy. It is a team that has won the division three years in a row and stands a good chance of doing so again next year. It’s competitive window looks wide open, as it has a wealth of young talent, and no other team in the division looks good enough to challenge it for first place in the short-term.

tomerafan
5 years ago

It’s wonderful for Freeman to get the recognition of a stand-alone post. But he will also pale significantly by comparison to Votto; Votto is about 6 years older but I can’t see Freeman catching him in terms of stats. Freeman also comes in just behind Goldschmidt for me, but the next 3-5 years for both of them will say a lot about their careers in total (and Goldy had a nice rebound this short season). All three compare favorably to Rizzo, who is a nice first baseman but 4th on this list.

Freeman is getting better; take out the 2019 injury and he’s on a nice curve that hasn’t yet met age-resistance. It matches the eye test; he has gone from a dangerous at bat to a lethal at bat every time up. I like Freddie Freeman quite a bit and I think he’s the clear-cut NL MVP this strange, short season. But I think he has a steep, steep climb to the Hall of Fame. I think his path to get there would have to be not only stats-based, but also “career with one team” based. A full-season MVP award would help; a WS ring or two will as well. As much as we can argue whether or not a team recognition should make the difference, these are the things – more than another point or two of WAR – that could separate him from Votto or Goldy.

Antonio BananasMember since 2026
5 years ago
Reply to  tomerafan

This. Freeman is sort of a poor man’s Joey Votto. Bat control and plate discipline without the huge power numbers you traditionally think of from a first baseman.

TKDCMember since 2016
5 years ago
Reply to  tomerafan

Freeman is running about 2.5 WAR behind Votto at the same age, and 1.5 ahead of Goldy. Now, Freeman has two full seasons on both of them, but if you take away those two seasons, that only knocks about 2 WAR off Freeman’s total. He was a decent hitter and a bad fielder, but he was in MLB while the other two were riding buses. Also, if you cut the last 102 games off Goldy and Votto’s age 30 season, I’d bet Freeman is nearly equal to both, even taking away his small early career advantage.

tomerafan
5 years ago
Reply to  TKDC

Votto is 37, in the decline phase, and still has a .300/.400/.500 triple slash and 150 career wRC+. A career Pham(n) is pretty dang noteworthy, though Votto is at risk of losing that career line as he plays out the last three years on his contract.

You’re right, Votto has <3 WAR more than Freeman through their age 31 season. But, as you noted, I think Freeman has 3 years on Votto in that Freeman was rookie-eligible in 2011 as a 22 year old while Votto was rookie-eligible in 2008 as an old 24 year-old (turned 25 late-season).

And while not stats-based, Votto getting robbed on the 2017 MVP award hurts the resume. He should have two full-season MVP awards. As it is, Votto has three top-3 MVP finishes in an era where , in my opinion, it's harder for 1B to win the award. This year will be Freeman's first top-3 finish (though Freeman does have a 4th, 5th and 6th place, while Votto has two 6th's and a 7th…)

Votto averaged 5-WAR his next three seasons after that age 31 year… I think Freeman can do that, but who knows whether any aged 32-34 player will do that.

Freeman has two full seasons on both of them, but if you take away those two seasons, that only knocks about 2 WAR off Freeman’s total. He was a decent hitter and a bad fielder, but he was in MLB while the other two were riding buses.

I refuse to penalize Joey Votto for the fact that the Reds front office in 2004-2007 didn’t value OBP and true batting skills the way we all came to do several years later. But even with those years riding buses, Votto has 57 fWAR and 62 bWAR. Freeman has 38 for both. I stand by my point that I can’t see Freeman catching him in terms of stats (or WAR as a measure of stats that matter).

There are so many bumps in Freeman’s (MVP-worthy) 2020 short-season numbers… 3 mph of exit velocity; highest walk rate of his career by about 33%, lowest strikeout rate of his career my about 25%, etc. He also played his full 2020 season against some BAD pitching in the NL east. The Mets were a known dumpster fire; the Phillies had about the worst bullpen, etc. The unbalanced schedule of 2020 hasn’t really been taken into account, IMHO, in evaluating individual results – not the least of which is that batters seemingly faced *the same pitchers* more often than ever in short time spans, which I would argue favors really great hitters over good or mediocre pitchers. Or the fact that reduced travel favors batters more than starting pitchers since SP often (not always) have rest between the travel day and their start. 4 out 5 of traditional SP have that recovery day; batters often don’t.

Is it possible? Sure – Freeman is an amazing hitter, and by all reports incredibly dedicated to his craft. But I don’t think he catches Votto.

TKDCMember since 2016
5 years ago
Reply to  tomerafan

I fudged up the numbers and you did too, so to clean this up, Freeman has 3 seasons on Votto on the front end (mentioning their exact ages is unnecessary in this case, Votto and Goldy were born on 9/10; Freeman on 9/12).

If you take out Freeman’s 5 WAR season at age 23, the comparable ages 24-30 (again, this is Freeman’s age 30 season, not 31) would be a bigger advantage to Votto. Goldy would be a lot closer. But it is also fair to consider that Freeman was compiling many PAs as a 21-22 hitter that, like Votto’s decline numbers, work against his prime rate statistics. And it’s worth mentioning that the Zips projections in this very article put Freeman with a higher WAR total than Votto has now when he reaches the same age.

And to be clear, I’m not saying that Freeman has been as good as Votto through age 30, but that it is closer than “pale significantly” would suggest. On the other hand, I don’t see the argument for Goldy over Freeman. Freeman is two years younger, and down 3.4 WAR with nearly identical wRC+. He has also been better if you look at just the last year. If you look at just the last 2 years. If you look at just the last 3 years. Or if you look at the past 4 years. Or 5 years. This is true for both WAR and wRC+.

emh1969
5 years ago
Reply to  TKDC

Goldy vs Freeman is interesting because their career numbers are so similar. But, as you’ve noted, Freeman is two years younger which means he should be able to easily pass Goldy in terms of career numbers.

At the same time, Goldy does has some advantages of his own. For one thing, his 7-yr peak WAR (via BR) is higher and it’s unlikely Freeman can pass him on that. He also has more seasons of 30+ homeruns, 100+ runs scored, and 100+ RBI’s which will appeal to the more traditional voters. And for those who value postseason performance, Goldy has clearly been better.

In the end, it will all come down to health and how they age. Mark Teixeira had 47.9 BR WAR through age 32, but only finished with 50.6 career WAR.

tomerafan
5 years ago
Reply to  emh1969

I have no followup other than to say that I really like your posts and your insight. (and that Teixeira is a great statistical comp there. so I guess I did have a follow up.)

tomerafan
5 years ago
Reply to  TKDC

I fudged up the numbers and you did too, so to clean this up, Freeman has 3 seasons on Votto on the front end (mentioning their exact ages is unnecessary in this case, Votto and Goldy were born on 9/10; Freeman on 9/12).

Dang – you are correct. My bad; for some reason I had Freeman as an early season birthday but I am wrong.

On the other hand, I don’t see the argument for Goldy over Freeman.

It’s closer than Votto, to be sure… I’m not saying that WAR is the be-all, end-all, single source, but Goldy has 10% greater career WAR in about 5% less plate appearances. (Yes, in absolute terms, it’s a <4 WAR difference which is not significant over that time period, but is something.)

Goldschmidt was a stolen base threat in his prime, which is a skill that Freeman doesn't have. I also believe Goldschmidt grades out a little better defensively. And has done all that at two years older than Freeman. So, yeah, they're close, but there's plenty of reasons to make the argument for Goldy over Freeman.

TKDCMember since 2016
5 years ago
Reply to  tomerafan

To go back to something else, Votto was not robbed of the 2017 MVP. Stanton was a very worthy pick.

There are some traditionalist points in favor of Goldy over Freeman, who played on some truly dreadful Braves teams even as he was breaking out into an elite player. I’m not sure how much even traditionalist care about the round numbers (30, 100, .300, etc) for individual seasons, but at Fangraphs it seems we should understand that Goldy was getting those playing home games in Arizona. Also, Freeman’s extra years will help him with career traditional numbers. But to me the 10% more WAR in 5% fewer plate appearances is just not persuasive because it relies on Freeman’s MLB career that corresponds to Goldy riding buses. If you look at their careers looking at only the same ages, it doesn’t look great for Goldy, and on top of that I would bet that Freeman’s next two years are much better than the last two for Goldy. But we will see, I guess.

tomerafan
5 years ago
Reply to  TKDC

Truly, I’m not trying to be argumentative; I just love baseball too much to move on. But I do think you’re cherry-picking pieces of an argument to note that Goldy played in Arizona without acknowledging how Truist Park is a bit of a bandbox in the NL East.

Also, you’re right that my use of the word “robbed” as regards the 2017 NL MVP vote is a bit hyperbolic. It was nowhere as near as egregious as a dozen or so other award ballots over the last 20 years, and there’s a compelling case for Stanton, who brutalized baseballs that year in a tough park. I thought Votto should have won, and still do, and I’m not a Reds fan and have no bias in that… but I’ve never understood how four voters gave their first place vote to Goldy that year when Votto was by far the better player at the same position… (and yes, I know that some voters view “value” as subjective, and the Reds were last in their division, etc.).

So I guess I’ve always been bummed for Votto that he kind of lost an MVP at Goldy’s expense. But Votto was not robbed the way Johan Santana was in 2005, etc. Fair to call me on that.

TKDCMember since 2016
5 years ago
Reply to  tomerafan

What I’m saying is that wRC+ cuts through the noise of individual season traditional numbers and park factor. Cut through that and Freeman and Goldy are virtually tied despite Freeman being rushed to MLB while Goldy was seasoned in the minors. Freeman’s success also is more concentrated the last five years while Goldy was better 5-9 years ago rather than the past few years.

Mike NMN
5 years ago

Interesting post….made more so by the reference to Bill White. I hadn’t realized he was quite that good for a stretch, because he wasn’t a true slugger, and he didn’t age out particularly well. But, he was involved in one of the more interesting trades. St. Louis traded him, Dick Groat, and Bob Uecker to the Phillies for Pat Corrales, Art Mahaffey and Alex Johnson.
White later became a broadcaster, and then President of the National League. Dick Groat also became an announcer–of basketball. Bob Uecker, we all know about.

tomerafan
5 years ago
Reply to  Mike NMN

Subsequently, Pat Corrales, as a Manager, wound up in every single pack of baseball cards that I bought between 1980 and 1985.

Mike NMN
5 years ago
Reply to  tomerafan

I had a lot of Bo Belinskis in mine…

v2miccaMember since 2016
5 years ago

Freeman’s Hall of Fame odds rely heavily on what he can accomplish in the next 2 to 3 years. Given that he is a 1B and likely will handling DH roles as he ages, the decline curve could be gentler to him than most. The OBP will likely age well, but I suspect he only has about 2 years of elite power left in his bat. If he can leverage that power to produce a pair of elite seasons in 2021 and 2022, then decline gracefully into his age 40 season, he’s got a legit chance.

Smiling PolitelyMember since 2018
5 years ago
Reply to  v2micca

If the DH sticks around, he might be able to build a numbers case

Ivan_GrushenkoMember since 2016
5 years ago

HOF or not he’s replaced Fred Tenney, John Morill or whomever as greatest Brave 1B of all time.

johnnywaffles
5 years ago
Reply to  Ivan_Grushenko

Joe Adcock?

Handsome Wes
5 years ago

Random question,

Is there a relationship between how many years a player spends with one ballclub and the number of Hall of Fame votes that person gets?

Does a player’s status as a “fan favorite” earn him, like, a five percent boost in his HOF vote total (or his vet committee chances) as opposed to a player who bounced around for his career? On the other hand, does it hurt his chances because only one fanbase got the chance to see him play?

I am thinking about how Tim Raines got a significant boost because of the dedication from Expos fans. I also think – would a Zack Greinke type have people passionately arguing for his induction. I don’t know, just something in the back of my mind.

Sn0wman
5 years ago

This will be well-worn territory for Braves fans, but may be of interest to others. If you look at Freeman’s career, you’ll notice several years at the start with 18, 20, 22 HRs, and then a sudden rise that has kept him between (IIRC) 28 and 34 since. The difference (or at least the thing to which he attributes it) was a change in his batting practice habits. During those low-power years, he BPed the same way he plays in-game. 4-5 years ago, he began bending over more (not quite a crouch, I’m a bit stumped as to how to effectively describe it), and hitting all balls right at where the shortstop would be. Quite by design, he stopped hitting BP homers completely. Then in-game, he straightens back up, but continues to use that swing that had in the bent-over stance hit the ball towards the 6-hole, and the balls leave the park at a higher rate. I’ve never completely understood how that works, or how he ever came up with the idea.