Hunter Brown Is Framber Valdez in a Justin Verlander-Shaped Container

James A. Pittman-USA TODAY Sports

Sportswriters are a miserable bunch. We slog through box scores and transcripts of quotes from practice and write about games that will be forgotten in hours. Then Hunter Brown falls out of the sky.

The Astros’ new starting pitcher not only has a windup like Justin Verlander’s, he grew up outside of Detroit and idolized Verlander as a kid! Can you believe it? That’s a human interest story fit to make J. Jonah Jameson spit out his stogie and forget all about those pictures of Spider-Man.

Even their repertoires look similar: An upper-90s four-seamer thrown about half the time, accompanied by a slider and a curveball. It’s the meat-and-two-sides combo you’ll find at most barbecue joints. There are differences, of course. Verlander throws his slider more than his curve, while Brown is the opposite. Brown also throws everything harder than Verlander does; his secondaries clock in about 6 mph faster than the three-time Cy Young winner’s.

Regardless, people look at Brown and say the baseball equivalent of “he has his mother’s eyes.” So why does Brown perform more like Framber Valdez?

By any standard, Verlander is one of the best pitchers of his generation and a surefire Hall of Famer. But as a matter of personal aesthetic preference, I find Valdez more fun to watch. I’ve always loved sinkerballers, pitchers who use multiple fastball shapes to keep hitters just confused enough that they can’t square the ball up. Power pitchers beat batters up. Sinkerballers tell batters to stop hitting themselves. There’s an archness to this method of pitching, which Valdez embodies as well as anyone in the game.

Which is not to say that brisket, beans, and cornbread can’t be effective. I find a repertoire without heavy changeup usage to be kind of meager. Brown might disagree.

Brisket (Fastball):

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Beans (Curveball):

Cornbread (Slider):

In order to understand the difference between Verlander and Valdez, let’s start with an extremely obvious point about pitching. Pitchers want to go up there and strike everyone out. That’s not really an attainable goal for anyone not named Edwin Díaz, but it’s something to aspire to.

Failing a swing-and-miss, pitchers can also influence the kind of contact hitters make. If a hitter guesses timing and vertical location correctly, he’s going to crush the ball. If the hitter times it right but gets vertical location wrong, he’ll make contact but at a launch angle inhospitable to hard contact.

Verlander and Valdez are among the league’s best at inducing weak contact, though they do so by different means. Verlander leans heavily on a four-seam fastball that he uses up in the zone, so when batters miss, they tend to get under the ball. Valdez’s tentpole pitch is a sinker that, come on, let’s not always see the same hands… Yes, that’s correct, it sinks, causing batters to hit the top half of the ball. If you can’t get a swing-and-miss, a pop up or a weak groundball is the next-best thing.

The nature of the contact Verlander and Valdez induce is quite different, but their quality of contact ends up being similar:

Verlander vs. Valdez on Batted Balls, Part I
Pitcher Topped% Under% Barrel% wOBACON xwOBACON
Justin Verlander 36th 5th 13th 1st 7th
Framber Valdez 1st 45th 9th 6th 6th
SOURCE: Baseball Savant
Rank Among Qualified Starters (45 pitchers)

And while the results generated by such contact shouldn’t surprise anyone, here are the effects of what Verlander and Valdez did in 2022:

Verlander vs. Valdez on Batted Balls, Part 2
Pitcher LD% LD% Rank GB% GB% Rank IFFB% IFFB% Rank
Justin Verlander 18.5 30th 37.9 107th 19.7 1st
Framber Valdez 17.5 14th 66.5 1st 9.1 74th
Minimum 100 IP in 2022 (140 pitchers)

I do worry that simply calling Valdez the best groundball pitcher in baseball understates things. He is an outlier of historic proportions, as Justin Choi wrote back in May of last year. Valdez led the majors in GB/FB ratio last season. In second place was Giants right-hander Logan Webb. Remember that guy? In the 2021 playoffs he got so many Dodgers to beat pitches into the grass the mole people who live under the stadium thought they were being bombed.

Webb’s GB/FB ratio last season was 2.38. Valdez’s was 4.16. In 2021, Valdez’s GB/FB ratio was 4.73, though he came up about four starts short of qualifying for the ERA title and doesn’t appear on the leaderboard as a result.

Even getting over 3.00 takes some doing. Valdez appeared in his first major league game in 2018. Here’s a complete list of qualified starters who have posted a GB/FB of 3.00 or higher since then:

A Complete List of Qualified Starters With a GB/FB Ratio of 3.00 or Higher, Since 2018
Pitcher Year GB/FB
Framber Valdez 2022 4.16
Framber Valdez 2020 3.08

Back to Brown, the Verlander acolyte. Because they have similar deliveries and at least nominally similar repertoires, they should produce similar outcomes. But they don’t.

In his brief major league experience in 2022, Brown posted a GB/FB ratio of 3.09 and a GB% of 68%. That’s more instructive than looking at something like his ERA, or even his strikeout rate, but it’s important to remember that even including the playoffs, Brown only pitched 24 innings in the majors, only faced 94 batters. That’s not a huge sample.

But if Brown’s high groundball rate is a fluke, it’s one that’s followed him his entire professional career, which comprises 240 1/3 regular-season innings over four years. Brown has never posted a GB/FB ratio under 1.75 in a minor league stop of any length, and counting parts of three minor league seasons and his major league stint, his GB/FB as a professional is 2.21. That would’ve beaten any qualified starter in the majors last season apart from Valdez and Webb.

So what gives?

Let’s start with the fastball. Last season, Brown’s came in 1.6 mph harder than Verlander’s on average, with slightly less spin. Some of the velocity discrepancy is probably down to Brown pitching out of the bullpen, but the two pitches have similar movement profiles. Verlander gets a little more arm-side run on his heater, but the difference isn’t huge.

The fastball location, however, is wildly different between the two pitches. Verlander pounds the top of the strike zone with his fastball to lefties, up and away to righties:

Brown doesn’t do that. He works lower in the zone, and toward two different spots. His fastball usage heat map is probably a little wonky based on his only having thrown 164 last year, but it looks like a pair of lungs:

Just by working lower in the zone, Brown is probably going to induce a few more grounders. And sure enough, he had a groundball rate of 52.4% on his four-seamer, compared to 32.5% for Verlander.

The other difference between Brown and Verlander illustrates the limitations in pitch nomenclature, because it’s truly wild how many different velocities and shapes of pitch fall under the “slider” umbrella. Maybe this can’t be helped, because you know how a hybrid slider-curveball gets called a “slurve?” If you do that with “slider” and “cutter” you get a bad word. So instead, we call two different pitches with hugely different characteristics by the same name. Look at this chart. Does Brown’s slider have more in common with Verlander’s slider, or with Valdez’s sinker?

What Even Is A Slider Anyway?
Pitch Velocity Vertical Drop Horizontal Break Whiff% GB%
Verlander Slider 87.4 mph 31.0 in. 4.0 in. 34.6 39.5
Brown Slider 93.2 mph 24.8 in. 2.8 in. 21.1 77.8
Valdez Sinker 93.9 mph 24.2 in. 14.4 in. 12.1 68.6
SOURCE: Baseball Savant

Brown’s slider is as hard as Valdez’s sinker, with equal vertical break but a horizontal movement profile more similar to Verlander’s slider. The difference is that when Verlander throws a slider, hitters see something with a huge difference to his fastball in terms of vertical break and velocity, enough to swing and miss entirely. With Brown, the velocity gap between the fastball and slider isn’t big enough to generate a whiff, and the vertical drop isn’t great enough to generate consistent swings and misses. Merely the next-best thing: hitters just pound the slider into the ground.

We’ll see how Brown adjusts to a full season in the majors, and likely out of the rotation, and whether his usage patterns or pitch characteristics change. But his case, at least so far, illustrates the limits of making player comparisons based on appearance. Not to wave away the Verlander-Brown story, of course, because it’s a delightful anecdote. But while he might look like Verlander, he pitches more like Valdez.





Michael is a writer at FanGraphs. Previously, he was a staff writer at The Ringer and D1Baseball, and his work has appeared at Grantland, Baseball Prospectus, The Atlantic, ESPN.com, and various ill-remembered Phillies blogs. Follow him on Twitter, if you must, @MichaelBaumann.

25 Comments
Oldest
Newest Most Voted
Ivan_GrushenkoMember since 2016
3 years ago

Valdez is a compliment to any rookie. He’s one to watch for sure. The physical resemblance thing is fun but meaningless as you say. Avisail Garcia might resemble Miguel Cabrera but doesn’t hit like him. Then of course there’s Taylor and Tyler Rogers. Ozzie and Jose Canseco.

Mahoney
3 years ago
Reply to  Ivan_Grushenko

And my favorite fun pair from a different angle – Tony Gwynn and Ichiro. Crazy amount of similarity as ballplayers, but couldn’t be any more lacking in physical resemblance.

free-range turducken
3 years ago

So whose eyes does Max Scherzer have?

Fun-Hating DorkMember since 2019
3 years ago

One of mom’s and one of dad’s?

mariodegenzgz
3 years ago

“I’ve always loved sinkerballers, pitchers who use multiple fastball shapes to keep hitters just confused enough that they can’t square the ball up. Power pitchers beat batters up. Sinkerballers tell batters to stop hitting themselves. There’s an archness to this method of pitching, which Valdez embodies as well as anyone in the game.”

YES. That’s one of the main reasons Sandy Alcántara is so fun to watch: he’s a sinkerballer at heart. As a spectator, you always want the balance between overpowering stuff and enough balls in play to make fielding (which is a lot of fun) matter. Framber, Sandy and others ride that line very well. Very good piece.

On Brown, that slider is really a cutter in all aspects: velo, shape, spin profile. So he’s really a four-seam/cutter/curveball pitcher, whereas Verlander came up as a four-seam/big curve/changeup righty. Brown has never resembled Verlander that much to me, not even mechanically (also, clearly not in the same stratosphere of arm strength). Their arm action is wildly different, and I don’t know how comfortable I’d be with him as a starter right now. His four-seam got hit quite hard last year, and I’d start throwing it up if I were him.

cowdiscipleMember since 2016
3 years ago
Reply to  mariodegenzgz

Maybe we can call it a cut slider.

kingharbaughMember since 2021
3 years ago
Reply to  mariodegenzgz

I’ve never really understood the mechanics thing either. Other than pre movement stuff they’re not all that similar, and most of that is driven by differences in stature.

Last edited 3 years ago by kingharbaugh
sadtromboneMember since 2020
3 years ago

My first thought upon seeing the pitch for this article was: I don’t think anyone has comped Hunter Brown to Justin Verlander until now, unless they were lazily looking at the similar uniforms and skin color.

But it turns out there are a whole bunch of people out there who have lazily made this comp, and done even better than that by showing a side-by-side look at the mechanics and everything. But…it’s not that surprising that they have different results. If I had the same mechanics as Justin Verlander, I can assure you, I would not be striking out guys at the major league level. I’m not sure why anyone would think that.

baubo
3 years ago
Reply to  sadtrombone

Oh this is more because Hunter Brown isn’t really that much in the news (not a top 10 prospect, didn’t pitch much in the majors, basically sat on the bench during the Astros postseason). But when people did talk about him there was definitely quite a bit of “hey did you know he was from Detroit growing up wanting to be Verlander” mixed into talking about him.

You’ll definitely hear more if he gets into the Astros rotation this year and pitches well.

Mahoney
3 years ago
Reply to  sadtrombone

Lol, just recently Senor Gato made a Justin Verlander comp for Andrew Painter. I don’t think it was based on mechanics so much as the total package and potential, and as such it’s a much less lazy comp than those being made for Hunter Brown.

SenorGato
3 years ago
Reply to  Mahoney

Kiley McDaniel dropped the Verlander comp for Painter on ESPN yesterday too! Great minds or something

sadtromboneMember since 2020
3 years ago
Reply to  Mahoney

Comps for pitchers are hard because they break. And Verlander is basically the opposite of that. If you want to comp pitching prospects to major league pitchers, guys like Glasnow, Ryu, and James Paxton are the guys who immediately come to mind. Most super promising pitchers have their arms fall off.

I still sometimes comp pitching prospects to current pitchers but I probably shouldn’t.

Mahoney
3 years ago
Reply to  sadtrombone

Sad but true. I’d comp to one of the ones you mention, or maybe a Michael Pineda, but it feels bad to comp someone to a guy who broke down.

mattbrown006Member since 2021
3 years ago
Reply to  sadtrombone

Astros fan here… watch most of the games and follow all the stats. I heard the comparison a lot during the season, but to me the better comp to Verlander is Christian Javier. The pitch shapes and results are much more alike than Verlander/Brown.

proiste
3 years ago
Reply to  sadtrombone

Nobody reputable has, but there were definitely plenty of TV broadcasters and people on social media who were doing so (almost certainly because they were lazily looking at uniforms and skin color).

It all seemed very silly at the time, I’m glad someone put it to rest in an informed way

Fletchiro
3 years ago

I’m just getting my mind blown by the fact that Valdez gets 14.4 in of horizontal movement on a pitch he throws at 94 mph

Fun-Hating DorkMember since 2019
3 years ago
Reply to  Fletchiro

Watch a Clay Holmes sinker: last year he averaged 16.8in horizontal while throwing 97 (and basically the same drop over less time).

SenorGato
3 years ago
Reply to  Fletchiro

On a 200 inning arm that shined during the playoffs too…Guy’s a badass

Joe Joe
3 years ago

Brown got a ton of called strikes in his limited call up. Batters flat out refused to swing much on the lower and outer thirds of the strike zone. I’d like to see Brown have a fastball distribution to be rotated 90 degrees ( either up or down instead of the left and right lung). He should get more swings and misses up, and he should continue to get either grounders or called strikes low. If batters swing at more low fastballs, they will also chase more curves below the zone.

As long as Brown keeps hitting enough pitches in the zone low, batters are going to have adjust and swing on pitches they can’t elevate.

MRDXolMember since 2021
3 years ago

grateful that someone is making the public aware of the plight of the mole people of Chavez Ravine

SenorGato
3 years ago
Reply to  MRDXol

Probably too little too late, pretty sure they were purged during the pandemic for being unseemly

Exile in St. LouisMember since 2024
3 years ago

Great article. JV was the regular season ace but Framber was the workhorse + playoff ace. Framber pitched 4 playoff games. Astros averaged 4 runs in those games. Team went 4-0. 25 IP, 4 ER, 33 K. Pena was great, but Framber was the playoff MVP. Astros don’t need Brown to be great. They need him to stay healthy and be Luis Garcia.

wcatbb
3 years ago

Peña was the no doubt MVP throughout the playoffs, and while Framber was a stud, Pressly was 2nd most valuable (w/ an assist to Chas McCormick)

Agreed on Brown. If he puts up 150 IP the Astros rotation could be better than last year.

Last edited 3 years ago by deucebigalow4
AlbyMember since 2017
3 years ago

“Clider” is a bad word?

Sporter's Five HorsesMember since 2016
3 years ago

Appreciated the Briskets, Beans, and Cornbread. Sprinkle in some MLB leading Whoa Bacon and you’ve got yourself a good greasy spoon on the Houston staff