Joey Votto Faced a Four-Man Outfield

Joey Votto is doing that thing again. You know, that thing where he doesn’t make outs. That thing where he makes himself the one guy on the Reds worth watching on a regular basis. Under even normal circumstances, Votto is arguably the game’s best hitter. Over the past three weeks or so, Votto’s caught fire. He’s led baseball in average, wRC+, and OBP, surpassing second place in the latter stat by damn near 100 points. In case you haven’t heard, Votto has reached base at least two times for 19 games in a row. Only Ted Williams, Pete Rose, and Barry Bonds have put together longer such streaks, and Williams’ leading streak is but two games away.

Votto goes on these runs where he’s almost impossible to put away. The Cubs had to try to contain him Monday night, and, to give away the end, they didn’t. Votto extended his streak, collecting three hits. Now, the Cubs won by 10 runs, so, whatever. The Reds can’t pitch. But it’s not interesting that the Cubs destroyed the Reds in a baseball game. Rather, it’s interesting how the Cubs tried to defend Votto in the top of the fifth. You’ll notice something different.

That’s Kris Bryant, listed as the third baseman. That’s third baseman Kris Bryant hanging out in left-center, between Kyle Schwarber and Jon Jay. And Bryant isn’t positioned as some kind of shallow rover — he’s positioned as a full-on outfielder, meaning the Cubs had four outfielders in their alignment. You could even argue that Anthony Rizzo and Tommy La Stella were so deep that the Cubs practically had six outfielders. But most people would interpret this as a four-man-outfield formation. Bryant seemed to be enjoying himself.

This was a Joe Maddon call. From Mark Sheldon, postgame:

You Aren't a FanGraphs Member
It looks like you aren't yet a FanGraphs Member (or aren't logged in). We aren't mad, just disappointed. We get it. You want to read this article. But before we let you get back to it, we'd like to point out a few of the good reasons why you should become a Member. 1. Ad Free viewing! We won't bug you with this ad, or any other. 2. Unlimited articles! Non-Members only get to read 10 free articles a month. Members never get cut off. 3. Dark mode and Classic mode! 4. Custom player page dashboards! Choose the player cards you want, in the order you want them. 5. One-click data exports! Export our projections and leaderboards for your personal projects. 6. Remove the photos on the home page! (Honestly, this doesn't sound so great to us, but some people wanted it, and we like to give our Members what they want.) 7. Even more Steamer projections! We have handedness, percentile, and context neutral projections available for Members only. 8. Get FanGraphs Walk-Off, a customized year end review! Find out exactly how you used FanGraphs this year, and how that compares to other Members. Don't be a victim of FOMO. 9. A weekly mailbag column, exclusively for Members. 10. Help support FanGraphs and our entire staff! Our Members provide us with critical resources to improve the site and deliver new features! We hope you'll consider a Membership today, for yourself or as a gift! And we realize this has been an awfully long sales pitch, so we've also removed all the other ads in this article. We didn't want to overdo it. In case you didn't read all that, here's the short version. Membership includes:
Ad-free browsing
Unlimited FanGraphs & RotoGraphs articles
Historical & platoon projections
Leaderboard & player-page stat heatmaps
One-click data exports
Customizable player-page dashboards
Dark & Classic site modes
Weekly Members-only mailbag
FanGraphs Walk-Off, your year in review
Optional homepage photo removal
Gift articles to non-members

There might be additional times that Votto sees four outfielders during this series. When he was leading the Rays, Maddon noted he employed the strategy against dominant lefty hitters like David Ortiz, Jim Thome and Travis Hafner.

“We’ll continue to throw it out there when we think it’s the right thing to do,” Maddon said.

Buster Olney wrote about four-man outfields in April. He suggested that a few more such alignments might be just around the corner. And as noted in the blockquote, it’s not like this is a *new* experiment, for Maddon — here’s an article about just the same thing from 2006, in Maddon’s first full managerial year. Maddon had long wanted to try something like this, so he’s messed around with it from time to time. To give away the ending, again, Monday’s four-man outfield didn’t work, because Votto simply doubled down the line.

Because of Maddon’s involvement, I’d say the decision was polarizing. There are a lot of people out there who love Maddon for his creativity, for his willingness to think outside the usual box. There’s a whole community of baseball observers who consider Maddon a sort of managerial genius. How many other managers would even think about doing what Maddon did? Reds manager Bryan Price referred to the defensive formation as a “novelty.” Votto had probably never seen the formation before in his professional career. How is that not something to celebrate?

Then there’s the crowd that’s grown tired of hearing about Maddon’s so-called ingenuity. There are at least as many people out there who find Maddon too clever by half, someone needlessly prone to out-thinking himself. When it comes to Joe Maddon, the majority of people are of one of two minds, and it’s rare to find someone in the middle. As such, after Votto defeated the defense by knocking a double, there were claims that Maddon screwed up yet again. In corners of the Internet, fans laughed at Maddon for still getting beat.

I get it. I get both sides, really. I get why Maddon is atypical, and I get why people grow weary of hearing about it. He’s far from the game’s only smart manager, and maybe there are other guys who don’t get enough credit. But here, look — Maddon called for this particular defense. As far as I know, it’s the first we’ve seen of it for a while. We should be happy it happened. Outcome be damned, baseball just saw a four-man outfield, and I think that flexibility is something we can all get behind.

There are different ways to think about this. Votto, on Monday, batted five times. Only once did he see this formation. He saw it against Jose Quintana in the fifth. Later on, with Mike Montgomery on the mound, the defense was normal.

Maddon tried it only once, and Votto doubled. I doubt it’s correct to say Maddon was deterred by that one single plate appearance. Montgomery is just more of a ground-ball pitcher, and besides, you might not want to use the same formation every time. Let’s go back to the top of the fifth. Via Mike Petriello, here’s how the defense looked according to Statcast:

Compare that image to the first screenshot. There’s one change — when the count ran to two strikes, Javier Baez shifted back, and closer to second.

Earlier, Baez might’ve had to respect the possible bunt attempt. Granted, Votto hasn’t bunted for a hit since 2015. Still, no one else has his bat control, so he could’ve bunted, or at least tried a slash. With two strikes, the bunt risk went away, so Baez moved back and over. In that way, this alignment had two sub-alignments. The distinctive outfield remained the same.

With anything like this, one naturally wonders, do the numbers back it up? And here, the numbers send some mixed messages. You’d think that, in order to justify a four-man outfield, you’d want a hitter-pitcher combination that’s particularly ground-ball averse. Since the start of 2015, Quintana has ranked in the 69th percentile in ground-ball rate against left-handed hitters. And, since the start of 2015, Votto has ranked in the 82nd percentile in ground-ball rate against left-handed pitchers. Both those ground-ball rates are around 50%, which is slightly high. And while Votto has pulled most of his grounders against lefties, his ground-ball distribution has been almost exactly average. You don’t think of Votto as a ground-ball hitter, but he’s not really an air-ball guy, at least not against southpaws. Indeed, he ultimately grounded down the line.

On the other hand, here is Votto’s spray chart against lefties since 2015, via Baseball Savant. I’ve marked the approximate locations of the Cubs’ defenders.

That doesn’t look so bad. Does the defense really need four infielders to cover Votto’s grounders? Might three suffice? Might the outfield alignment further reduce the risk of an extra-base hit? I don’t know. Baez can move around pretty well. It’s hard to strike an opposite-field grounder with much authority. An opposite-field ball in the air? Easier to drill, especially with Votto involved.

There are still more considerations. One, there was little for Maddon to lose. His team was ahead by five runs, and there was one out, with nobody on. The leverage index at the time was 0.29, where the average game situation is 1.00. That is, the absolute worst thing that could happen would be Votto shrinking the margin by 20% with one swing. Not so bad, especially given that the Cubs are a lot better than the Reds are. Then there’s the psychological component. Even if the numbers aren’t absolutely clear that the defense should do this thing or that, perhaps there’s some benefit just to the disruption. From the linked article from 2006:

“I thought it was a great idea by our coaching staff,” Wigginton said. “It adds a new look to the hitter. He gets in the box and looks out there and something ain’t right when there are four outfielders.”

That, Maddon said, is the idea behind the shift. “The primary goal is to try to get him to alter his swing,” he said. “What you’d like to see happen is to have him see the shift and see if that gives him a different thought. It’s the gamesmanship mentally that matters, too.”

As far as Maddon was concerned, why not give it a try? Why not see if Votto might be unclear how to respond? Pitchers and batters are always trying to mess with their timing. It’s all part of an effort to confuse. Maddon, to some extent, was trying to be confusing. Votto ultimately didn’t seem to care.

“No matter the infield setup, no matter the alignment of the infield or outfield, I do the exact same thing,” Votto said. “It’s when I get caught up in what’s going on defensively when I get myself into trouble, [like] changing my approach.

“If that turns out to be a detriment to hitting balls in the outfield, then I clearly have to hit it over the outfield and into the stands. That was also something I was thinking about doing.”

So maybe Votto’s head isn’t the right one to try to crawl into. It could be he’s impossible to bother. I understand the argument for why the four-man outfield might not have been optimal. I still don’t think I’d understand the argument against just trying it once. Joe Maddon tried it once, just to see. When Votto came up again, the leverage was even lower, but the defense was standard.

One time out of five on Monday, Joey Votto saw a four-man outfield in front of him. It didn’t seem to make much of a difference, as Votto shot a double where there wouldn’t have been a defender anyway, and that’s in part just a testament to Votto’s incredible skill. But don’t get caught up in a debate over whether the strategy was a smart one, or stupid. I don’t think we have the answer. It’s probably somewhere in between. Maybe it was kind of smart, and maybe it was kind of stupid. But it was definitely very different from what we usually see. That’s the real important thing. A baseball team did something teams typically don’t. Baseball’s long-standing wall of stubbornness can and will be dismantled brick by brick. Here we have one more brick, lying among scattered others on the ground.





Jeff made Lookout Landing a thing, but he does not still write there about the Mariners. He does write here, sometimes about the Mariners, but usually not.

33 Comments
Oldest
Newest Most Voted
Steve Perry
9 years ago

Also in that game, according to the MLB Gameday play by play (4th inning), Anthony Rizzo and Tommy La Stella traded positions for a batter, with La Stella going to 1B and Rizzo to 2B, and swapping back after the batter.

HappyFunBallMember since 2019
9 years ago
Reply to  Steve Perry

They’ve done that ten times now this year. When the opposing manager is paying attention, it has happened that Rizzo was asked to change gloves. In a number of fantasy leagues, Rizzo has earned eligibility at second base.

Steve Perry
9 years ago
Reply to  HappyFunBall

Wasn’t aware they did that. Thanks!

domingotavarez_
9 years ago
Reply to  HappyFunBall

Happy, quiero saber por qué Maddon utiliza el mover a Rizzo a 2B?

Stevens
9 years ago
Reply to  Steve Perry

This is relatively frequent for the Cubs when they want to spook a pitcher attempting to bunt by having Rizzo charge in hard.

Steve Perry
9 years ago
Reply to  Stevens

Thanks! I didn’t know they made that move that frequently.

Garyth
9 years ago
Reply to  Stevens

Actually, the ‘Rizzo shift’ has been largely abandoned for the past two months. The last time this shift was employed was all the way back on June 20th. On that day, Jhoulys Chacin swung on a bunt situation and hit a weak grounder between Rizzo and the pitcher. Glad to see it back, as like this article says, it’s just kind of fun.

Greg GoldenMember since 2016
9 years ago

Love everything about this, but there’s definitely one other guy on the Reds worth watching on a regular basis:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=intidHFZcoY

dtpollittMember since 2016
9 years ago

Cubs homer here, but I think Joe sets the expectation that his players should be ready to play all over the field. The guys seem to respond–Travis Wood played the OF a year or two ago, and Bryant played everything but pitcher, catcher, and second in 2016.

Whether it is due to Joe’s varying defensive expectations, ever-changing lineup, or Theo’s roster construction, I think it is a good idea to try stuff like this out in the regular season. Who knows what happens come crunch time or a wild card game–a severe shift could really help get a big out in a high leverage situation. Plus it gives us another Sullivan post.

Peter BonneyMember since 2023
9 years ago

I would pay to watch an event that consisted of nothing but Joey Votto batting over and over again against all manner of pitcher and defensive alignment.

jjezioraMember since 2022
9 years ago
Reply to  Peter Bonney

I haven’t looked at the exact distribution that closely but his batted ball distribution this year at rough glance looks like it would lead to a lower babip projection than in the past.

YKnotDisco
9 years ago

It could seem strange to think of this season as an unlucky one for Votto. His 2017 BABIP is at .305. That’s down from his career average of .354. What’s his xwOBA?

rg29
9 years ago
Reply to  YKnotDisco

Joey Votto is 3rd in MLB per xwOBA, with a value of 0.428, only 5 points fewer than his actual wOBA. Ahead of him are Mike Trout and Aaron Judge with 0.431 each.

YKnotDisco
9 years ago
Reply to  rg29

I really, really hope that is Joey Votto speaking in 3rd person.

EasyenoughMember since 2016
9 years ago

Maddon’s a great entertainer too.

DominicanRepublican
9 years ago

Go Pards!

Baron Samedi
9 years ago

Joe Maddon such an attention-seeking tool.

Ukranian to Vietnamese to French is back
9 years ago
Reply to  Baron Samedi

Joe Maddon and search engines

paulkrugman
9 years ago

When a guy hits major league pitching like it’s slow pitch softball, it makes total sense to use a 4 man outfield.

JoserMember since 2021
9 years ago
Reply to  paulkrugman

Even more so when the opposing manager is a former softball player himself

Enlightening RoundMember since 2017
9 years ago

Ha, we did this in high school about 30 years ago against some of the better hitters in our league

Jetsy Extrano
9 years ago

I wonder if Tangotiger can model the effect of a given positioning of outfielders against a hitter’s spray chart (has to assume no change in approach, but it sounds like Votto tries not to change).

Estimate how many balls will be caught: for each historical landing point and hang time, get the distance to the defender and plug it into their personal distance/time catch chart to get a catch probability. Add all those up.

Move outfielders around to see how low an OBP you can get.

God this would make a kickass web app. Do it!

Mahoney
9 years ago
Reply to  Jetsy Extrano

Not only do I bet that he can, but I’d bet good money that a number of MLB teams have already done exactly what you suggested to help them decide on defensive positioning. We fans have only gotten this info recently, but teams have had it for quite a while.

I really think that app would be a dangerous idea though. If I had a copy, I’d never get anything else done 😉

tacoman
9 years ago
Reply to  Jetsy Extrano

http://labressler.github.io/shiftgenerator/ doesn’t have individual hitters, but you can change things like fielder speed, how much the ball slows down when it hits the dirt, etc.

Noah BaronMember since 2016
9 years ago

Sorry, I didn’t know where to ask this question: Would it be possible for FanGraphs to bring back pitch by pitch pitch f(x) data? Before the recent update, it was easy to view a given pitcher’s SwStr% on his slider, for instance. Now I can’t find this data anywhere on the site.

Am I missing something or is this data no longer available?

Noah BaronMember since 2016
9 years ago
Reply to  Noah Baron

Also I realize that this data is available on Brooks Baseball, but it’s much more convenient if I can just view it on a player’s FanGraphs profile.

ChippersJonesing
9 years ago
Reply to  Noah Baron

You just have to go to the “Splits” tab, then “Pitfh Type Splits”.

I think that’s what you’re looking for anyway.

MikeSMember since 2020
9 years ago

It is definitely possible that Joe Maddon is a genius AND sometimes out-thinks himself. One often follows the other. One thing geniuses tend to do is push the envelope, which means sometimes they will push it to far. It’s OK to be wrong sometimes. I think most of the people who don’t like things like this really just don’t like to be challenged to think.

YKnotDisco
9 years ago

Can’t wait to see “Ronald Torreyes Squared Off Against a Six-Man Infield”.

cubfanjack
9 years ago

Huge Cub fan here. I think there are plenty of times Maddon over thinks his bullpen usage and his lineups. But in this case i give credit for at least critically thinking about it.

Votto is probably the best pure hitter (and most disciplined ) in the game. He’s the biggest threat in a pretty thin lineup and is a divisional foe who is faced quite often. Why not? Too many stand in line to criticize the guy with some stones.

During the Cub game thread last night after Votto doubled, i giggled and posted “how do you like them apples” To which a fellow poster immediately followed with a Matt Damon picture.

John Autin
9 years ago
Reply to  cubfanjack

Thin lineup? Not this year. They’re 4th in NL OPS+, above average in scoring.

JDX
9 years ago
Reply to  John Autin

Amazingly, that happens with both Billy Hamilton and Jose Peraza getting regular ABs.

thestatbook
9 years ago

I find Joe Maddon to be baseball’s Les Miles. Always trying to do something quirky. In the beginning, it works. Fans and writers greatly enjoy seeing what you can come up with. After a while, though, it can become trite, especially if you’re doing it for the sake of being quirky.

I don’t mind Maddon’s quirkiness, but I can certainly see it becoming problematic for him down the road. The problem with out-of-the-box coaching is it really only works in two scenarios:
1. Teams that always win.
2. Teams where losing is pretty much expected.

In the first, you can’t be out-of-the-box to the detriment of the final score. Cubs fans won’t praise Maddon for a 4-man outfield if they lose the game. I can still name you every highly questionable call that Maddon made in games 6 & 7 last year. They were numerous and almost cost him a World Series. If he wants to be off-the-walls, he has to win. This is what soured LSU fans on Les Miles.

In the second, being out-of-the-box works if your fans are resigned on the season. As a Giants fan, I’d love to see Bochy get a little more creative in his game management. Go with bizarre alignments, mix up the lineup card (Posey batting first?). Who cares? You have nothing to lose on the season. And who knows, maybe you’ll find something that works long-term.