One Last Top 100 Prospects Shuffle

As we approach the 2019 minor league season’s September epilogue, we’re making our last few changes to THE BOARD before cementing the rankings until offseason lists start rolling out. We focused this week on curating the top 100’s midsection, which resulted in us moving around about 10% of 50 FV and above players, which we’ve found to be typical each time we’ve made a concerted effort to refine the very top of the roughly 1250 pro players on THE BOARD on whom we have thoughts. Note that most of the action is taking place on the seam between the 50 and 55 FV tier, a sort of weigh station for rising potential stars, and players with issues exposed at the upper levels.

Let’s quickly touch on the handful of players in this area who have moved down from the 55 FV tier into the 50s. Recent Marlins RF acquisition Jesus Sanchez continues to have below average discipline and trouble lifting the ball consistently. Perhaps a change of scenery will prove meaningful for one or both of these traits, but they’re relevant issues for a corner outfield prospect.

We also slid Braves pitcher Kyle Wright and Pirates pitcher Mitch Keller down a bit due to our doubts about their fastballs missing bats as currently constituted, despite their respective velocities.

We also dropped some players who we consider higher probability, lower impact types — like New York’s Andres Gimenez, Washington’s Luis Garcia, Philly’s Adonis Medina, Baltimore’s Yusniel Diaz, and Cardinals catcher Andrew Knizner — down below 50 FVs who we think have a wider range of potential outcomes, and more ceiling. Their FVs didn’t change at all, but we prefer players who have more obvious growth potential due to bigger tools, more projectable frames, and other physical traits almost always present in top big leaguers.

The players we moved up a bit are mostly the high-performing teenagers, like Padres first rounder CJ Abrams (whose position we changed to center field, as we just don’t think he can make enough tough throws to stay at short), Giants RF Heliot Ramos, Mariners RF Julio Rodriguez, D-backs CF Kristian Robinson (who moves up past Daulton Varsho and becomes the top prospect in Arizona’s system), and Indians CF George Valera (who becomes No. 1 in Cleveland’s). Also note the presence of several players from the 2018 draft in this range. Much like Abrams, we’re not certain the Cubs’ Nico Hoerner can play shortstop, but he’ll end up in the middle of the field somewhere, and we think he’ll rake. He becomes the top Cubs prospect, though our opinion of C Miguel Amaya hasn’t changed.

Outside of these dynamic lower level talents emerging, there are also middle-to-upper minors power-based prospects showing either more performance after a breakout and/or improved underlying metrics to make us buy even more than what the raw statline says. Catchers Will Smith of the Dodgers and Tyler Stephenson of the Reds are two notable backstops who we’ve always liked and have taken recent performance steps forward. Rays 1B Nate Lowe and Twins RF Trevor Larnach have also continue to rake and look like strong bets to be everyday, potential middle-of-the-order types. Mariners RHP Logan Gilbert also has continued to show his Cape/sophomore year of college velocity and performance, rather than the lower velocity that was tied to overuse in his junior year at Stetson (which is why the Mariners had a chance to get him 14th overall last summer).

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The list has two new names: Brewers LF Trent Grisham and Dodgers 2B Jeter Downs. Grisham has made an inconsistent amount and quality of contact since signing, while the plate discipline aspect of the profile has been fantastic. He’s been hitting the ball really hard this year, though. Downs has performed, but his underlying numbers are more middling. If he can be passable on the middle infield, it will still make him a solid regular, and the rate at which he’s climbed through the minors means that could be soon.

Other, non-top 100 types we moved include…

Arizona SS Liover Peguero has grown into more power than we expected this soon, so he moves to the 45+ FV tier just behind the 100. Rangers 3B/1B Sherten Apostel has bigger underlying power metrics than his triple slash line indicates, so he’s nearing the 100, too, despite what might be a righty first base profile.

Cleveland righty Triston McKenzie, who hasn’t pitched all year, Rangers CF Leody Taveras, and Brewers OF Tristen Lutz, who just hasn’t hit for sufficient power, moved down and out of the 50 FV tier. Marlins recent third rounder RF Peyton Burick and his big raw power and arm strength have been added to their list while Victor Victor Mesa’s continued struggles have led to another drop for him. Other additions to THE BOARD: Red Sox CF Marcus Wilson, Yankees LF Canaan Smith, new Giants RF Jaylin Davis, and new Tigers RF Travis Demeritte.





52 Comments
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Angelsjunky
6 years ago

Are you tempted to drop Royce Lewis to 60 FV after his mediocre year?

Also, why do you have Jo Adell as 2021 ETA? Do you really think he won’t be in the majors next year? I suspect no later than mid-season.

sadtromboneMember since 2020
6 years ago
Reply to  Angelsjunky

I would be. It’s still more likely than not that he figures it out, but there are certainly more questions now than there were last year.

stanMember since 2019
6 years ago

I’m surprised there was no note about Dylan Carlson’s ranking. His promotion to AAA and crazy numbers there (529/579/941 at age 20) have really opened some eyes around baseball. I know he wasn’t on many top 100’s prior to the year, but he has to be edging close to everyone’s top 20 with the impressive year he’s had.

tdouglas
6 years ago
Reply to  stan

I think they already bumped his ranking this year. We’ll see where he ranks this winter, but top 20 seems high.

NRMember since 2017
6 years ago

Just FYI, one typo noticed: Brennen Davis is listed twice on page 3 of the results.

gavinrendar
6 years ago

Is there an easy way to see what these rankings were before the changes? Is there an archive by date or anything like that?

jamesdakrnMember since 2020
6 years ago
Reply to  gavinrendar

Click on their FV ratings on the board and you can see it

gavinrendar
6 years ago
Reply to  jamesdakrn

Thanks!

mikejuntMember
6 years ago

I’m very interested to see the Dodgers’ update and learn how Keibert Ruiz kept his FV60 stock despite a relatively disappointing year mostly repeating a level.

careaganMember since 2017
6 years ago
Reply to  mikejunt

Check out his single digit strikeout rate, he’s demonstrating the contact skills Eric and Kiley grade him highly on.

mikejuntMember
6 years ago
Reply to  careagan

For sure, but taking a step back in ISO when the minors gained the MLB ball is not encouraging.

J.D. MartinMember since 2020
6 years ago
Reply to  mikejunt

Only AAA is using the major league ball, the rest of the levels are still using their normal balls.

mattMember since 2023
6 years ago
Reply to  J.D. Martin

Even still has low BABIP and sub 100 ISO are troubling signs. He also projects as more of a average defender than a impact one, eric and kiley obviously way more qualified than me. But at this point I’d have him around 50th on a top 100 list. He could still be a impact guy and maybe the bat takes off but there are significantly more questions with the bat than a year ago. BB/K is very good but you can still fail with a good one

Rational FanMember since 2025
6 years ago

I wonder what Luis Robert would have had to do to increase his current power grade from a laughable 30.

I guess Fangraphs is going to remain stubborn on their Robert valuation. It’s an odd stance, while Robert is on pace to go about 33/45 in about 125 games with a wRC+ of 165ish while playing elite level defense in center….

We sit here after Robert has likely been the best minor leaguer throughout all levels, from a tools and production standpoint as a 22 year old, with him ranked 20th by FG and a refusal to budge. Meanwhile, Pache is only 1 calendar year younger and hes ranked another tier higher despite having a 776 ops and a 540 one through 60 AAA at bats. I would love to find the team that would NOT trade Pache for Luis Robert today.

Underrating Luis Robert seems to be the anthill FG scouting wants to die on.

To put it in perspective, his teammate Nick Madrigal has a current game power grade of 40 hahahahahahaha.

Shalesh
6 years ago
Reply to  Rational Fan

Kiley explained why in one of his chats. Luis Robert is tooled up like Lew Brinson but he has a high K%…like Lew Brinson. So while he’s had outstanding results, the test of batting against major league pitching awaits. Lew Brinson raked through the minors but has so far failed miserably in the Majors. Pache, as I understand it, would very quickly be the best defensive CF in the majors, where Robert would be more of an average defender and Pache has less risk to go along with less reward with the bat. Plus, the 1 year younger gives Pache projection with the bat.

We’ll see Luis Robert in Chicago in mid-April, so the rankings won’t matter fairly soon.

Rational FanMember since 2025
6 years ago
Reply to  Shalesh

Yes, I read his “reasoning.” Every group and tier of prospects have had failures. Brinson had never had a season in the minors like Robert has had this year. His 2015 was nice but it wasnt nearly as complete as Robert’s and the majority of it was spent at a lower level.

There is absolutely no defense of giving Robert a current game power grade of 30 while giving Madrigal a 40.

Pache would be a better defender than Kiermeir and Buxton? I’d like some of what you’re smoking. Robert is an elite defensive CF prospect as well. He’s not a bum out there.

Paches plate discipline ranks are nearly identical to Roberts.

It’s not as if he has loud production with questionable tools… or great tools with questionable production. He literally has had both. Steamer already has him as a better than league average hitter.

And the fanboys will be out to rationalize how a guy with 30+ Homers, many of them absolute bombs, can have a lower game power grade than Nick Madrigal. If you support that grade because FGs said so, that’s pretty funny.

Also, to all supporting this position… what would Robert have had to do this year to increase his rank? He has been the 20th ranked prospect on the board since the year started. He came into the year as an unknown and had that rank. then he dominated and nothing budged. So you’re telling me fangraphs expected a 35/45 year with an ops over 1000 for the guy? Interesting.

Shalesh
6 years ago
Reply to  Rational Fan

You’re starting to sound like the “Why does FanGraphs hate (my favorite team’s prospect) guy?” Maybe McDongenhagen don’t update the individual tool grades on every one of the 750 or so prospects the Board covers. Sorry. I’m good with the overall ranking update frequency.

You’re allowed to disagree with McDongenhagen, if you want to. I don’t watch 750 or so prospects on a semi-regular basis, so I have no basis of comparison for Robert vs Pache (and again, not sure why it matters). Fangraphs’ prospect rankings line up with revealed values of prospects in trades and with prospect reputations around the league, so I think it’s a good source. I think they’ve had some misses like over-rating Nick Solak, but again that’s <1% of all the players they cover.

If you know of better sources for prospect coverage, do let us all know.

Art Fay
6 years ago
Reply to  Shalesh

Eh, Luis Robert is one of a few guys you can reasonably argue should be the top prospect in all of baseball. I’m not a Wsox fan so I didn’t pay TOO much attention to him, but looking at the numbers, I bet his walk rates were due to him just absolutely dominating. Why not swing when you’re better than everybody by a mile? Anybody who watched him weigh in?

Shalesh
6 years ago
Reply to  Art Fay

Current minor league performance isn’t all that goes into prospect rankings, else we’d just look at the Triple-A leaderboard for the “best” prospects. There’s signal in a prospect’s age, athleticism, skills (K-BB%). KATOH+ found height had signal in it. In other words, “don’t just scout the stat line.” Kiley & Eric do that and have found that these other variables push Pache over Robert.

Time will tell and Rational Fan can come back on here and say, “I told you so” if he wants to. I think it’s understood that there are error bars around each prospect’s forecast so an FV55 probably outperforms an FV60, I don’t know, 20% of the time. Thus, it wouldn’t shock FanGraphs if Robert did outperform Pache, they just find it more likely that the reverse will happen.

Rational FanMember since 2025
6 years ago
Reply to  Shalesh

1. Luis Robert is significantly lower on FGs ranking than the industry consensus across other publications.

2. Luis Robert started that year at like 43, if you remove graduations in front of him he sitting at 37. He went on to be, possibly, the minor league POY. He was 21 YO for most of the season. He has 21 homers, 25 doubles and 7 triples with 28 sb’s in 93 games between AA and AAA with a 150 wRC+. All while playing an up the middle position at a very high level.

3. The stance and defense of it is a COMP to one individual prospect who is still only 25 YO himself. There have been players in every comp group in baseball history that have failed. The was a lazy reason and explanation imo.

4. Could he walk more? Yes. But find me a perfect prospect with zero weaknesses, because I never had the chance to meet Trout.

Typically you can’t just scout the stat line because tools matter too, projection matters. Robert has plus tools everywhere and is huge. Am I a fan of Robert’s game? Yes, obviously. I enjoy 6’3 guys running home to first faster than buxton while having elite exit velocities and hitting mammoth Homers. At the end of the day, none of this matters, but that doesn’t stop us from discussing everything else. It just shows the stubborness required in the scouting world.

Over 162 game pace (MiLB season is shorter obviously) he would have 102 XBH’s this year with 45 steals.

Shalesh
6 years ago
Reply to  Rational Fan

FanGraphs puts perhaps more weight into the non-performance variables. Kiley mentioned that Braves fans yelling at him for underrating Austin Riley and since Riley’s performance has since been mediocre, now he’s getting other fans yelling at him for overrating him. I think their approach of not wildly moving guys around the Board due to recent performance makes sense. Maybe you like a ratings source that finds more signal in recent performance and you don’t mind ranking volatility.

Rational FanMember since 2025
6 years ago
Reply to  Shalesh

Robert has 4 carrying tools right now. Riley had 2 and other examples as well. Robert could not hit over 230 in his career and still contribute value every year.

gavinrendar
6 years ago
Reply to  Rational Fan

Rational Fan, you might be right. Fangraphs might be right. I’m not quite sure what you want out of this discussion. After looking at his numbers and his age, I’m inclined to agree with you. But I’d also be interested in hearing a FG response. I’m guessing it would also be convincing.

Also, I think it’s unfair to dive too deep into any one-on-one prospect comparisons. When you rank 150 of anything on a somewhat subjective level, it all starts to blur together, and so many of them can be interchangeable.

bookbookMember since 2024
6 years ago
Reply to  Rational Fan

I admire your passion on this. If it turns out fangraphs underrated this guy, by only calling him a very good prospect instead of a great one, it won’t slow his career down by one millisecond. (Everyone’s struggling a little with superb all minor league stats, which could be a factor?)

sadtromboneMember since 2020
6 years ago
Reply to  Rational Fan

So the individual tool grades–you need to give Kiley and Eric a pass on this. They probably only update those in the offseason.

Beyond that, I think it’s pretty clear that they’re concerned about the hit tool. They just think he’s going to struggle making contact against big league pitching. I think it’s worth keeping him out of the FV65 tier over this because it makes a ton of risk to his profile. The BB/K rate backs this up, at least to a certain extent. The Lewis Brinson comparison is valid, because there a lot of Lewis Brinsons out there.

I would likely grade him as an FV60, with the likelihood that he’ll have a bit of an adjustment to major league pitching and struggle at first. If he’s partially successful, he’s a pretty good player; it’s lazy comp because of the Cuban connection, but Yoenis Cespedes is a real possibility. I like that better than I did before the season started, and it’s hard to see him having a worse career than, say, Randal Grichuk. (I suppose he could always be Preston Tucker or Keon Broxton, but that seems less and less likely now). I think I’ll take it.

Jonathan Sher
6 years ago
Reply to  Shalesh

Name this player …
– In 2018 at age 20-21, had an ISO of .290 in AA and .193 in AAA.
– That same year, had a walk rate of 10% in AA, then 12.2% in AAA, all with a k-rate of between 24% and 25%
– He is 6’5″, 225 lbs and has the body of a young Frank Thomas
– After the 2018, FG dropped his ranking from 44 to 123 and rated his game power at 30, writing that “he does have limited bat control.”

Answer: Yordan Alvarez.

I am not suggesting Alvarez and Roberts share much in common as prospects; Yordan combines natural power with top-echelon bat control, but will not contribute as a defender, while Roberts has not demonstrated plate discipline but has great speed and the athleticism to play CF. What they share is this: Both are Cubans who had to adjust to pro ball and living in America, both had to endure some periods of transition, and while both overcame those transitions to play at elite levels, some prospect evaluators seem less willing to consider their initial judgment might be wrong.

Eric and Kiley do great work; evaluating prospects is fraught with uncertainties. You can’t barrel-up every pitch or every prospect. Perhaps they over-reacted to Alvarez’s play in 2018. And I do suspect they are underrating Robert game power and overall rating. Time will tell.

Dominikk85Member since 2020
6 years ago
Reply to  Shalesh

Ronald acuna and fernando tatis also struck out a lot in the minors. Just because brinson did it doesn’t make sense to bump down anyone with a high K rate, especially the power grade which is only somewhat related to K rate.

Yeah the K rate is a concern but it is mid 20s and not mid 30s and he has performed at any level.

I mean a mid 20s K rate isn’t ideal but it isn’t super high in these days and a lot of successful top prospects had k rates like this in the majors albeit of course some busts too.

TKDCMember since 2016
6 years ago
Reply to  Rational Fan

Pache is 15.5 months younger and had a 135 wRC+ in AA this year. He has struggled in a small sample in AAA. Roberts has 156 wRC+ in AA and 143 in AAA. He also has a bonkers 19 game stretch in A+. Just scouting the stat line, I think the age difference and defensive reputation are enough to argue that Pache is the better prospect.

Stevil
6 years ago
Reply to  Rational Fan

The Ha-ha-ha’s make it hard to take you seriously, especially when you miss the fact that Robert’s raw power tool grade is 65. The 30 is the low on his game power projection and a lot of that probably has to do with the fact that he has a 24.5 kS% right now (1.1 kL%) via Statcorner.

Nobody’s saying he can’t or won’t hit for power. But he’ll have to do better than the 66% contact rate he’s currently sporting in AAA and cut down on those swinging K’s. 60-grade prospects don’t typically have those types of question marks.

Rational FanMember since 2025
6 years ago
Reply to  Stevil

Where are you getting the contact rate in AAA stat? Where does statcorner get it from?

Don’t tell me that data is sourced from MiLB gamedays? They have no publically available ball/striking tracking in Charlotte which is why I’m asking where the data is derived from. If it’s from that source, I’ll take it with a drain of salt.

55 grade prospects don’t typically have 40/40 ceilings in CF.

sgp2204
6 years ago
Reply to  Rational Fan

Everyone can argue about his ratings all they want, but nobody can legitimately justify a 30 Game Power on this guy. That’s a severe overreaction to last year – a year in which he dealt with multiple injuries and played through a jacked up thumb when he was “healthy.”

Personally, I have a hard time justifying keeping his ranking artificially down because a different player failed in the past. He could put up literally the exact same minor league numbers as Lewis Brinson, but his MLB results could be completely different. With the amount of prospects that fail, you could pretty easily find a failed player comp for just about any prospect if you tried hard enough. Based solely on tools/performance, I think you could easily argue that Robert’s FV is 10+ points too low.

Pirates HurdlesMember since 2024
6 years ago
Reply to  sgp2204

The boys have said before that current ratings reflect minor league level not actual grading. Pretty sure the 30 came from him starting in A+. His game power is clearly closer to the FV of 55 not 30.

sgp2204
6 years ago

Not saying you’re wrong, but I’ve never seen that about game power. I’ve seen them mention that about hit tool though.

ThrasiusMember since 2016
6 years ago
Reply to  sgp2204

If you can’t hit enough to get to your raw power, then you don’t have game power. That’s some of what they’re saying.

sgp2204
6 years ago
Reply to  Thrasius

That’d be a fine argument if you thought he couldn’t hit at all. Unless they were CRAZY low on his hit tool (they aren’t – they still gave him a 40), a 30 game power is laughably low. Based on that logic, I’d also argue that he shouldn’t be 15 points below someone that has actually had trouble making contact in the past – Zack Collins (35 hit tool)… Heck, Joey Gallo had a 30 hit tool and 60 game power. I’m sure I could find plenty more examples of players with worse hit tools having substantially higher game power.

If you want to use the “he started at A+” argument, I’d also like to point out that Nick Madrigal has a 40 game power and started at the same level…

I think it’s pretty clear what we’re looking at here – his game power rating is waaaay too low, and the only logical reason is because it was an overreaction to his 2018 numbers. I don’t blame them for being down on his power after 2018 because that was pretty much the only sample they had to look at, but I do think they have been extremely slow to react. If his game power isn’t given a substantial bump when the rankings are updated, it’d be a bad look for FG.

Also, unless I’m reading Kylie’s “Scouting Explained” series incorrectly, a 30 game power objectively translates to 3-5 homers at the big league level. I’ll take the over.

Paqs
6 years ago

Wait, Robinson jumped ahead of Varsho? But Varsho is killing it!

dcweber99
6 years ago

I kind of feel bad for Mitch Keller. It’s not his fault the Pirates have absolutely no idea how to develop high end starting pitching.

goyo70
6 years ago

Is Isaiah Campbell (SEA) regarded as less than a FV 35, or was this an accidental omission from the Mariner list?

Titubs
6 years ago

How am I supposed to interpret Brandon McKay’s 60/60 rating for his Arm? I would have thought for sure a pitcher would have a 70+ grade. Is it because the only position he’d ever field is pitcher so he’s compared relative to other pitchers ?

sadtromboneMember since 2020
6 years ago
Reply to  Titubs

Well, he never has to throw a curveball from first base, but if he did, he’d be an 80.

sadtromboneMember since 2020
6 years ago

Maybe I’m overreacting, but I think that there’s a shade too much rating lag going on here for Matt Manning and Gavin Lux. They have everything you could want–age, level, performance, tools…they both have star written all over them.

mikejuntMember
6 years ago
Reply to  sadtrombone

I mean Lux is in the top 10 at this point; where do you want him to be?

The last FV60 Dodgers’ position prospects were Bellinger and Seager; do you think he should be -higher rated- than Corey Seager was in 2015? Cause I don’t.

sadtromboneMember since 2020
6 years ago
Reply to  mikejunt

Top 5, probably. I think Seager was considered the #1 prospect in baseball at that point, a 70 guy, so I wouldn’t put him that high.

Aside from Franco #1 and Adell #2, I do think there are a bunch of ways you could order it. Bichette’s only likely to be on this list for a little while longer, and you could put him up at #3 because he’s hitting in MLB but that seems a little weird. I think I might put Lux in contention at #3; his only red flag is his throwing arm, since he’s torn the ball off at the upper level of the minors, is still relatively young for his level, has decent BB/K rate, hits for power, hits for average, has athleticism, likely to stick at second base…we just don’t see this kind of package all that often.

Then again, I also think Matt Manning might be the best pitching prospect right now, so what do I know?

Tristan
6 years ago

Is there any concrete information out there about what’s going on with Triston McKenzie? Reports in spring said it was a back injury. And I believe Eric said in a chat mid-season that McKenzie was in Arizona. Tough to find much detail anywhere.

Would also be interested in any thoughts on Jacob Waguespack of the Blue Jays. He looks like he’s vastly outperforming any reasonable expectations (one-hitting the Dodgers in LA over 7 innings last night, for example). He’s older and perhaps just a feel-good non-prospect story. Is there any chance his stuff plays up?

musclepharm52
6 years ago

Wheres Brailyn Marquez???!!!

Chaise Kahlenbeck
6 years ago
Reply to  musclepharm52

They both have said (at least Eric has), assuming he continues what he’s doing at Hi-A, that he’s on the list to look at this offseason that will probably be pushed into the 50 tier. Brennen Davis is also on that list.

shaq_diesel
6 years ago

I keep hearing from guys with direct knowledge that the Rays are high on Kevin Padlo. They are so optimistic, it’s what made Solak expendable. Any thoughts on what changes he made to suddenly be so successful?

Dominikk85Member since 2020
6 years ago

I can understand moving positions but why do you move abrams to CF when he hasn’t played a single game in the Of?

I understand the intrigue of moving a fast if to center and there are examples of this (billy hamilton, trea Turner) but 90% of shortstops who don’t stay at short move to second or third.

So if he can’t stay at short most likely he goes to 2nd or 3rd even if his speed is a bit wasted there. Didn’t you guys project moncada to center too? Imo that just rarely happens although it does sometimes but not often enough to project it.

mikegreer5
6 years ago

Robert a 55FV but guys like Lewis, Hayes, and Rodgers above him have scuttled a bit this season. Why hasn’t he vaulted over them? Feels low, IMO.

Great work, nonetheless!

SucramRenrutMember since 2017
6 years ago

I bet Bo Bichette debuts before 2020. I’ve heard he is good.

ctmuuseMember since 2016
6 years ago

I’d probably go ahead and move Aristides Aquino up a few more notches.

Damaso
6 years ago

SWR is having one of the great 18yr old seasons in recent pitching prospect history, was a borderline 1st round pick, throws high 90s with two potential plus offspeed pitches, isn’t walking anyone…..and can’t even crack a 50fv grade?