The Consensus Top Prospect KATOH Hates

On Tuesday, I published KATOH’s 2017 top-100 list. Naturally, a lot of good players missed the cut. But one omission seemed particularly egregious, relative to the industry consensus. KATOH’s disdain for this player has elicited a few comments in recent months.

From this week’s top-100:

From our Rockies list in November:

From KATOH’s mid-season list in July:

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And a Twitter response to that same July post:

Given the industry consensus on Brendan Rodgers, these questions are justified. Most in the game agree that he’s one of the very best prospects in baseball. Baseball America, Baseball Prospectus, Keith Law, MLB Pipeline and John Sickels all ranked him in their respective top 20s. MLB Pipeline was most optimistic, ranking him sixth overall. Our very own Eric Longenhagen gave him a 60 FV grade, which also likely equates to a top-20 ranking.

It isn’t hard to understand the source of all this love. Rodgers was the third-overall pick in the draft less than two years ago, and he hit .281/.342/.480 as a 19-year-old shortstop in Low-A last year. On top of that, his physical tools have elicited glowing scouting reports. Here’s an excerpt from Eric Longenhagen’s writeup.

Though he doesn’t have any elite tools, Rodgers’ hit/power combination and potential to play the end-all-be-all of defensive positions makes him not only the best prospect in this system but one of the better ones in all of baseball. He has plus bat speed, barrel control, a casual but effective weight transfer, strong wrists and a bat path conducive both to contact and power… He’s a potential star.

Yet for all of Rodgers’ merits, KATOH isn’t buying it. He didn’t even make the cut in the KATOH+ version, which accounts for his No. 16 ranking on Baseball America’s list. Even the scouting-infused model projects him for just 3.4 WAR over his first six big-league seasons: Essentially, it sees him as a future bench player. Here’s his likelihood of outcomes distribution, per KATOH+.

I’m here to unpack why KATOH is so down on Mr. Rodgers.

Rodgers’ 2016 performance looks great on the surface. After all, very few teenage shortstops put up OPSs north of .800 in full-season ball. But it’s important to note that Rodgers’ performance took place in Low-A Asheville, which is a very hitting-friendly environment, especially for right-handed hitters. According to StatCorner, the home-run park factor for righties there is 210. 210! The park factor for doubles and triples is only slightly less extreme, at 167. By comparison, the site has Coors Field’s factors ranging from 108 to 132 by these same metrics. As a result, KATOH dings his power output quite a bit due to his hitting environment.

Rodgers’ home-road splits from last year support KATOH’s fears. He hit a robust .319/.378/.600 at home, but a puny .247/.310/.372 on the road.

To further illustrate Asheville’s inflationary powers, here’s the complete list of right-handed hitters who played back-to-back seasons (200-plus plate appearances) for Colorado’s Low-A and High-A affiliates since 2013. Almost all of their wOBAs and ISOs plummeted after they left Asheville’s friendly confines for the more pitcher-friendly Modesto. Some even experienced a three-digit (!) drop in wOBA.

Right-Handed Prospects Leaving Asheville, 2013-Present
Name Asheville ISO Modesto ISO Chng in ISO Asheville wOBA Modesto wOBA Chng in wOBA
Shane Hoelscher .201 .152 -.049 .432 .337 -.095
Rosell Herrera .172 .091 -.081 .426 .289 -.137
Mike Benjamin .225 .189 -.036 .423 .331 -.092
Francisco Sosa .215 .161 -.054 .421 .305 -.116
Steven Graeter .215 .069 -.146 .395 .270 -.125
Correlle Prime .228 .135 -.093 .381 .286 -.095
Drew Weeks .155 .113 -.042 .366 .284 -.082
Wes Rogers .119 .105 -.014 .348 .322 -.026
Wilfredo Rodriguez .089 .075 -.014 .348 .245 -.103
Matt Wessinger .119 .081 -.038 .346 .261 -.085
Josh Fuentes .131 .172 .041 .325 .353 .028
Juan Ciriaco .075 .081 .006 .314 .298 -.016
Luis Jean .053 .045 -.008 .304 .274 -.030
Average .154 .113 -.041 .371 .297 -.075

Here are the wOBAs for those players, submitted in graph form:

Aside from his suspect power numbers, Rodgers’ success came with a 20% strikeout rate. That may not seem all that bad, and it isn’t necessarily all that bad. But consider that hitters’ strikeout rates tend to increase as they climb the minor-league ladder. This suggests he may struggle to make contact at the upper levels. Ideally, you’d like to see a prospect make a bit more contact than that at the lower levels, particularly if his power output isn’t anything special.

Let’s set his hitting aside for a moment. After all, a shortstop doesn’t necessarily need to hit all that much to provide value as an everyday player. But Rodgers’ defensive and baserunning numbers haven’t matched up with the scouting reports, either. Eric Longenhagen rated him as a 50 runner, and predicted he’d be an average defender at short in the big leagues. Yet Rodgers stole a measly six bases last year, and Clay Davenport’s numbers saw him as merely an average defensive shortstop compared to his Low-A peers. Simply put, KATOH doesn’t see the same type of baserunning value and defensive prowess the scouts see.

None of this is to say that Brendan Rodgers isn’t a good prospect. Many, many intelligent people have watched him play and came away thinking he has star potential. It would be idiotic for me, or anyone else, to blindly defer to my dumb computer over them. Nevertheless, I think KATOH’s concerns are reasonable. Rodgers’ pro numbers have been more good than great, despite the fact that he played all of last year in a bandbox against weak competition. That’s a lot to swallow for a guy who’s supposedly an elite prospect.

Rodgers could easily break out in a big way in 2017 and make this entire article look stupid. He certainly wouldn’t be the first toolsy high-school draftee to piece it all together a couple of years after he was drafted, nor would he be the first player to make me look stupid. But here in March 2017, KATOH is very skeptical of Rodgers and it doesn’t think his top-20 rankings are justified. A few years from now, we’ll know if it was right.





Chris works in economic development by day, but spends most of his nights thinking about baseball. He writes for Pinstripe Pundits, FanGraphs and The Hardball Times. He's also on the twitter machine: @_chris_mitchell None of the views expressed in his articles reflect those of his daytime employer.

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alang3131982Member since 2016
9 years ago

Good stuff

cnote66Member since 2017
9 years ago

I was hoping to see Francis Martes, who also missed the Top 100

Johnny Dickshot
9 years ago
Reply to  cnote66

Ctrl-F is your friend. Or perhaps you’re just trolling at this point, since the author helpfully pointed out Martes’ placements in KATOH and KATOH+ to you yesterday.

cnote66Member since 2017
9 years ago

SORRY! Not my intention — and thanks for the Ctrl-F. I’m old school and sorted by team. My bad.

Johnny Dickshot
9 years ago
Reply to  cnote66

No problem. Just thought your post here was odd since Chris gave you Martes’ list placements in response to your post yesterday (but I guess you did not go back and see his response).

Noah BaronMember since 2016
9 years ago

I think I agree with your analysis over the prospect lists. The power is a mirage and he’s already having major contact issues in the low minors. Not a good sign. Still, I could see him becoming a successful player at Coors Field.

jdbolickMember since 2024
9 years ago
Reply to  Noah Baron

http://www.milb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20160623&content_id=185848430&fext=.jsp&vkey=recap

The Asheville Tourists trailed the West Virginia Power 2-0 in the bottom of the sixth inning. Brendan Rodgers stepped to the plate and destroyed a 3-1 Logan Sendelbach pitch deep into the trees beyond the left field wall. The blast measured at 474 feet with an exit velocity of 114mph. It was one of the longest Home Runs McCormick Field has seen in years and it gave the Tourists a jolt. Asheville used that momentum to beat West Virginia 3-2.

There is no justification whatsoever for saying that Brendan Rodgers’ “power is a mirage.” Only five of his nineteen home runs this past season narrowly cleared the fence while nine of them were absolutely crushed. It’s fair to bring up the splits and therefore to discount his offensive production somewhat due to the favorable home park, but there is zero question that he has plus power that will play in any park. And as for “major contact issues,” you should note that his K% was slightly lower than Gleyber Torres’ at the same level. I bring up Torres because they both suffer from similar issues regarding the outer third of the strike zone that can be fixed by not pulling off so much.

A more valid debate would be Rodgers’ defensive future, as there appears to be a wide disparity between how scouts characterize his potential as a shortstop and the Davenport numbers the new KATOH relies on. Without knowing Davenport’s methodology, I don’t know how wise or unwise it is for this system to put such a strong weight on them. Who knows, KATOH might end up looking prescient on this, but I stand by my quoted statement above that the changes Mr. Mitchell recently made to KATOH made it worse instead of better.

sideshowraheem
9 years ago
Reply to  jdbolick

If his power is so great how come he only slugged .372 on the road?

And what good is the game power if he rarely if ever connects?

jdbolickMember since 2024
9 years ago
Reply to  sideshowraheem

Obviously playing in Asheville helped Rodgers’ numbers, but a 19 year old shortstop with nineteen home runs, nine no-doubt home runs, and one 474 foot home run clearly has plus power. It’s perfectly reasonable to see those splits and wonder if he’s a product of his park, which is why you then not only look at scouting reports but also look at the nature of the home runs he did hit.

As for your second question, you (and KATOH) seem to think that a 20.0% K% is alarming but it really isn’t. You’ll be hard pressed to find a prospect analyst more obsessed with contact rates than I am, but I have no such concerns about Rodgers. Look at the highest ISOs of players from his level last season and tell me how his 20.0% K% looks in comparison. Fewer strikeouts would be great and more walks would be great as well, so I’m not suggesting that he’s the perfect hitting prospect, I’m just saying that I don’t understand such extreme skepticism. When you consider that he has a real chance to stick at shortstop, the supposed concerns become even harder to justify.

sideshowraheem
9 years ago
Reply to  jdbolick

Thanks for the interesting reply jdbolick. The distance of the home runs definitely make me more inclined to believe the power is real. However I still find the strikeout rate alarming.

But as you said he’s 19 years old with plenty of time to figure that out.

Cool Lester SmoothMember since 2020
9 years ago
Reply to  jdbolick

Of course, Torres is 4 months younger than Rodgers, and was only 18 when he put up a better K/BB in Low-A.

..and that’s not a knock on Rodgers, whom I really like. He just needs another season of production, in a slightly less crazy run environment, for stats-based projections to believe in him.

jdbolickMember since 2024
9 years ago

Torres was a year younger, yes, but their K%-BB% figures were almost identical with 12.6% for Torres and 12.9% for Rodgers despite Rodgers posting double the ISO. And it’s not that stats-based projections don’t believe him, it’s only KATOH that doesn’t. No one else is as low on him as KATOH, not even other stats-based models.

Cool Lester SmoothMember since 2020
9 years ago
Reply to  jdbolick

That’s because (as Chris mentioned) KATOH actually adjusts for park factors, haha.

And if you look at Torres playing at the same age, he blows Rodgers out of the water in terms of K-BB, at a higher level.

jdbolickMember since 2024
9 years ago

The problem is that KATOH is adjusting too harshly in a one-size-fits-all method. Basically, no position prospect at Asheville is ever going to rank well. I understand why his model churned out this result given the splits, but when you look at everything in context it’s apparent that KATOH is simply missing on Rodgers here.

And Torres had a virtually identical K% to Rodgers last season as well (20.1% to 20.0%), although he did have a 3.5% edge in BB%. You can call that blowing “Rodgers out of the water” if you really want to, but that feels like an exaggeration. Regardless, the point is that Torres has posted very similar strikeout rates and has a similar defensive profile while not yet demonstrating Rodgers’ power, yet KATOH+ has Torres as the game’s 13th best prospect while Rodgers didn’t come close to making the top 100. The culprit for that is an overly aggressive park adjustment.

CliffH
9 years ago
Reply to  jdbolick

I think a prospect at Asheville will rank just fine if they actually perform better than the average for Asheville.

jdbolickMember since 2024
9 years ago
Reply to  CliffH

Rodgers had the second highest wRC+ of any Asheville hitter last season with at least 200 PAs, bested only by their 22 year old first baseman.

Cool Lester SmoothMember since 2020
9 years ago
Reply to  jdbolick

Where did you get those numbers?

Gleyber had a 19.3 K% across all levels last season, and an 11.1 BB%.

I’m quite comfortable calling that blowing Rodgers’ 7.1 BB% and 20.0 K% out of the water.

Torres has also dramatically improved his defense over the last couple of years, and is now very much expected to stick at SS.

There are very real reasons why KATOH prefers a younger player who put up a much, much better K/BB at a higher level, and then dominated the AFL.

…which doesn’t change the fact that it’s way too low on Rodgers!

jdbolickMember since 2024
9 years ago

Where did you get those numbers? Gleyber had a 19.3 K% across all levels last season, and an 11.1 BB%.

Gleyber Torres had 110 strikeouts and 58 walks over 552 High-A plate appearances this past season. You shouldn’t lump in the AFL numbers both because Rodgers didn’t play there and because it’s a notoriously pitching-poor environment. It’s more like spring training than full season baseball.

Torres has also dramatically improved his defense over the last couple of years, and is now very much expected to stick at SS.

Yes, and Rodgers is also expected to stick at shortstop. Neither are perceived as elite defensive shortstops and both may have to move off at some point in the future, as both may end up thickening on the lower body and losing some range.

There are very real reasons why KATOH prefers a younger player who put up a much, much better K/BB at a higher level, and then dominated the AFL.

Again, Torres had the higher (although only incrementally so) K% in full season professional baseball this past year. He did have several points of advantage in BB% and is a level higher while several months younger, so it’s perfectly reasonable to prefer him, but you keep ignoring that Rodgers has already demonstrated considerable power that Torres is still only projected to develop. There is no excuse for KATOH having Torres at #13 but having Rodgers not even close to the top 100. It’s blindingly apparent that Rodgers has been penalized too harshly by the park adjustment KATOH uses, which is why no other system is even close to as low on him as KATOH.

sadtromboneMember since 2020
9 years ago
Reply to  jdbolick

My take is that KATOH probably handles prospects struggling defensively at premium positions in a non-scouting way. The scouting way to look at it is to say “Isan Diaz and Brendan Rodgers are subpar at short, but they’re going to move to positions where they will be plus.” But KATOH doesn’t know that Diaz might look really good at 2nd or Rodgers might be great at 3rd where their weaknesses are hidden. I can’t figure out whether this is a feature or a bug, but it’s definitely different. I’d be interested in seeing an “offensive KATOH” that just tried to project wRC+ and see how it differed from the regular list.

jdbolickMember since 2024
9 years ago
Reply to  sadtrombone

The scouting reports don’t even say that Rodgers is subpar at short, though. That’s strictly coming from whatever Davenport numbers that KATOH is relying on.

sadtromboneMember since 2020
9 years ago
Reply to  jdbolick

Really? I feel like I’ve seen at least two scouting reports that have said “range at short is iffy, but would be plus defender at 3rd”

jdbolickMember since 2024
9 years ago
Reply to  sadtrombone

“Subpar” would be an order of magnitude more significant than that. It’s not a given that Rodgers will be able to stick at short, but saying he’s “subpar” would mean that you definitely think he shouldn’t.

PlatypiMember since 2025
9 years ago

Are there any other recent top 20 prospects KATOH has disliked to this extent?

hjrrockiesMember since 2026
9 years ago

hey that’s me

dl80Member since 2026
9 years ago
Reply to  hjrrockies

Heh, I thought you were Brendan Rogers for a second. Didn’t realize you meant in the comments.

HughMember since 2020
9 years ago
Reply to  hjrrockies

we made it!

mike sixelMember since 2016
9 years ago

I love this article. It really lays out a thought process, and is honest in it’s approach. Great stuff. I’d guess the truth is in the middle someplace.

Mario MendozaMember since 2017
9 years ago

Another one that KATOH hates even more is Renfroe. 2.4 6-year WAR and 60% likelihood of <1 WAR. (Of course, Renfroe already put up 0.6 WAR just in a cup of coffee, so those odds are considerably lower in reality.)

Just listened to Longenhagen compare Margot vs Renfroe on the Roto podcast. He ranks them pretty closely on FV, but the KATOH chart of outcomes for the two almost look like mirror images — Margot's biggest bucket is 20+ WAR; Renfroe's biggest (by FAR) is <1 WAR.

southie
9 years ago
Reply to  Mario Mendoza

Yadier Alvarez doesn’t seem to highly thought of either

sadtromboneMember since 2020
9 years ago
Reply to  southie

Alvarez has a limited track record for a 21 year old in the low minors. If he crushes AA next year the same way he did A-ball KATOH is going to think he’s a star.

sadtromboneMember since 2020
9 years ago
Reply to  Mario Mendoza

True, although Renfroe isn’t anywhere near as touted a prospect as Rodgers.

Joey Butts
9 years ago

Check out this one WEIRD trick Brendan Rogers uses to boost his power production! KATOH hates him!

swingofthings
9 years ago

To think we’re even having this conversation about Rockies’ PROSPECTS now.

ctcyawni
9 years ago

What does KATOH have Rodgers 6 year average for SLG at?

Brad JohnsonMember
9 years ago

You should unpack why KATOH loves Dylan Cozens. I think we all assumed it wasn’t adjusting for Reading’s park factors. But maybe it’s something else.

brentdaily
9 years ago
Reply to  Brad Johnson

You’re a half hour and a page refresh smarter than me.

jdbolickMember since 2024
9 years ago
Reply to  Brad Johnson

Chris explained elsewhere that Reading strongly inflates the performance of RHBs but not LHBs, so Cozens doesn’t get penalized the way that Hoskins does.

brentdaily
9 years ago

How does this square with Dylan Cozens?

He plays in a launching pad, struck out 30% of the time, mans the opposite end of the defensive spectrum and yet is #26 on the list.

I buy the rational above but can’t figure out how it doesn’t tarnish others the same way.

jjezioraMember since 2022
9 years ago

This is an amazing article, especially in the way it was written. You really did a good job of being completely reasonable.