Two Pitchers Overrated By Both ERA And FIP

The FIP statistic was created because of the inherent shortcomings of ERA; so much that was reflected in the traditional pitchers’ statistic was totally out of their control, and the new metric credited and debited hurlers for that which they did. As it turns out, FIP isn’t perfect either, as not all types of batted-ball contract are created equal. Still, FIP is preferable to ERA in just about every way imaginable, and is a much better anchor upon which to base pitcher evaluations. In any given year, however, there are pitchers who are much better (or worse) than both their ERA and FIP, once you adjust for quality of batted ball contact allowed.

A couple weeks back, we looked at Jake Odorizzi and Drew Hutchison, two pitchers who were much better than both their ERA and FIP in 2014. Today, let’s look at the two ERA-qualifying NL starters who were most significantly worse than both their ERA and FIP in 2014: Cole Hamels and Henderson Alvarez.

Cole Hamels was a blue-chipper from the get-go after being drafted by the Phils on the first round of the 2002 draft out of Rancho Bernardo HS in Southern California. Some disciplinary issues were his primary road blocks during his minor league career; on the field, he dominated the competition, posting a 14-5, 1.49, mark with a 288/75 K/BB in 218 innings, allowing only 129 hits. He has been a consistent achiever since arriving on the major league scene at age 22 in 2006, combining quantity (averaging over 200 IP per full season since 2007) with quality (career ERA- of 80, FIP- of 85).

Most future MLB starting pitchers strike out a batter per inning or more in the minor leagues. Not Henderson Alvarez, who whiffed only 309 in 429 1/3 innings after signing with the Blue Jays as an amateur free agent out of Venezuela, posting a 3.86 ERA along the way. Of course, Alvarez walked only 79 batters over that span, and regularly posted high ground ball rates, all while annually ranking among the youngest hurlers at each minor league level. Alvarez reached the majors at age 21, and was then part of the haul received by the Marlins in the post-2012 mega-deal that sent Jose Reyes, Josh Johnson, Mark Buehrle and friends north to Toronto. He missed the first half of the 2013 season due to shoulder inflammation, but has been a fixture in the Marlin rotation over the past season and a half, actually finishing 12th in the 2014 Cy Young voting.

Obviously, in Hamels and Alvarez we have two pitchers at markedly different stages in their respective careers. Hamels not long ago had a legitimate claim to first-tier honors among MLB starting pitchers. Alvarez is an up-and-comer, but his almost total inability to miss bats seems to place a pretty firm cap on his ultimate upside. In 2014, they ranked 5th and 6th, respectively, in the NL in ERA with marks of 2.46 and 2.65. Their respective FIP marks were quite a bit higher, at 3.07 and 3.58. Let’s now attempt to determine their true talent level as we enter the 2015 season.

To see what makes these two tick, let’s take a look at their 2014 plate appearance outcome frequency and production by BIP type data. First, the frequency info:

FREQ – 2014
Hamels % REL PCT
K 23.9% 123 84
BB 7.1% 100 52
POP 4.5% 67 14
FLY 26.4% 97 44
LD 22.1% 104 68
GB 47.0% 105 65
———— ———— ———– ———–
Alvarez % REL PCT
K 14.4% 74 8
BB 4.3% 61 8
POP 3.3% 49 3
FLY 22.3% 82 9
LD 21.2% 99 51
GB 53.2% 119 95

While Hamels’ K and BB rates (84 and 52 percentile ranks, respectively) remain quite solid, both are not quite up to his historical standard. His K rate percentile rank is his lowest since 2009, and his previous high BB rate percentile rank was 33. Hamels has also experienced some deterioration of his batted-ball mix. Before 2014, he had never posted a popup percentile rank below 51; last season, it cratered all the way down to 14. 2014 also marked the third straight season in which Hamels had posted a line drive percentile rank of 60 or higher. While liner rates fluctuate more than those of other BIP types, three straight high-liner seasons sure looks like a trend. On the positive side, his 2014 grounder percentile rank of 65 was the second highest of his career. Still, all in all, not an imposing frequency profile compared to previous norms.

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Alvarez is what he is; a pitch-to-contact, extreme ground ball generator. Among the 82 2014 MLB ERA qualifiers, Alvarez tied for 77th with Jeremy Guthrie in K rate. His 2014 K rate percentile rank of 8 was actually a career high. His BB rate percentile rank was also in the single digits (8), well below his previous career best of 31. His BIP frequency profile is basically etched in stone at this point; in three MLB seasons, his popup percentile ranks have resided in a narrow band between 3 and 13. Ditto his fly ball (between 4 and 9), liner (between 47 and 54) and grounder (between 93 and 95) percentile ranks.

We’ve learned quite a bit about the different types of contact allowed by these two hurlers, but not about the relative authority yielded within those BIP groups. To do so, let’s examine their production by BIP type data:

PROD – 2014
Hamels AVG OBP SLG REL PRD ADJ PRD ACT ERA CALC ERA FIP TRU ERA
FLY 0.256 0.612 80 120
LD 0.694 0.898 109 106
GB 0.222 0.248 84 106
ALL BIP 0.310 0.456 88 103
ALL PA 0.230 0.285 0.337 80 91 2.46 2.98 3.07 3.40
———— ———— ———– ———– ———– ———– ———– ———– ———– ———–
Alvarez AVG OBP SLG REL PRD ADJ PRD ACT ERA CALC ERA FIP TRU ERA
FLY 0.216 0.552 62 127
LD 0.669 0.874 102 101
GB 0.251 0.270 104 93
ALL BIP 0.321 0.450 91 104
ALL PA 0.272 0.304 0.381 95 107 2.65 3.56 3.58 4.02

The actual production allowed on each BIP type is indicated in the AVG and SLG columns, and is converted to run values and compared to MLB average in the REL PRD column. That figure is then adjusted for context, such as home park, team defense, luck, etc., in the ADJ PRD column. For the purposes of this exercise, SH and SF are included as outs and HBP are excluded from the OBP calculation.

Hamels allowed well below MLB average production on fly balls (.256 AVG-.612 SLG, 80 REL PRD). He was helped quite a bit by reasonably strong outfield defense and by a pitcher-friendly mix of parks in the NL East. His hard/soft fly ball rates indicate a context-adjusted fly ball ADJ PRD of 120. He also allowed harder than MLB average line drive and ground ball contact, with context-adjusted ADJ PRD figures of 106 for both BIP types. His relatively high grounder rate enabled him to post just a slightly above MLB average 103 ADJ PRD (or adjusted contact score) on all BIP types.

Still, Hamels’ adjusted contact score ranks a lowly 29th out of 43 qualifying MLB starters. He posted a 104 adjusted contact score in 2014, so this appears to be truly indicative of his current contact management ability. The game’s upper tier hurlers, almost to a man, manage contact at a significantly better than MLB average level. Hamels is no longer in that group.

Add back his K’s and BB’s, and Hamels’ overall ADJ PRD drops to 91, with a “tru” ERA of 3.40 that is well above his actual (2.46), and calculated component ERAs (2.98), as well as his FIP (3.07). Those metrics do not take into account the relatively high authority level of the contact made against Hamels in 2014.

Like Hamels, Alvarez allowed fairly skimpy actual production on fly balls (.216 AVG-.552 SLG, 62 REL PRD). In addition to being backed with a strong outfield defense, Alvarez pitched his home games in an extremely spacious home park. After adjustment for hard/soft fly ball rates, his ADJ PRD on fly balls leaps to 127. He allowed almost exactly league average line drive authority (101 REL PRD), and actually benefited from a contextual adjustment for ground ball authority yielded (from 104 REL PRD down to 93 ADJ PRD). Taking all BIP types into account, Alvarez’ adjusted contact score is 104, almost exactly the same as Hamels, 31st among the 43 NL ERA qualifiers.

Adding back the K’s and BB’s is not a boon for Alvarez, thanks to his extremely low K rate. His overall ADJ PRD is 107, for a “tru” ERA of 4.02. This easily exceeds his actual (2.65) and calculated component (3.56) ERAs, as well as his FIP (3.58). Not only was Alvarez helped by his ballpark and outfield defense in 2014, he was also greatly aided by sequencing. With such a low K rate, Alvarez has almost no margin for error, and needs to suffocate contact to experience long-term success. Yielding lots of grounders is a very good thing, but in a neutral park, this would have been more than offset by hard fly ball contact in 2014. The good news for Alvarez was that he didn’t pitch in a neutral park last season.

In 2014, Cole Hamels accumulated 3.8 WAR, tied to his 3.07 FIP. That WAR total drops quite a bit once it’s tied to a 3.40 “tru” ERA. Likewise, Henderson Alvarez racked up 2.2 WAR, anchored to his 3.58 FIP. That WAR total is cut down significantly once tied to a 4.02 “tru” ERA.

Hamels remains a solidly above average MLB starter, but no longer a true star, and the result has been a gap between what the rebuilding Phillies have asked for him and what potential suitors like the Red Sox have been offering in return. Alvarez is a young, promising, grounder-inducing, innings-eating starter who hopes to be more than that going forward. He is not, however, a pitcher that was worthy of accumulating down-ballot Cy Young votes in 2014.

In actuality, both pitchers are likely limited by their respective one-trick pony pitch repertoires. When Hamels was at his best, he had secondary positive pitch-value offerings to pair with his out-pitch changeup. Now, he’s allowing authoritative contact on his other pitches, and can’t always get to his change. At this stage in his career, Alvarez has yet to come up with a successful secondary offering to pair with his out-pitch two-seam fastball. To become more than a mid-rotation innings-eater, he’ll need to develop one.

Don’t get me wrong; I wouldn’t mind having either of these guys in my rotation in 2015 and beyond. This doesn’t change the fact that any publicly available metric clearly overstates the level of their true-talent 2014 contribution. Those gaudy 2.46 and 2.65 ERAs only tell a small portion of the story.





54 Comments
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My echo and bunnymen
11 years ago

I would have been sorely disappointed if you focused on two pitchers without Henderson Alvarez.

DD
11 years ago

Great breakdown on Hamels and good fodder for the trade discussions going on among fans and analysts.

Free_AEC
11 years ago
Reply to  DD

The problem is Boston both refuses to go away and they refuse to pay.

Why do so many who write about MLB continue to promote the Red Sox line that they are entitled to Hamels?

TB
11 years ago
Reply to  Free_AEC

Philly has been shopping Hamels all winter. Rumors in November had them scouting the Red Sox prospects back then. Then, they had an offer from SD, but it wasn’t enough. Either trade him for what you can get or end the rumors until trade deadline. But, instead Spring Training starts and media spots Phillies top scout (Kerfeld) at Red Sox training camp.

Who “refuses to go away”?

Fangraphs wants to track your location Free_AEC
11 years ago
Reply to  Free_AEC

The problem is you refuse to go away.

DatDudeJD
11 years ago

Ruben Amaro does not support this hogwash.

davels
11 years ago

When I think 2014 Phillies…. the first thing that jumps to mind is stellar OF defense?

I know your other column suggested that also.

I don’t see it. I see Dom Brown, a fine athlete, with horrendous baseball instincts, getting poor jumps on the ball. I see Ben Revere, who relies on his speed to make up for the constant poor routes he takes to flyballs. I see the shell of Grady Sizemore. A player with nice instincts, but no wheels. I see the lumbering firstbaseman, Darin Ruf, masquerading as a corner OF.

And its not just me. Those guys are all graded negatively right here on their fangraphs pages.

They are near universally lampooned for their defensive “prowess”.

There is some disconnect here somewhere.

While I agree that Hamels ERA overstates his performance, I fail to see how that poor excuse for an outfield helped HIM… if anything, I would think its the other way around.

Emcee Peepants
11 years ago
Reply to  davels

Agreed and the numbers back it up, Phillies OF had a UZR/150 of -6.2 (ranked 24th), a DRS of -27 (27th), and a dWAR of -33.1 (26th). You also forgot to mention Malron Byrd, who the metrics generally like, but was pretty horrendous by the eye test.

tz
11 years ago
Reply to  Emcee Peepants

It is possible that by random chance the Phillies’ OF had better defensive “scores” when Hamels pitched than the other pitchers in 2014, due to SSS. I remember MGL took a look at how the Tiger’s awful infield defense affected each of their starters, and it turned out that they actually had a positive UZR for one of them (I think it was Verlander).

Anyway, since we don’t have access to Tony’s secret sauce, I took a quick look at Hamel’s spray charts on this site. It looks like both RHB and LHB hit a good number of line drives off him (25% overall) and a lot of LD/FB to right field. It looks like Byrd pretty much got the job done on the games that Hamels pitched, and given his +3 UZR range factor last year, it’s possible that’s where a lot of the defensive “help” came from.

It’s also totally possible that defensive positioning worked more than normal when Hamels pitched next year. I’d be interested if Tony had the Phillies OF as a plus for ALL their games or just the ones Hamels started.

davels
11 years ago
Reply to  tz

Tony is using BIP data, so I would believe its based on a larger scale view, and not as individualized as UZR/DRS etc. Its certainly possible that the Phils performed better with Hamels on the mound, but Tony’s NL East preview indicates that the Phils OF defense was better than average last season… and that the Phils had the best defense in the division last year (primarily because of the OFs).

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/pre-spring-divisional-outlook-nl-east/#more-175463

Tony’s work is terrific. But I just can’t wrap my head around the Phils 2014 OF as being actually good.

And yes, I forgot about Byrd, and he is respectable. But he’s about the only one that was.

Maybe (probably…) I’m just missing something.

Emcee Peepants
11 years ago
Reply to  tz

By the numbers, the Phils overall defense had a UZR/150 of -4.7 (26th), a DRS of -39 (25th), and a dWAR of -13.7 (24th), below the rest of the NL East on all 3 measures.

JSL
11 years ago
Reply to  tz

The Phillies’ OF defense last season was a dumpster fire on top of a tire fire inside of a giant clown car that was set on fire. Certainly to the eye test, it was disastrous. Far more important than the eye test, every defensive system except apparently what the author uses backs this up. Brown is one of the worst OFers in baseball, Revere below average, and Byrd even struggled last season.

The author’s point about Hamels decrease in popout rate is interesting. Otherwise there is nothing convincing to suggest we need to look past Hamels’ 3.07 FIP as a measure of his true ability.

It’s also worth noting that Hamels started the season on the DL, came out of the gate with two poor starts in his first three and was his usual elite self after that.

Alex87878
11 years ago
Reply to  davels

I agree as well davels. My other question would be the other point being made, which is that Hamels was benefitted by “pitcher friendly” parks in the NL East.

In my opinion, regardless of how pitcher friendly the other parks may be, Hamels still has to pitch his home games in Philly, which, if I recall correctly, is hitter friendly. Thus, if 81 games are played away and 81 at home, then wouldn’t that point cross itself out?

plasmaj
11 years ago

looks like an interesting method, but is this something you just made up? Or is there any analysis that “tru” has as any more or even as much predictive ability as FIP, xFIP, SIERA or tERA (and whatever happened to tERA on Fangraphs?)?

tERA
11 years ago
Reply to  plasmaj

They sold me to Blecher Report for twenty bucks and a case of Bud Lite when I was overheard muttering that Mookie Betts is an overrated twat. Cameron, I gonna get you!

tz
11 years ago
Reply to  tERA

I’m a fan of yours, and of course also Mookie.

Timber
11 years ago

Good analysis for a one year sampling, but you’re making some definitive statements about what these pitchers are going forward based on this one year of data. For example, is it not possible that a one year drop in popup percentile is an outlier versus a profile going forward? Wouldn’t a reversion back to the mean change that profile?

Also: “He was helped quite a bit by reasonably strong outfield defense”. Cole Hamels played in front of one barely average right fielder, one below average center fielder, and one atrocious left fielder according to UZR (grades are even worse according to DRS), so is this statement made based on defensive data pulled during only Cole Hamel outings?

tz
11 years ago
Reply to  Timber

One thing to note is that Hamels pitched like his historically strong self with runners on in 2014, but had a much higher wOBA and worse overall peripherals with the bases empty.

I’m not sure whether the contact quality Tony mentions is a statistical blip or part of a trend. Probably need a continuation of that to say Hamels is declining just yet.

Some Dude
11 years ago

I don’t recall hearing about Hamels having disciplinary issues in the minors…a quick Googling didn’t turn up anything either. I’m not trying to dredge up the past, but I was wondering if it was general first-round pick surliness, or Buchholz-level laptop thievery (or worse). Anyone know more?

Dan R
11 years ago
Reply to  Some Dude

He did break his hand in a bar fight.

http://articles.philly.com/2005-02-02/sports/25444846_1_cole-hamels-randall-culp-phillies-prospect

However, if you read the article, I don’t think you’ll come away thinking that Hamels had disciplinary issues (he says in the article he was designated driver).

Iron
11 years ago
Reply to  Dan R

I’m not sure that I’d believe his claim of being the designated driver, but even if we give him that, what kind of an ass gets into a bar fight while sober. That might actually be worse.

Phrozen
11 years ago
Reply to  Iron

It happened ten years ago. I don’t see how that’s particularly relevant to a guy with nearly nine years of ML experience.

Phillies113
11 years ago

This would’ve been fantastic analysis AFTER he’d been traded. Thankfully, RAJ took care of that last Jul…oh. Well, at least it was still taken care of in the offsea…

Sigh…………..

Matthew
11 years ago

“When Hamels was at his best, he had secondary positive pitch-value offerings to pair with his out-pitch changeup.”

Woah slow down Mike. Cole Hamels developed another elite pitch last year in the Curveball. It generated top 5 Whiff/Swing% and elite 61% groundball rate. The cutter is probably a plus pitch too getting a bit below average whiffs, but well above average grounders.

I’ll agree Alavarez is a one trick pony, but I think there is something about the hard fastball/hard changeup combo that allows him to generate weak contact a la King Felix.

HT
11 years ago

Where, if anywhere, are stats referred to in Blengino’s articles available en masse? I’m not finding REL PRD, ADJ PRD, TRU ERA easy to find. TIA.

Phillies113
11 years ago
Reply to  HT

They are stats that Blengino is using for the purpose of his analysis. REL PRD is relative production as compared to the rest of MLB, while ADJ PRD is adjusted production; this is relative production that is further adjusted for home park, defense, luck, etc. TRU ERA is what each player’s “true” ERA would be when accounting for all these factors, whereas ACT ERA is the actual ERA that player recorded. These stats are not widely available as Blengino calculates them himself.

dj_mosfett
11 years ago
Reply to  Phillies113

So you mean they’re unfalsifiable hogwash.

Mike Ozkalych
11 years ago

This is an incredibly stupid article.

Ted Lehman
11 years ago

This is like the 8th article this year on Fangraphs trying to argue that Cole Hamels is not very good. Seems like a weirdly specific pattern.

nik
11 years ago
Reply to  Ted Lehman

The number of anti-Hamels articles is directly correlated to Mookie Betts hype articles.

Jail_AEC
11 years ago
Reply to  nik

Fangraphs is in the back pocket of John Middleton, trying to make it impossible to get anything in return for future Hall of Famer Handsome Cole Hamels

The zeros are also four in number.

Sack of garbage.

JOHN MIDDLETON is a LOOTER.

Highlight and Google: They’re Coming To Take Me Away HahaJohn Powers Middleton Felony Fraud

_

J.P. Arencibia’s kitchen is as big as the first floor of my
house.

I wonder where the $6 BILLION that John Middleton gave
Fangraphs to buy players went to?

Emcee Peepants
11 years ago
Reply to  Jail_AEC

I’m actually having a hard time distinguishing if this is the actual “felony fraud” guy or some one mocking him. And I like it.

Bread N Mustard
11 years ago
Reply to  Jail_AEC

Most fans don’t like the team owners and think the ownership could be doing more to help the team. The reality is that billionaires take advantage of people and then swim in their pool of cash. At least the Phillies have won a couple of world series titles they can cherish. The Mariners have an owner who has never been to a Mariners game in his life and a CEO that knows nothing about baseball. The fans don’t even have a championship to cherish.

Maybe there is more to life than baseball!

John C
11 years ago
Reply to  Ted Lehman

Fangraphs is part of an elaborate plot, along with the CIA, KGB, GIGN, Mossad and the Illuminati, to bring down Ruben Amaro Jr. by making it impossible for him to trade Hamels for anything more than a broken bat and two buckets of baseballs.

Phillies113
11 years ago
Reply to  John C

What about the Freemasons? What exactly are you trying to hide by not mentioning them?

PPP
11 years ago
Reply to  John C

Don’t forget the No Homers Club. Since RA is only concerned with RBIs and HRs, it’s pretty clear why those two don’t get along.

arc
11 years ago
Reply to  Ted Lehman

Link to seven other articles making that argument. I bet you won’t get to three.

plasmaj
11 years ago
Reply to  arc

8 is certainly hyperbole, but this is at least the second (but probably there are more that just mention hamels in passing) that is using some new, out-of-nowhere methodology to talk down Hamels. If this one, or the other one were thought to be great, statistically significant methodologies, do a study/analysis on them to show they are valid or predictive, or more descriptive of real performance than other analytics that are already on the player page. This is Fangraphs after all. But don’t just do another basic, statistically insignificant regression. I am with the Birchwood Brothers on the lack of rigor in some analyses.

And if the analysis shows that this method is great, show a list of the pitchers who are most overrated according to it and those that are most underrated, rather than just randomly pick on 2 guys.

Yep
11 years ago
Reply to  Ted Lehman

I could not stop laughing while reading this article because of this. FanGraphs seems to be trying very hard to convince everyone that Hamels isn’t good, and taking really long winded and mediocre approaches to doing so. There’s a general tendency on FanGraphs to be buyer friendly, I find. I vote for a name change to OwnersGraphs.

Free_AEC
11 years ago
Reply to  Yep

SPOT ON

The fascist cadre here speak in the lingo of the business school student, the true enemy of the American people. They sent all the jobs to China and are throwing us out onto the streets and winking at the cops as they assassinate us one by one, on video, and get away with it.

All inquire into what is really now obvious to the majority of Americans is labeled as “tinfoil hat” or “conspiracy theory”.

You can’t debate fascists. They are explicitly looking to squelch speech that inquires and they will use any means including murderous violence to enforce their opinions.

Irony
11 years ago
Reply to  Free_AEC

is when a troll (apparently unwittingly) makes an inflammatory comment on a thread in which he has already been summarily satirized 🙂

PJ
11 years ago

Ks are overrated. Outs are outs. I thought that was reason why Fangraphs exists. To show that the guy who Ks 200 times a year is just as valuable if he has a .400 OBP.

Also, “Not only was Alvarez helped by his ballpark and outfield defense in 2014, he was also greatly aided by sequencing.”, none of this is changing for Alvarez this year.

aariediger
11 years ago
Reply to  PJ

Ks don’t matter much for batters. They might even have a positive correlation to hitting ability (more ks=better hitter). They are life and death for pitchers. There is evidence that batted ball management doesn’t matter at all, it’s just Ks and BBs. I watch the Twins, groundballs are meaningless and Ks are all important. Too bad they’ve got the two mixed up

arc
11 years ago
Reply to  PJ

You are deeply confused.

Mike13
11 years ago

Ks are not overrated at all. A K gives you a definite out while any other out comes from a batted ball, which has a higher chance of becoming a hit.

Ks are rated fine, but they should not be held on the same level as other outs

Drew VanWert
11 years ago

In a league with Complete Games as a category, Alvarez gets a bump in value. He had a few last year.

Kyle
11 years ago

Most future MLB starting pitchers strike out a batter per inning or more in the minor leagues.

This sounded to me like an unresearched blanket statement. So because I’ve got nothing better to do I took a quick look at a few things. I will admit this is not the most scientific research as I haven’t factored in rehab starts or being sent down after a full season in the bigs

Here are the k/9 of the Top 10 2015 Free Agent Starting Pitchers

Justin Masterson 7.5
James Shields 7.9
Jason Hammel 7.9
Jon Lester 8.3
Ervin Santana 9.1
Edinson Volquez 9.2
Brandon McCarthy 9.6
Francisco Liriano 10.1
Jake Peavy 11.1
Max Scherzer 11.4

How bout the last 10 years worth of Cy Young winners.

2014 Kluber 9.1 / Kershaw 11.4
2013 Scherzer 11.4 / Kershaw<strike
2012 Price 9.3 / Dickey 5.9
2011 Verlander 10.3 /
Kershaw
2010 Hernandez 10.7 / Halladay 5.9
2009 Greinke 7.6 / Lincecum 14.9
2008 Lee 10.1 /
Lincecum
2007 Sabathia 10.3 /Peavy 11.1
2006 Santana 9.2 /Webb 8.1
2005 Colon 9.0 /Chris Carpenter 8.3

25 different players… 9 under 9.0 – Mark me among the people that doesn’t think 64% is considered MOST. Using 17 Cy Young winners and 8 Free Agents signings (two overlap in Scherzer and Peavy) our ratio is 16:9.

I’d love to see more in depth study by someone who gets paid to this kind of thing that proves me wrong. But I would venture to say the sample size used is pretty representative (if not skewed towards the high end of the 120 SP that will be in rotations to open the 2015 season.

Kyle
11 years ago
Reply to  Kyle

Thats what happens when you try and get cute with HTML. Where’s the edit button?

Kyle
11 years ago
Reply to  Kyle

Try again.

Most future MLB starting pitchers strike out a batter per inning or more in the minor leagues.

This sounded to me like an unresearched blanket statement. So because I’ve got nothing better to do I took a quick look at a few things. I will admit this is not the most scientific research as I haven’t factored in rehab starts or being sent down after a full season in the bigs

Here are the k/9 of the Top 10 2015 Free Agent Starting Pitchers

Justin Masterson 7.5
James Shields 7.9
Jason Hammel 7.9
Jon Lester 8.3
Ervin Santana 9.1
Edinson Volquez 9.2
Brandon McCarthy 9.6
Francisco Liriano 10.1
Jake Peavy 11.1
Max Scherzer 11.4

How bout the last 10 years worth of Cy Young winners.

2014 Kluber 9.1 / Kershaw 11.4
2013 Scherzer 11.4 / Kershaw
2012 Price 9.3 / Dickey 5.9
2011 Verlander 10.3 / Kershaw
2010 Hernandez 10.7 / Halladay 5.9
2009 Greinke 7.6 / Lincecum 14.9
2008 Lee 10.1 /Lincecum
2007 Sabathia 10.3 /Peavy 11.1
2006 Santana 9.2 /Webb 8.1
2005 Colon 9.0 /Chris Carpenter 8.3

25 different players… 9 under 9.0 – Mark me among the people that doesn’t think 64% is considered MOST. Using 17 Cy Young winners and 8 Free Agents signings (two overlap in Scherzer and Peavy) our ratio is 16:9.

I’d love to see more in depth study by someone who gets paid to this kind of thing that proves me wrong. But I would venture to say the sample size used is pretty representative (if not skewed towards the high end of the 120 SP that will be in rotations to open the 2015 season.

Jon L.
11 years ago
Reply to  Kyle

64% is most. Whether you go by the dictionary definition, common parlance, usage in analytics contexts, it doesn’t matter. 64% is bigger than 50% (and a lot bigger than 36%). That’s just what the word means.

radicalhenri
11 years ago

To me this just seems to be making definitive claims based on evidence that is relatively convincing, but not definitive.

hinkie's method
11 years ago

I enjoy pieces like this because they remind me of the combination of iconoclastic energy and stubborn groupthink that made this site great once upon a time.

#RIPNotgraphs
#RIPFangraphs

Jim
11 years ago

Saw the title of the article and thought to myself “How will they try to discount Cole Hamels today?” It is an absolute joke that you called our outfield defense stellar. Ben Revere has no arm and takes bad routes, Dom Brown looks completley lost out there, and Byrd/Sizemore weren’t impressive at all. Seriously, what makes you say they have good outfield defense? It doesn’t pass the eye pattern or do well with defensive metrics. What could possibly lead you to that conclusion? The only thing I can think of is if you saw a few Ben Revere diving catches and thought that made him elite.

Something that’s amazing is nobody ever mentions how Cole Hamels has among the worst run support every year, even when the Phillies were bad.

I have lost enormous amounts of respect for this site because of the whole anti-Hamels campaign.

Matt Mc
11 years ago

Just wanted to point out that by no means is hamels’ outfield defense “reasonably strong. ” Dom Brown is one of the worst outfielders in the game defensively, revere is average at best because he takes Benny hill routes to get to balls and has a weak arm, and Marlon Byrd wasn’t exactly Willie Mays out there. If anything hamels was hurt by the outfield defense, and by the defense as a whole.