LaCava Turns Down Baltimore GM Job
In a Hot Stove season that generally focuses on organizational acquisitions, multiple league sources reported yesterday that Tony LaCava has turned down the general manager position with the Baltimore Orioles and will remain the assistant general manager with the Toronto Blue Jays.
The intriguing aspect of this development, however, is not that LaCava turned down Baltimore in favor of Toronto. It’s more that nobody in the baseball community believes he made the wrong choice. In fact, national writers immediately took to Twitter with snide comments such as: “Nobody blames him.”
So, why does no one seemingly covet the GM job in Baltimore? After all, only 30 GM positions exist in baseball.
A general manager is ultimately judged by wins and losses, and the Baltimore Orioles are not in a position to win anytime soon. Perhaps they can threaten a .500 record in the next half-decade, but we’re talking about an Orioles’ franchise that has not won more than 79 games since 1997.
To be fair, the 2011 season was supposed to be different. We ranked the Orioles at #15 in the Organizational Rankings prior to the season on the strength of their young talent reaching the big league level — such as Matt Wieters, Jake Arrieta, Brian Matusz, and Zach Britton — but the 2011 Orioles only won 69 games and were outscored by 152 runs on the year.
Not only did the Orioles win few games, but the three components of a team’s ability were all well below-average:
Team Offense: .320 wOBA (24th of 30 teams)
Team Pitching: 4.67 FIP (30th of 30 teams)
Team Defense: -53.6 UZR (29th of 30 teams)
Blech. Having some young, projectable talent on the big league club is certainly desirable, but it would be nice to have something to show for it in the performance, as well.
The Orioles are also stuck in the AL East, making their climb out of the cellar even more daunting. If the organization were in the AL Central or NL Central, the prospects of a fundamental turnaround would not be so unlikely. But in a division that features perennial Goliaths such as the Red Sox and Yankees, the Orioles are not just behind the eight ball. They are behind two eight balls and up against the bumper with only a sliver of daylight.
This is not to say that Tony LaCava couldn’t have succeeded as the GM of the Orioles. After all, the Tampa Bay Rays have one of the smallest markets in the MLB and have made the postseason three of the past four years. The possibility clearly exists. Of course, the Rays built through the draft and have a farm system stocked to the gills with potential impact talent.
The Orioles, however, have a below-average farm system. Shortstop Manny Machado receives the bulk of the attention, but the shelves are otherwise bare. Baseball America ranked the organization at #21 in their farm system rankings, Keith Law ranked them #24, and former scout, Frankie Piliere, ranked Baltimore at #25.
Tony LaCava — or any potential Orioles’ GM — would have inherited a poor big league squad (admittedly with some young talent) and a poor farm system in what is the most difficult division in all of baseball.
Talk about setting yourself up for success.
Then, almost adding insult to injury at this point, the new Orioles’ general manager will surely have to navigate a power struggle with manager Buck Showalter and owner Peter Angelos. For example, Roch Kubatko of MASN reported last night that “there were disagreements over some personnel moves” that LaCava wanted to make upon his arrival.
Of course there was.
A general manager must be the captain of the ship. Perhaps more importantly, the owner and manager must trust the captain to navigate the difficult and choppy waters ahead. A captain cannot adequately and successfully do his job if he is constantly asking for permission and/or making personnel decisions with anything but success on his mind.
Between the poor big league club, poor farm system, and difficult working conditions with manager and owner, it’s no surprise that Tony LaCava would choose to stay with the Toronto Blue Jays. Peter Angelos has to be wondering, though … does any qualified candidate legitimately want this job?
J.P. Breen is a graduate student at the University of Chicago. For analysis on the Brewers and fantasy baseball, you can follow him on Twitter (@JP_Breen).
How about the fact that Baltimore is arguably the worst city in North America and Toronto is arguably the best. Does that deserve any consideration?
I agree Toronto is awesome, but I find it hard to believe Baltimore is the worst city in North America.
I mean you’re including Mexico in this Conversation. I’m pretty sure Baltimore isn’t overrun by crime syndicates like some cities are in Mexico.
Worst city? Have you ever lived in Baltimore?
He probably watched “The Wire”.
That’s a cheap shot man. Toronto is undeniably awesome but Baltimore is a great city in a state that is the most affluent in the US. I’m not saying that Baltimore is anywhere near as great as Toronto as a city and, just as obviously, as a baseball organization but Baltimore has some extraordinary neighborhoods and great history.
I agree. I live in Toronto, but from what I’ve seen of Baltimore, it is certainly a place I have not been that I’d like to visit.
I’m constantly between NYC, Philly, Baltimore, and DC, and I’ll take Baltimore over any of those cities any day of the week.
Pffffffff yea, Baltimore over NYC in a heartbeat.
Wait we’re talking about murders per capita fantasy league, right?
Baltimore’s a pretty awesome city. You should visit it sometime.
Ok, let’s stop this train before we all end up in Hamsterdam looking for blue tops, eating crabs, wearing Ripken throwbacks.
I can say vanilla ice cream is pretty awesome, and believe me, it is fucking delicious, but that doesn’t mean that there aren’t 1000000 other flavors of ice cream you would rather have than vanilla. So while saying “Vanilla ice cream is an awesome city” is true, it’s misrepresenting the situation. The reality is, it’s great compared to a tuna sandwich, but not really that great at all when compared to peanut butter cup ice cream.
No one wants to bash on a city, so let’s not bash. But if you’ve ever actually spent time in major cities and in BMore, you know exactly where it stands.
Which is somewhere around Tuna Sandwich… with razor blades in it.
^^what an @$$. No, its not chicago, or new york, but it doesn’t have to be to be an awesome place to be. I can think of about a dozen places on the top of my head that I would rather be in Baltimore than. Also, your metaphor is incoherent and rambling, and wtf are blue tops?
Dude, I’m mostly just trying to funny. Try not to take it personally. Murdermore is cool (as my Baltimore friends call it), and it’s great that you love it so much. Just don’t be so delusional to think it’s at the top of everyone’s list.
Also, blue tops = crack.
First things first: blue tops = heroin. Spider bags = crack. If you’re going to diss Baltimore, get your traditional West Baltimore drug slang accurate.
Secondly, I lived in Baltimore. I also lived in Washington D.C., San Diego, Chicago, and New York City. It is with that perspective that I say Baltimore is a great city that people should visit if they would like to have an informed perspective.
Baltimore’s not like vanilla ice cream. It’s more like pistachio. Not for everyone, but if you’re willing to give it a chance and accept it on its on terms, it’s pretty F’n rad in its own way.
The crime rate is perhaps the most overinflated piece of statistical subterfuge in this conversation, and it’s something I’d expect to be understood on Fangraphs. The murder rate in Baltimore is through the roof. It’s deplorable. But the reality is that all of the crime is contained within a few neighborhoods that are physically isolated due to years of infrastructure and policy neglect. No one who lives in Federal Hill, Fells Point, Hamden, Mt. Vernon, Canton, Locust Point, et al would ever be forced to come in contact with the city’s criminal reputation, because the neighborhoods in which it exists have been systematically cordoned off by highways, public transportation infrastructure and warehouse districts over the last 50 years. In effect, the Baltimore which we are discussing has a crime rate comparable to any other major city. The areas of the city that have been neglected by three generations of politicians, meanwhile, have a crime rate comparable to Baghdad or Juarez.
But then again, no one ever mentions a desire to avoid San Diego because there’s so much violent crime in Tijuana.
In conclusion. Baltimore: great city. You should visit sometime.
(Also, your friends aren’t original in saying “Bodymore, Murdaland.” It comes from the title sequence in The Wire).
Your “Baltimore friends”? I suspect your only Baltimore friends are in fact from The Wire and I’m as big a Wire and David Simon fan as there is. Just like you say no one is “bashing” the O’s, no one here is saying Baltimore “is at the top of everyone’s list”. Just saying it’s actually a nice city that has taken a huge hit (see season 1 – 5, but especially 2, of The Wire) but is far from what was most prominently, and very honestly, displayed on The Wire. The creators of the show say this as well.
“Telo says: … No one wants to bash on a city, so let’s not bash.”
Define hypocrite for me, sir.
Heroin! Yes of course… About the rest of it, I don’t hate Baltimore at all, everyone here is taking this a little too personal. You can all have the last word. Baltimore is an awesome, fun city, and it is pretty safe. No sarcasm, or qualifiers. I’ve been there, it’s true.
A friend of mine took a wrong turn in Baltimore once. While stopped at a traffic signal, a group of kids wearing ski masks started firing paintball guns at her car. I’ve been to a few shows there and it seemed like a fine city, but that shit is straight up wack.
Telo
maybe you should stop “trying to be funny”.
Your career success rate is abysmally low.
Provided the organizations were equal, I’d rather be a baseball GM in Baltimore than Toronto. Baltimore is a much better baseball town than Toronto.
As for the baseball part of. How could Angelos be so naive? Is his non-baseball business successful making him believe he has any idea how to procure talent for a baseball team better than an expert? Also, the Orioles haven’t been good for over a decade. Maybe he should realize his ideas aren’t the answer.
After clearly being the third choice, after Dipoto and Lacava, will De Jon Watson still consider the job if it was offered?
Also, you should check back in with Roch and his most recent conversation with Lacava which sheds some more light on the situation. Or does it? I guess it’s hard to say with certainty that Lacava isn’t just trying to not rub more salt in the wound by having some very good things to say about the Angelos family and Buck.
If what Lacava says to Roch is true then it appears that Angelos is finally ready to allow his GM to focus heavily on scouting and development and the international market.
we’ll see…
Perhaps it’s really awesome to work with AA in Toronto, too. He might be making a believer of the long standing people there that Toronto is the place to be, so they don’t go elsewhere even if it means a “better” job. For example, Brian Butterfield, who is thought of as one of the best candidates to be a manager, decided not to leave either and Jays fans are thankful for it.
Yes, as an O’s fan I am very envious of what Toronto is doing. I was really excited at the prospect of Lacava joining the O’s and bringing some of that creativity to Baltimore. Oh well…
I wonder if Thad Levine, IF the O’s decide to interview him, would be interested. He supposedly grew up and Oriole fan. On the other hand, I suppose he had a hand in firing Buck back in Texas so I wonder if Buck would balk…
Why not make Showalter the GM/FM? If he really thinks he is best placed to judge talent then he should take the job and be accoutable for his decisions.
And no matter what it appears that Buck will have a large say with what is going on, particularly with the ML roster. Supposedly however, Buck wanted to stay in the dugout. There was consideration given to Buck moving up to the front office and Willie Randolph taking over in the dugout. After it became clear the Buck didn’t want to do that Randolph left. As of the moment I imagine Buck along with Matt Klentak and perhaps Dave Stockstill are going to try and hold down the fort.
I believe Buck would need there to be 48 hours in a day to handle that many responsibilities.
SHORT VERSION:
If your time frame is the next decade and the criteria is making the playoffs, there is no team worse off than the Orioles, and it’s really not even close.
TLC is 52, so a decade time horizon may not be something he’d relish.
Hmm, I guess I don’t get your point. He certainly wouldn’t last the whole decade if he did take the job. I’m guessing whoever the Os nab will last about 4-5 years. Then they’ll need another scapegoat to ease the transition into their next rebuild phase… endless cycle of losing… yadayada.
The slightly longer version, and what I guess I thought was obvious is:
If he took the job he’d undoubtedly “fail”, no matter how good he was. Moreover, he’d likely put himself directly into the group of failed GMs that just don’t look appealing to any other potential front offices. Since he’s clearly on the short list of next potential GMs right now, why take a guaranteed loser with a 98% chance of being unhire-able afterward? Just bide your time and wait for a decent situation. In the meantime, you have an awesome team with an awesome front office, you’re just second in command. I’m sure he loves his life.
you honestly have no clue. To say any team is hopeless in 10 years in asinine. So few players in the majors will still be in the majors, and the minor league will have gone through 3 cycles. Congrats Telo for being able to kick a team when they are down in the comment boards.
Heyo… someone’s an O’s fan. Let me dispassionately dismantle your lunatic rant.
The Best Division In Professional Sports: The American League East.
Start at the top – the two biggest payrolls in baseball – the Yankees and Red Sox. Indisputable powerhouses on the field and off. 3 World Series in 8 years, playoff berths galore, FA acquisitions at will, front offices with endless resources and innovation to boot. I shouldn’t have to explain how good these teams are and will be. There is a direct correlation in baseball to spending money and winning. Forget for a second that these teams are also fairly progressive thinkers. These are the best two franchises in baseball… holy shit, Dave and I agree on something.
The Rays. I’d love to just send you straight to Jonah on this one… I’ll just say this – the most efficiently run team in all of baseball, likely in sports history. This team is a marvel of development and scouting. It’s frankly amazing what they have been able to accomplish in the last few years.
The Blue Jays. Making a case to the savviest GM in all of sports, AA has been working other GMs like a puppet master over the past year or two. Besides flipping Napoli, it;s like this guy is a Jedi. They have a deep farm system, a very competitive payroll, and a rock solid front office that absolutely has to be in the discussion for top 3 in the league. This team has talent now, and has talent coming, and will surely make good decision with their assets in the coming years.
The Orioles. Hey, you could make a legit case that these 4 franchises are 4 of the top 5 or 6 franchises in baseball! I can only really safely say that the Braves deserve to sit with them, anyone else… I just don’t know. The Orioles aren’t terrible, they’re not buffoons, they’re not doomed… they are just so grossly over matched in every possible way.
I just don’t see another team in the league that has as little of a chance to make the playoffs than the orioles do in the next 10 years. Yes, most players will have come and gone in that time period, but take all of the factors that don’t relate to current players… the Orioles are still just terribly overmatched.
Telo, I’m sorry, but you are being a complete tool.
You list Toronto and Tampa as being two of the the top run teams in the game. Go back 6 years and people would say the exact opposite. For you to project a team to have no chance of winning in the next 10 years is hyperbolic and foolish.
K.
One of us is attacking the other person’s character, while the other is presenting facts and making coherent arguments.
Plus, you’re not “sorry”. So, why say it?
Go ahead and deflect from the main point if you want.
Doesn’t change the FACT that your argument actually disproves your original statement.
wat…..?
Unless you start saying actual things, I have no idea how to respond to you.
“Actual things”… let’s see you respond to that Telo!
I honestly dont understand why a team being admittedly horrible is a deterrent. I would revel in the challenge, and if you never succeeded would it really permanently damage your career? I think it is a low risk, high reward opportunity for an up and coming GM type. You get the Os out of the not so proverbial shit storm and you can have your choice of other jobs, as well as commanding a ton of money. Look at Andrew Friedman. any team would give their left nut to have him as a GM.
I think you make a really good point, while obviously much of what Telo is saying is also true. GM’s around the league are very smart people and they much a much wider window into the actual inner workings of these organizations – not just their own. Any GM interviewing in Baltimore knows the odds that are stacked against them when they take that job. The main point I take away from Telo is that the O’s situation is so dire because they are looking up not just at NY and Bos but also at possibly the best run organization in sports (TB) and maybe #1a in Toronto. It’s daunting. So again, the GM’s know what they are getting into and you would want someone who would want to face that head on.
Baltimore has resources. You get a smart person in there they could turn the franchise around. It could be done in a much quicker time frame than what Telo is kind’ve saying, IMHO, but yes the O’s face the most difficult challenge in baseball.
All it’s going to take is one year where the Orioles have quality starting pitching, something that is bound to happen sooner or later, and this is a team that is going to start surprising a lot of people really fast. Look at what they did to contending teams at the end of this year. Real playoff teams that were putting their best players on the field because they needed to win, and the Orioles took them apart. The second their pitching came out of their multi-month long funk and started performing just half-way decently, they hit the ground running. They won games against David Price, Dan Haren, Josh Beckett (twice), Jon Lester, Johann Santana, and Justin Verlander all in a very short span of time. This was all with very mediocre pitching. David Price has spoken himself about how impressed he is with the Orioles offense and defense, as have many others.
The first year they get some real, major league pitching going for them, there are going to be a lot of naysayers out there that are suddenly going to start to look real stupid.
The Pittsburgh Pirates have been even longer without a winning season than the Orioles, and I guarantee you, sooner or later, they will be consistent contenders from one year to the next in the NL Central. Everything goes in cycles. RIght now, the Orioles are in a down cycle, but it can’t and won’t last forever. Some day it will be the teams that are successful now that will be counting their consecutive losing seasons. This is just the nature of the game, and it only takes a very short look through baseball’s history to figure this out, yet so many people haven’t been able to do this.
It baffles me when people bash on the Orioles so badly, when any team they see as successful has by all odds been a poor team in the past and will with certainty be a poor team in the future, maybe sooner than later.
More importantly, whatever GM decides to take this job is going to find himself with a very rich opportunity in front of him. There’s no such thing as an easy GM job, but it’s also not exceedingly difficult to take a job in a city with a winning team and have success. On the other hand, to go to a struggling team, a team that’s been in baseball hell for fourteen years, yet a team that has as much heart and as rich of a history as more or less any team in baseball – to bring that team to success – that is something beautiful. That is true greatness, and I believe Tony LaCava could have been the man to achieve it. I’m sorry for him that he won’t get the opportunity. He seems very happy where he is, though, and that’s what really matters in the end. Toronto is lucky to have time, without a doubt.
* lucky to have him
“It baffles me when people bash on the Orioles so badly, when any team they see as successful has by all odds been a poor team in the past and will with certainty be a poor team in the future, maybe sooner than later.”
Honestly, no one, not a single person has “bashed” the Orioles. People have said they have a below average farm system, a somewhat dysfunctional front office/owner/manager situation, not a great team at the present… and still the biggest factor is that they can’t spend a ton of money and are in the hardest division in baseball. They are just in a bad spot. It’s not personal. No one hates the O’s.
I’ve heard hundreds of people bash the Orioles. Glad to hear you haven’t, but I have. I wasn’t referring to any of the comments on here, just comments I’ve heard in general. The Orioles have a very poor farm system, without a doubt, and they are in a bad spot, although I wouldn’t go as far as to say the worst spot in baseball – probably not far from it, though. They are in a tough division, but the divisions could be realigned sooner than we think, or obliterated all together, especially with a new commissioner on the horizon. As bad of a position as they may be in, any presently successful team has been in a bad position at some point. That’s the nature of our game, and watching a team rise from the ashes is one of the greatest things to behold in professional sports. Obviously, it will happen sooner or later, and I am personally looking forward to it, as am I looking forward to the day the Pirates come back around and start having success in the NL. And while I hear many people make a point to go on and on about the negative sides to this organization, I never hear much about the positive sides, of which there are plenty. The Orioles’ new GM will have a lot of freedom financially. They may not have a large payroll, but they have more money available than some teams that do have larger payrolls, and they are ready to spend more than ever. Andy MacPhail has left the franchise with a lot of wiggle room in terms of salaries. Not much of their money is tied up in expensive, long term contracts, which means any GM who wants to come in and make changes is going to be able to do so quickly and precisely, whereas Theo Epstein in Chicago, for example, will likely have to wait two or three years before he can have a chance of significantly helping that team. This is a big plus for Baltimore. Also, the major league team is constantly underestimated and has much more talent than most people seem to want to acknowledge. They are one heavy bat in the cleanup spot away from potentially being one of the best offenses in the AL, something many people haven’t paid enough attention to realize (again, not referring to people here, just people in general). The minor league system is lacking depth, but again, that won’t take long for a new GM to set straight if he knows how to do his job. This is a team that is primed for success. All it will take is someone to take the reigns and make it happen, someone who has the knowhow and the fortitude to see it through. The Orioles’ biggest failure in recent years, more than anything else, has been their inability to find those type of people. Their problems are off the field, not on it, and when that is rectified, things will turn around very quickly in Baltimore. LaCava could have been the beginning of that process. Had he have been hired, I truly believe the Orioles would have started to turn heads much sooner than later. Now, it will all depend on who gets the job in his place…
Holy wall of text.
Garrett obviously scrolled past that before I did.
As a Jays fan, this development made me really happy. It sounds as though LaCava is an integral part of the Toronto front office, and the word was he would have taken some staff to Baltimore as well. But the Jays should prepare for his eventual departure – I expect him to get a better GM offer within the next couple of years. Somehow I think this will be a bigger challenge for Anthopoulos than finding a second baseman or another starting pitcher.
I like to imagine Peter Angelos basking in the warm sun of Bill Bavasi Island anytime the opportunity presents itself . . . and even when it doesn’t.
“Regarding your suggested personnel moves, Mr. LaCava, let me tell you about the time I traded a cranky, injury-prone Canadian wise-ass for Adam Jones, George Sherrill and our entire AAA pitching staff.”
Of course he didn’t want to work for the Orioles, just watching that team will rot your brain. And now, a word from our sponsor — THE BALTIMORE ORIOLES? AWW CRAP. /Krusty
Haha. Yeah! Up top, bro!
At some point (’12 or ’13), the Jays will hit competition mode and 4 of the 5 best (Rangers) AL teams could be in the AL East. Being an Orioles GM while this is all going on would be a huge challenge.
At some point in the next 5 years, TB’s bubble will burst (they do have a razor thin margin of error) and the O’s MIGHT have a chance at 4th place.
Not to pile on here but it seems Telo is right. Is there an imaginable scenario in which the O’s do not finish in last place the next 3-4 years? Even if ALL their current talent develops to full potential, is that good enough for a playoff spot? I can’t see it. The Rays and Jays have more premium talent and have better current teams. The Sox and Yanks can spend their way out of pretty much any problem. As 3-4 years is probably all the time you are getting as a GM if you keep racking up last place finishes, it seems like a hopeless proposition.
Sure there is an imaginable scenario but sure the odds are pretty low. I think everyone can admit that, O’s fan or not. However, a decade is the term Telo used and as Chris in Hawaii pointed out A LOT can change in 10 years. TB and Tor were not very highly regarded ten years ago but now they are. Go back in time before Friedman or AA and you could make these arguments about these teams as well.
There is an imaginable scenario – divisional realignment. Then they can finish in 2nd or 3rd last place.
“Shortstop Manny Machado receives the bulk of the attention, but the shelves are otherwise bare.”
Dylan Bundy. And I don’t care if he hasn’t thrown a professional pitch yet.
As a Jays fan this sounds stupid, but part of me wants to see Baltimore be on par the other 4 AL East teams. I know it’d suck for 3 of the teams come playoff time, but it’d be cool to see a division where every single team is a threat.
Maybe part of my feelings is rooted in the first ever baseball game I saw was BAL @ TOR many, many years back
Re: Baltimore being a good city. I’m sorry, but a city can’t neglect a large portion of it’s population and let huge neighbourhood’s turn into slums and still be regarded as a good city because they have some nice neighbourhood’s. This isn’t the third world.
This article and all these comments beg the question: why the hell were they ranked #15 in the first place.
At least one could see how the Mariners were really coming into their own two years ago, how could anyone think the Orioles were in the median as far as organizational success merely 9 months ago.