Pick Your Pedroia

The Red Sox have played one game this season. Seems like it’s time to check in on Dustin Pedroia. Before you go, assuming the rest of this is going to be stupid, at the very end there is a poll. Internet readers love polls. Please vote in it only after you at least glance over what’s in between. So: Dustin Pedroia has two home runs!

Already, that says something. Pedroia, last year, hit seven home runs. He went deep twice on Monday against the ace to whom the Red Sox have been most frequently linked in trade rumors. Now, Pedroia wasn’t the only Boston player to go deep, so, maybe it was just one of those days. Yet it wasn’t just that Pedroia homered. It was also how Pedroia homered. His homers looked like classic Pedroia homers, and that’s just the thing.

In the top of the first, Pedroia dug in against Cole Hamels, and he covered a fastball over the inner third:

pedroia-hamels-1

The pitch was clocked in the low 90s, and, off the bat, it had the familiar Pedroia trajectory. This also resembles the familiar Pedroia screenshot: little guy, swinging a club, putting literally everything he has into the moment of contact.

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Later, in the fifth, again against Hamels, Pedroia covered a fastball in a little off the plate, and also higher than the one before:

pedroia-hamels-2

Pedroia went up and got it, keeping his hands close in. Ignore the yellow dot in the Amica pitch zone — that’s for the pitch before. This wasn’t even a strike, and Pedroia turned it into four bases.

Two fastballs in the low 90s, both in, both elevated, both hit out. This is a skill we’ve all known Pedroia has possessed, but Pedroia hasn’t been the same guy his whole career. There were very real thumb problems in 2013. There were very real wrist problems in 2014. I’m not telling you anything you didn’t already know — Pedroia played almost two years through pain, and it seems hardly a coincidence his power numbers fell off. And he most certainly became more vulnerable against fastballs inside.

Last year, especially, against fastballs in, Pedroia hit more balls on the ground than ever before. Also, last year, especially, against fastballs in, Pedroia pulled fewer balls in the air than ever before. There are a million ways you can break things down, but maybe it helps to just stay simple.

Pulling from Baseball Savant: here are Dustin Pedroia’s home runs against pitches in or beyond the inner third, clocked at 90+ miles per hour:

  • 2008: 6
  • 2009: 5
  • 2010: 8
  • 2011: 4
  • 2012: 9
  • 2013: 1
  • 2014: 1
  • 2015: 2

Don’t even bother worrying about playing-time differences. The takeaway is immediately obvious. On Opening Day, Dustin Pedroia hit two inside fastballs for home runs. That equaled his total from the previous two seasons combined. What that doesn’t necessarily mean is that Pedroia is back to being a moderately-powerful dynamo. What that most definitely is, though, is encouraging, interesting, eyebrow-raising. And this is exactly what Pedroia has been talking about for months.

From the aftermath of the opening game:

“Sometimes you get hurt and try to find a way to play through it,” said Pedroia, “but sometimes you get healthy, too. That’s the way I look at it. I grinded a lot last year and last couple of years. I’m back to being who I am.”

From the middle of winter:

“The ball’s going to go farther,” Pedroia said. “The balls are going 400 feet now (in batting practice). And then, when you add 5 mph (against pitchers), I’m not a chemist or anything, it’s probably going to go 500.”

Pedroia’s been fixed, allegedly, and he’s said it’s night and day. He’s never been anything but extremely confident in himself, and while, overall, you could say that about Pedroia through probably his whole adult life, he’s been open about his belief he’ll hit for power again. He doesn’t think he’s going to match last year’s .098 ISO. Now, here’s something I find interesting: Pedroia was saying these things all offseason. We offer ZiPS, Steamer, and Fan projections.

The Fan projections, usually, end up high, by a matter of percentage points. Fans tend to be optimistic across the board, and while maybe it isn’t actually because of optimism, that’s how things come off. Here are 2015 Pedroia home-run projections:

  • ZiPS: 10 dingers
  • Steamer: 10
  • Fan: 10

Meanwhile, let’s take a look at projected ISO, which you know as SLG – BA:

  • ZiPS: .114 ISO
  • Steamer: .123
  • Fan: .121

The Fan projections have Pedroia pegged for 10 dingers and a .121 ISO. The depth-chart projections, which blend ZiPS and Steamer, have Pedroia pegged for 10 dingers and a .118 ISO. Here’s a very obvious opportunity to be optimistic, and the fans weren’t buying it. They weren’t biting on successful corrective surgery. The fans figure Pedroia will have 2013-level power, but not the power from before, where Pedroia strung together seasons with an ISO around .160 or higher.

The track record:

  • 2008: .167 ISO
  • 2009: .152
  • 2010: .205
  • 2011: .167
  • 2012: .160
  • 2013: .114
  • 2014: .098

What this might be is very admirable restraint. Pedroia, after all, is a middle infielder in his early 30s, and in his most recent seasons, he hasn’t been powerful. He certainly doesn’t have the classically powerful build, and he’s always talked a big game so it wasn’t a shock to see him doing it again. Plus, even a healthy Pedroia might be only a temporarily healthy Pedroia. Injuries happen, and he could be sapped once more. Telling the future is hard. There are so many things.

But maybe fans just wanted some evidence. Maybe they were waiting to see Pedroia look like himself before they’d be willing to believe it. The Fan projections take place before the regular season. Mostly, I think, before spring training. Pedroia has done something now. In a real game, against a good pitcher, twice. Makes me wonder.

What do you think now? That’s all I wonder. How much, if at all, has Dustin Pedroia changed your mind? Because Dustin Pedroia definitely hasn’t changed his own mind.





Jeff made Lookout Landing a thing, but he does not still write there about the Mariners. He does write here, sometimes about the Mariners, but usually not.

52 Comments
Oldest
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Only Glove, No Love
11 years ago

Ha! Does anyone else get their back hip as far forward as that little SOB? So great.

stuck in a slump
11 years ago

Is he further off the plate in the second image, or did he step back to get inside that pitch?

wildcard09
11 years ago

I think it’s just a combination of 2 different camera angles, and that he’s more into his rotation in the 2nd image.

jocephus
11 years ago

where’s the over 9000 option?

TB
11 years ago
Reply to  jocephus

Pedroia is on pace to hit 324 HRs this season. Personally, I don’t think he’ll make it.

Larry Bernandez
11 years ago
Reply to  TB

I agree with you TB; I’m thinking 316 is more realistic.

Phillies113
11 years ago
Reply to  TB

There’s still a chance. They have two more games in Philly, plus the Phillies are going to Boston to play three in September. So it’s within reach.

Yirmiyahu
11 years ago
Reply to  jocephus

To be serious: we can’t put any stock in Pedroia’s comments about his health and expected 2015 performance. Pedroia (usually hilariously) is always ridiculously cocky and predicts himself to have the best season ever. I’m sure you can find similar quotes from him about a resurgence during previous offseasons.

To not be serious: the “I’m not a chemist” quote is hilarious. In fact, “The Chemist” should probably be his new nickname.

Sean C
11 years ago
Reply to  Yirmiyahu

I was pushing for this on twitter on Monday!

wildcard09
11 years ago
Reply to  Yirmiyahu

Idk though, Laser Show is still a personal favorite of mine.

murph3699
11 years ago
Reply to  wildcard09

“Ask [expletive] Jeff Francis who I am.”

one of my all time faves

Jonathan
11 years ago

Insert customary whining about too much Red Sox coverage here.

K
11 years ago
Reply to  Jonathan

Well, three articles in one morning is plenty of fuel for those types.

Personally I think it’s hilarious.

Jonathan
11 years ago
Reply to  K

I’d love to see FG post an article that amounts to:

“Hanley Ramirez Comes Home”

With just a gif of his grand slam and a “Deal With It” gif. No text in the article at all.

Costanza
11 years ago
Reply to  Jonathan

Insert pre-emptive whining about customary whining…

T
11 years ago

” I’m not a chemist or anything”

I chuckled. And having watched Chase Utley be layed low by injuries I hope the health and performance are back for Pedroia. Depressing to see good players as a shell of what they should be.

someone
11 years ago

Does anyone else find it annoying that the poll results are in order of greatest vote percentage and not in the original order? Is there some way to fix that?

For polls like this, I’d rather see the distribution, not just the mode. In this case it’s not too exciting; it’s fairly normal with bumps at .200+ and below .100, indicating large tails.

Now, if there were were no natural ordering to the responses (for example,which player do you think will win MVP?), then ordering by vote count is fine, and probably preferred.

Trainman1986Member since 2026
11 years ago

As an AL only league owner with Pedroia at a nice price tag, I hope he returns to 2012 ISO levels. I would do cartwheels at that. But realistically, I think he is a .130-.140 ISO guy. He is only 31 years old, it’s not like he’s 36-37 years old. I think a modest bounce back for Pedroia at the end of the day. Anything over that is gravy for me.

Plus as a Mets fan, nothing like seeing Hamels get roughed up by the Sox.

jacaissie
11 years ago
Reply to  Trainman1986

I wrote a guest article that should be popping up in Community soon, about how you should update your Pedroia beliefs based on just one game. If you thought it was 50-50 that he would return to 2012 form, you should think it’s about 80-20 now.

Costanza
11 years ago
Reply to  jacaissie

This sounds like a very interesting article, would love to see it soon.

Can’t wait to find out how 1 game should affect my projection of a player!

Jason BMember since 2017
11 years ago
Reply to  jacaissie

As a serious article, or a tongue-in-cheek one? I know which I think it should be, but I’m worried it’s the other one…

jacaissie
11 years ago
Reply to  Jason B

Oh, it’s serious. There are some controversial assumptions made but the whole point is that while one game is certainly not definitive, it also tells us a surprising amount, and should not be ignored.

Jonathan
11 years ago

I put less importance on his two home runs on opening day and much more importance on it being his first opening day since 2012 where he didn’t pull a boneheaded headfirst slide and injure himself.

I call that a win.

Los Campesinos
11 years ago

Like many, I love Fangraphs. But can we ease up on the glut of BoSox analysis? There are at least three or four other teams out there, last I checked.

Sandy Kazmir
11 years ago
Reply to  Los Campesinos

#bestteam gets the most coverage. They might not lose a game this year. That would be very historic, I believe.

K
11 years ago
Reply to  Sandy Kazmir

As if you’re known for your objectivity, Sandy. Aren’t you about due to “quit fangraphs forever” again?

Isn’t it interesting that the most vocal homers are the ones always accusing others of bias?

Projection ain’t just a statistical forecast.

vivalajeter
11 years ago
Reply to  Sandy Kazmir

Actually the best team already lost a game this year. To the Mets, no less.

wildcard09
11 years ago
Reply to  Los Campesinos

Well to be fair, this is basically just a follow-up post on one that Jeff did during the offseason about Pedroia. And 2 of their other recent articles were about a contract extension they just agreed to with Porcello.

nerf
11 years ago
Reply to  Los Campesinos

There have been 2 games (for some teams) in the 2015 season, and the Red Sox spent a lot of money and moved a lot of parts to go worst-to-first-to-worst-to-first. I think that bears interest.

I’m sure everybody at Fangraphs is gonna find plenty to write about over the course of the next 160-odd games.

Damaso
11 years ago
Reply to  Los Campesinos

so we should expect follow up posts from Jeff every time pedroia hits a hr? and the sox will bear more interest than other teams because unlike all the other teams trying to win, they happened to finish in last place last year?

grant
11 years ago
Reply to  Los Campesinos

I generally don’t sympathize with the “favoring one team over another stuff”, but in looking at the side bar listing most recent articles I count 7 that focus on a particular major league player (as opposed to chats, draft stuff, etc.). 4/7 are Red Sox related, all for different players (Pedroia, Betts, Hanley-Xander, and Porcello). That is a tad disproportionate.

nerf
11 years ago
Reply to  Jeff Sullivan

Anybody else want to set up FangraphsGraphs? Statistical analysis of Fangraphs content?

THERE’S A MARKET!

KDL
11 years ago
Reply to  Jeff Sullivan

I would love to have that data compiled, frankly.
Total stories about teams.
Stories this season.
Stories this month.
Then whenever one of these whiny, biased fans whines we can just send them the link and let them look at how full of shit they are.

K
11 years ago
Reply to  grant

This is only noteworthy if the expectation was that they would or should be evenly distributed in the first place. That isn’t a reasonable expectation.

holymoly
11 years ago
Reply to  K

it should be if they want to maintain objectivity.

there is a reason why we would take any red sox analysis from the boston globe, nesn, or espn boston with plenty of salt.

Jonathan
11 years ago
Reply to  K

That’s a logical fallacy if ever there was one. A sudden glut of articles pertaining to one team doesn’t dismiss objectivity. This is people painting false narratives and projecting their own biases.

K
11 years ago
Reply to  K

it should be if they want to maintain objectivity.

What does that have to do with objectivity, exactly?

Sandy Kazmir
11 years ago

Thanks for taking the time to put that little yellow line in. Does wonders for showing where the ball is crossing the plate. At least on one axis.

ReuschelCakes
11 years ago
Reply to  Sandy Kazmir

Thanks for the unhelpful, peanut gallery comment demonstrating your knowledge of 3 dimensions.

That Guy
11 years ago
Reply to  ReuschelCakes

lol, WUT.

George
11 years ago

Pedroia is a .150+ ISO hitter when he is healthy, and he showed that the other day. The problem is he hasn’t been able to stay healthy, and it doesn’t help that he seems to throw his body around constantly. So he may look good now, but when he dives into first base in 2 weeks and injures his thumb, his power numbers will take a dive again. I don’t doubt his skill, only his ability to get 600 healthy PA in a season.

holymoly
11 years ago

i remember quite a bit of talk about this after pedroia hit a HR in his first spring AB.

that was also his last spring HR.

mettle
11 years ago

Chemistry!

BarnabasMember since 2016
11 years ago

Anybody else really wish the post-vote graph would have the options in order of ISO, not in order of votes? That way we could see the bell curve easier and see how its skewed, etc.

nevin brown
11 years ago

It is possible that Pedroia is selling out for more pull power. I would not be surprised if his K% went into the 15% range in an effort to coax more power out of his swing. His age and injury history does not point to someone who will recapture their peak performance levels.

nerf
11 years ago
Reply to  nevin brown

How do his age and injury history not point to someone who will recapture their peak performance levels?

ReuschelCakes
11 years ago

Haven’t we determined that the most probable projections after hot & cold starts (i.e., the remainder of the season after a player starts hot or cold) is the original projection?

While some of us can certainly harbor hot sports opinions about Pedroia’s power, our projections should remain unchanged on a forward look. In that regard, it is annoying to see a statistically-minded community now projecting a +30-40bps increase in ISO from prior projections….

vivalajeter
11 years ago
Reply to  ReuschelCakes

I disagree to some extent. On the whole, you may be right. But some of the projections have higher error bars than others, especially when an injury is factored in.

Matt Harvey’s projection, for example, doesn’t take into account that his velocity and command were tremendous throughout the entire spring. He walked one batter all spring, but his projection would be the same even if he walked a dozen batters. If I’m projecting his season, I’m taking the (way) over on his pre-season projection.

And as this article discussed, there was health-related talk about why Pedroia might exceed his projection this year. Opening Day showed that there might be some legit reasons to believe that the talk wasn’t just fluff. I can see why you someone would adjust their projection.

I wouldn’t change my projection for a random player based on him going 0-4, or 3-4 with one HR. But I’m open to changing my projections if they show that they’ve recovered from health issues.

nerf
11 years ago
Reply to  vivalajeter

Right, this is a really good point. We also have to account for the fact that the projection systems aren’t simply picking the most likely landing spot for a set of probabilities. They’re offering a sort of median of the range, and the ranges can differ wildly.

This is why projection systems always put win totals for every team bunched much closer together than they eventually end up being. And if a projection system doesn’t account for a gaping whole (say, a starting shortstop), and there’s chatter a front office will go out and get Troy Tulowitzki to shore up that hole, it’s fair to take the over on that team.

So Pedroia’s 2 homers are sort of like knowing that the Rockies covet a certain set of prospects that a borderline-playoff team possesses while sporting a massive hole at shortstop. Of course, the trade could not take place (the thumb could get re-injured), but it’s fair to take the over. Because just going by projections doesn’t get any team over 95 wins, or any hitter over 35 home runs, or any of the other fun stuff we look for in baseball.

ReuschelCakes
11 years ago
Reply to  vivalajeter

the point isn’t that he COULD be much better from here, it is that he is MOST LIKELY to be exactly what the projections thought hims to be. i.e., there is an equal chance that he is better (what you both are asserting) than he is worse…

again, this is all FROM TODAY – meaning that his 2 HRs have already added 3 XB / 600 PAs = 0.005 to his projected ISO.

vivalajeter
11 years ago
Reply to  ReuschelCakes

My point is that the projections for a player are not necessarily the most likely event that will happen, with an equal chance that a player is better or worse. The reason is that there are things that the projections simply don’t know. In Harvey’s case, the projection factors in that he’s having a normal recovery from TJ surgery. They don’t know that, by all accounts, his command and velocity have been much better than a normal TJ recovery. That pushes the needle north, and makes the projections light. He’s most likely going to be better than the projections.

In Pedroia’s case, do the projections know that injuries are to blame for his recent power outage? If so, are they expecting a full recovery health-wise, or continued problems? If Pedroia is fully healthy like he said in the winter, and like he displayed a few days ago, then he’s mot likely going to be better than the projections.