The Freddie Freeman Deal as a Market Correction

Even a couple of days after the news broke about the Braves locking up Freddie Freeman to a $135 million contract, there remains a lot of residual skepticism about this price for a non-star player who was still three years from free agency. Yesterday I compared the deal to similar contracts signed by Ryan Braun and Elvis Andrus, but Freeman doesn’t have Ryan Braun’s track record and Andrus was a year ahead of him in service time, so both comparisons required a little imagination. The reality is that we haven’t seen a contract like this for a player like Freeman before. The guys who have landed $100+ million extensions while still early in their careers have almost exclusively been superstars (Braun, Troy Tulowitzki, and Buster Posey), and Freeman is not at that level. This is the first nine figure commitment we’ve seen to a player this far from free agency who isn’t already one of the true elite players in the sport.

The size of the Freeman commitment stands out because, over the last four or five years, we’ve seen a rash of young player contract extensions that have generally been for far less than what the Braves just gave their first baseman; in most cases, the total guarantees were half as large as what Freeman just got from Atlanta. It’s easy to react negatively to 8/$135M for Freeman when you see contracts like 7/$80M for Carlos Gonzalez, 6/$66M for Nick Markakis, 6/$51M for Andrew McCutchen, Justin Upton, and Jay Bruce, and a bunch of contracts hanging in the 5/30M range for good young pitchers like Madison Bumgarner, Chris Sale, Jon Lester, Derek Holland. These prices are what we’re used to seeing in terms of long term deals for good young players with potential but also real risk. Freeman’s deal blew all those contracts out of the water, even though as a player at this point in his career, he’s pretty similar to many of them.

So that leaves us with two options. Either the Braves massively overpaid Freeman — a pretty popular sentiment, it appears — or that players and agents have concluded that the previously agreed to price levels were simply too team friendly. I’m going with the latter.

Just from the brief list above, look at the success rates teams have had on the contracts I already mentioned. The Gonzalez and McCutchen contracts are two of the very best in baseball, from a team’s savings perspective, while Bruce and Upton are underpaid even while they haven’t made the same big leap forward that was projected earlier in their careers. The only bust of the bunch is Markakis, and to be honest, he probably would have ended up making a similar amount over the last five years had he not signed that early career extension. That deal hasn’t worked out for the Orioles as a bargain, but it probably didn’t cost them more than $10 million more than going year to year would have.

But that’s just a few handpicked deals, and it’s easy to make any argument look good by just cherry picking data points in your favor. So, let’s look at every 4+ year contact extension signed between 2009 and 2013 that gave up control of at least one free agent season. According to MLBTradeRumors Extension Tracker, there were 47 such deals signed between the end of the 2008 season and the end of the 2013 season.

Here’s the full list, sorted by total money guaranteed to the player.

Date Player Team Pos Yrs Amt Opt Ser Years til FA FA Years Sold
3/29/13 Buster Posey SFO C 8 159.0 1 2.16 4 5
4/21/11 Ryan Braun MIL LF 5 105.0 1 3.15 5 5
1/10/11 Carlos Gonzalez COL LF / CF / RF 7 80.0   2.06 4 3
1/21/09 Nick Markakis BAL RF 6 66.0 1 3.00 3 4
8/18/12 Starlin Castro CHC SS 7 60.0 1 2.13 4 4
3/4/12 Andrew McCutchen PIT CF 6 51.5 1 2.12 4 3
3/3/10 Justin Upton ARZ RF 6 51.3   2.06 4 2
12/9/10 Jay Bruce CIN RF 6 51.0 1 2.13 4 3
4/20/09 Ryan Zimmerman WAS 3B 5 45.0   3.05 3 2
1/15/12 Gio Gonzalez WAS SP 5 42.0 2 2.16 4 3
5/13/13 Anthony Rizzo CHC 1B 7 41.0 2 1.04 5 4
12/3/08 Dustin Pedroia BOS 2B 6 40.5 1 2.04 4 3
4/16/12 Madison Bumgarner SFO SP 5 35.0 2 1.13 5 2
3/7/13 Chris Sale CWS SP 5 32.5 2 2.06 4 3
1/31/11 Alexei Ramirez CWS SS 4 32.5 1 3.00 3 2
3/29/13 Paul Goldschmidt ARZ 1B 5 32.0 1 1.06 5 1
3/8/13 Allen Craig STL 1B / LF / RF 5 31.0 1 2.08 4 2
4/11/11 Trevor Cahill OAK SP 5 30.5 2 2.01 4 3
8/14/10 Ricky Romero TOR SP 5 30.1 1 1.13 5 1
4/8/10 Yovani Gallardo MIL SP 5 30.1 1 2.11 4 2
1/22/11 Billy Butler KAN 1B 4 30.0 1 3.10 3 2
3/15/09 Jon Lester BOS SP 5 30.0 1 2.08 4 2
2/14/09 Ervin Santana LAA SP 4 30.0 1 3.10 3 2
4/10/11 Clay Buchholz BOS SP 4 29.9 2 2.07 4 2
3/20/12 Derek Holland TEX SP 5 28.5 2 2.12 4 3
7/13/11 Jaime Garcia STL SP 4 27.5 2 2.15 4 2
1/20/11 Johnny Cueto CIN SP 4 27.0 1 3.00 3 2
4/4/12 Jonathon Niese NYM SP 5 25.5 2 2.11 4 3
3/3/12 Cameron Maybin SDG CF 5 25.0 1 2.07 4 2
4/10/12 Carlos Santana CLE C 5 21.0 1 1.12 5 1
1/8/10 Franklin Gutierrez SEA CF 4 20.5 1 3.08 3 2
4/22/10 Ben Zobrist TAM 2B / RF 4 18.0 2 2.15 4 2
4/3/10 Adam Lind TOR LF / DH 4 18.0 3 2.09 4 3
3/13/10 Denard Span MIN LF / CF / RF 5 16.5 1 1.11 5 1
7/23/10 Kurt Suzuki OAK C 4 16.3 1 3.05 3 2
3/22/09 Gavin Floyd CWS SP 4 15.5 1 2.05 4 1
3/7/09 Scott Baker MIN SP 4 15.3 1 2.13 4 1
8/19/11 Jose Tabata PIT LF 6 15.0 3 1.09 5 4
12/9/11 Matt Moore TAM SP 5 14.0 3 0.02 6 2
3/7/10 Nick Blackburn MIN SP 4 14.0 1 2.03 4 1
3/31/11 Wade Davis TAM SP 4 12.6 3 1.03 5 2
7/13/13 Jose Altuve HOU 2B 4 12.5 2 1.07 5 1
4/16/10 Brett Anderson OAK SP 4 12.5 2 1.01 5 1
3/30/12 Cory Luebke SDG SP 4 12.0 2 1.03 5 1
3/15/12 Alcides Escobar KAN SS 4 10.5 2 2.08 4 2
1/27/09 Ubaldo Jimenez COL SP 4 10.0 2 1.09 5 1
2/27/12 Salvador Perez KAN C 5 7.0 3 0.05 6 2
  Median     5 30 1 2 4 2
  Average     5 33 1 2 4 2

As you can see, the average contract extension for players in this range was something along the lines of 5/30 to 5/35 with a team option for a sixth year, so the norm was to sell the rights to two free agent years in order to get your arbitration paychecks guaranteed ahead of time. Obviously, better players and players closer to arbitration got more, but the format was pretty standard; any solid player who would fork over a couple of years of free agent rights in exchange for an early career guarantee could get a nice contract. Players got security, and teams were able to keep their home grown stars through their prime years. Win-win, right?

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Well, not really. Not if the players and agents are interested in actually coming close to a mutually beneficial midpoint between risk and reward for both sides. Because these deals have ended up favoring the teams over the players to a staggering degree. Of those 47 deals, we can count on one of Antonio Alfonseca’s hands the contracts where the player likely came out ahead by hedging against injuries or performance risks.

Cory Luebke got $12 million guaranteed from the Padres, only now he’s going to need Tommy John Surgery again, and he’s out for all of 2014 after spending most of 2013 on the shelf too.

Brett Anderson got $12.5 million guaranteed from the A’s shortly after the 2010 season started, and has thrown a little under 300 innings in the four years since signing the contract. Of course, even with those injuries, the A’s still exercised his $8 million option for 2014 and were able to find a trade market for him, so it’s not like Anderson is stealing money that no one would give him otherwise.

Nick Blackburn got $14 million from the Twins before the 2010 season began. He proceeded to implode and pitch his way out of baseball.

Franklin Gutierrez got $21 million from the Mariners after his breakout 2009 season, then proceed to break every part of his body over the next four years.

Ricky Romero got $30 million from the Blue Jays in the middle of the 2010 season, and has turned into an albatross after forgetting how to throw strikes, but he gave the Blue Jays an excellent season in 2011, and would have certainly cost more to extend him if they had waited an extra year.

Nick Markakis got $66 million from the Orioles after his monster 2008 season, then lost his power and hasn’t been the same since.

You could make an argument for Cameron Maybin belonging on the list, but he didn’t go bust right after signing the contract, giving the Padres another decent year in 2012, and it’s not obvious to me that he would have been any cheaper to sign had San Diego waited another year to lock him up. Wade Davis didn’t exactly turn into what the Rays thought he would either, but he still had enough value to be seen as a quality trade chip. Jaime Garcia got hurt again, but pitched well enough when healthy that he probably didn’t leave much money on the table, especially if he pitches well again this year.

If you stretch to include the borderline cases, you can maybe come up with 10 cases where the player probably came out ahead by signing, and in most of the cases, they ended up pocketing an extra $5 to $10 million that they wouldn’t have otherwise made. But these extensions have had something like a 75% success rate for the teams signing them, and when they’ve worked, they’ve saved far more money for the signing team than they’ve cost when they haven’t.

Take the Andrew McCutchen deal, for instance. With four years to go before free agency, coming off a +5.4 WAR season at age-24, McCutchen sold his four remaining years of team control for a total of $24 million, then gave the Pirates three free agent years for a total of $41 million. Had McCutchen simply waited one more season, and was able to negotiate off his 2012 breakout, he probably would have been able to sell his free agent years for twice what he actually got.

By taking that deal in 2012 instead of waiting one more year, McCutchen probably left $30 or $40 million on the table, and that’s not even factoring in the additional guaranteed years he could have gotten by getting closer to free agency. If he had waited until after the 2013 season to sign, when he had an MVP in his bag, he’d probably have been able to command a $200 million extension, maybe more. The Pirates probably saved more money with the McCutchen contract alone than every other team wasted on failed extensions signed over the last five years.

There’s a reason Scott Boras has been advising his players to not sign these early career extensions. These deals have overwhelmingly favored the teams, and the prices that some of the best young players in the game have been accepting for their best years simply gave up too much of their earnings potential for the amount of risk they were selling. These deals simply were lopsided, and there are dozens of great players currently making a fraction of their open market value because of these early career extensions that have taken hold.

We haven’t even talked about Paul Goldschmidt, who might have been in line for a Posey-type deal this winter had he not signed for $30 million last winter. One of the main reasons teams have been able to inflate free agent pricing so quickly the last few years is that they are using money that would have otherwise gone to a lot of the young stars as they got closer to free agency; by locking in their prices early, the teams have kept the prices for these players down to such a degree that they’ve got enough left to throw around for the mediocre players who are reaching free agency.

Freeman’s $135 million contract, as a non-superstar still three years away from free agency, should serve as a pretty significant deterrent to team’s ability to sign these same types of early career, small guaranteed contracts that were so prevalent for the last five years. The argument in favor of those contracts was always that a lot could happen in six years, but Freeman’s deal shows that even waiting just an additional year or two will lead to significantly higher payouts, and the risk of injury or performance decline for many of these players over 12-24 months is just not that high.

The Freeman deal might look like the outlier right now, but I think it is more of a market correction that is going to become more common. Good young players are worth far more than they’ve been settling for over the last few years. The extension prices of the past few years were simply too slanted in favor of the teams, making a fair deal like the Freeman one seem like an overpay in comparison. Given how much money MLB teams have now, though, I don’t think they’re going to be able to force the genie back into the bottle; the Freeman deal is probably more of a trend than an outlier.





Dave is the Managing Editor of FanGraphs.

144 Comments
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rotorankers.tumblr.com
12 years ago

Poor Paul Goldschmidt…

BipMember since 2016
12 years ago

Poor Ben Zobrist!

Ducky
12 years ago
Reply to  Bip

I never understood Zobrist in 2008. His job had been taken by Jason Bartlett who came over from the Twins with Garza for Delmon Young (LOL). As a Red Sox Fan I watched him from afar and he hit ten dingers in a couple hundred plate appearances in 2008. I had no idea of his vast array of skills as he was 27 at the time. When you add up OBP, defensive value, defensive versatility, smart base running and surprising power you have one of the best players in baseball for the five year period covering 2009-2013.

Yan Fucking Gomes
12 years ago
Reply to  Bip

POOR MULTI-MILLIONAIRES!

melotticus
12 years ago

Poor Braves. They finally get in on the extension trend and they’re too late to the party.

Jason B
12 years ago
Reply to  melotticus

Or, perhaps more aptly, starting a new trend! (Albeit a more expensive one, from the team’s perspective)

nik
12 years ago

too much, too early.

Cardo
12 years ago

Excellent artice.

Phantom Stranger
12 years ago

Freeman had a superstar season in 2013. No, he doesn’t have the long established history of superstar seasons that others had when they signed their long deals. But there is a belief by many that the defensive metrics are underrating him due to his incredible hands at first (he does have the range of a statue, but no one pays for that anyway from a 1B).

Given the Braves’ budget constraints, they have to gamble a little on their best players’ contracts or lose them to free agency. Craig Kimbrel better start packing his bags, he almost certainly won’t get a long-term deal from the Braves.

Anon21Member since 2018
12 years ago

2013 was not a “superstar” year from him. He had a great year, but nobody was confusing him with a serious MVP candidate.

BipMember since 2016
12 years ago
Reply to  Anon21

That’s not true, plenty of people were making serious MVP arguments. Nobody from the analytic community agreed, because the arguments all hinged on his BA w/RISP, RBI, and the fact he was on a playoff team, but they were there.

Anon21Member since 2018
12 years ago
Reply to  Bip

Okay, fine. “Nobody who knew what they were talking about” was confusing him with a serious MVP candidate. Great year, but not superstar-caliber.

larry
12 years ago
Reply to  Bip

so just all of the BBWA, ya know, the people that vote for the MVP

dovif
12 years ago
Reply to  Bip

bad defense high BABIP and 23 HR, the requirement of Superstars have dropped a lot these days

He is a above average 1B is about it

Anon21Member since 2018
12 years ago
Reply to  Bip

dovif, when you look at his player page and see “bad defense,” all you’re seeing is the positional adjustment. UZR and DRS both thought he was a modestly above-average defender for his position last year. Of course positional adjustment does have to be considered in evaluating whether a player is a superstar, but it’s a bit unfair to tag Freeman with the “bad defense” label.

KCDaveInLA
12 years ago
Reply to  Anon21

Maybe we could say “serious Top 10 in MVP voting” candidate, but not quite “MVP”.

cthabeerman
12 years ago
Reply to  KCDaveInLA

Or top five MVP candidate, since he finished fifth. Small distinction, though…

-C

Peter
12 years ago

I have no proof, but think the behind-the-scene issue here is that the Braves are offering, but Kimbrel is rejecting, wanting bigger money than atl is offering

RC
12 years ago
Reply to  Peter

I think the more likely behing-the-scene situation is that the Braves realize that they can only guarantee so much in future payroll, and they have many players who are much more important to the team’s core than a 1-inning relief pitcher (even if he is the best 1-inning relief pitcher in the game). If the Braves sign Kimbrel to a long-term deal before locking up Simmons, Teheran, Minor, Medlen, and/or Heyward, he should be fired.

My personal take is that Simmons, Teheran, and Medlen are most likely be to extended next.

cthabeerman
12 years ago
Reply to  Peter

It’s just the business…the union wouldn’t be happy about the best player in baseball at his position, in both a current and historical sense, just giving up that leverage and accepting a team-friendly contract.

This is going to be a yearly thing through arbitration, and then a blockbuster deal for his position in free agency, unless he’s offered a premium extension. And, really, from the players’ perspective, that’s the way it’s got to be.

There has to be the Ryan Howard type for relievers in arbitration, and Kimbrel’s that guy…it’s probably going to happen again for position players next season when Trout is eligible.

-C

NS
12 years ago

The Markakis comp is pretty scary. Lefty line-drive hitter with a breakout offensive year in his third season at the same age only with better defense higher up the defensive spectrum. 2 WAR or worse every year since then.

NS
12 years ago
Reply to  NS

To clarify, I have no argument that they are any more than superficially similar or that Freeman will go the way Markakis has. But Markakis is a good lesson against the pervasive notion that “he’s 24, therefore he will only get better”.

Catoblepas
12 years ago
Reply to  NS

The takeaway from this article should be “he’s 24, therefore he’s probably not going to get much worse”. Markakis is definitely the outlier when it comes to these extensions, and even when they don’t develop as planned (as he certainly didn’t), the extensions are so cheap it’s often still worth it, or at least not that bad. He’s produced 7.5 WAR over the past 5 years at 11 mil/year, so averaging $/win of about 7.3. Not good, certainly, but when that’s the worst case scenario, the pricing is almost certainly off.

J6takish
12 years ago

Didn’t Evan Longoria sign away all of his arb years for 18 dollars with like 47 club options attached? He got his money eventually but wow

Ducky
12 years ago
Reply to  J6takish

He kinda got his money when you look at Ryan Zimmerman et. al.

Larry
12 years ago

Freeman has a collective WAR of 9.4 over last three years and is trending upward heading into in Prime. Even if he only gets a collective WAR of 25 over next 8 years, the 135M is below market. However if he were to be in the 32 to 38 WAR range this will be a very good deal.

vivalajeter
12 years ago
Reply to  Larry

You have to consider that he was already locked in at sub-market levels through arbitration for the next three years, so the Braves would get that surplus value either way. In evaluating the deal, it depends on how he performs in the 5 free agent seasons that he gave up.

Larry
12 years ago
Reply to  vivalajeter

So say the 3 ARB years that they are now paying 50M(AAV) came in at 25M. That would make the 5 FA years 110M which will be age 27 through 31 seasons. If he goes 20WAR over that time it is 5.5M per W. For 2017 through 2021 that seems like a good deal for the Braves

vivalajeter
12 years ago
Reply to  Larry

Yes, if he’s a 4WAR player (on average) then the Braves have done well, but not a whole lot of first basement average 4WAR/year for 5 years. He’d have to be one of the top 3-5 in the game for that.

Anon21Member since 2018
12 years ago
Reply to  Larry

Not sure I agree with the number you threw out there. Do you have a source for 20 WAR over 5 years making him a top 3-5 player at his position?

Larry
12 years ago
Reply to  Larry

OK lets say he can only live up to his average of the last three years during his prime years which would give him a collective 15 WAR over the 5 FA years. That still is an average of 7.3 Mill per W which in those years will probably be no worse than the average. Hard to see this being a bad deal even if Freeman stays at current production rates. Still has the potential to be a very good deal for Braves. Getting a player locked up in his prime has to have some value. I am certainly not better off paying a 31 year old 8 for 135

batpig
12 years ago
Reply to  Larry

Just doing some rough leaderboard samples here…

For the 5 years 2009-2013, 20 WAR would have been #6; Price Fielder was #5 with 20.7 WAR, then a clear drop-off after him: http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=1b&stats=bat&lg=all&qual=y&type=8&season=2013&month=0&season1=2009&ind=0&team=0&rost=0&age=0&filter=&players=0

For the 5 years 2006-2010, 20 WAR would have been tied for #6 with Adrian Gonzalez; Lance Berkman was #5 with 20.7 WAR: http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=1b&stats=bat&lg=all&qual=y&type=8&season=2010&month=0&season1=2006&ind=0&team=0&rost=0&age=0&filter=&players=0

For the 5 years 2001-2005, 20 WAR would have been #4, just ahead of Jim Thome at 19.9 and well behind Giambi, Helton, Pujols

Just based on those three arbitrary samples, looks like there are only 2-3 guys who beat 25 WAR (the true studs), and then a cluster of guys between 15-25 WAR. So 20 WAR over 5 years would probably put you in the range of #4-#6 best 1B over that span, solidly in the middle of the “second tier”.

Anon21Member since 2018
12 years ago
Reply to  Larry

Although I’ll add, if he does need to be a top 3-5 first baseman to earn his keep (which I’m honestly not sure about, and I think it’s a pretty weird way of measuring how likely the 4 WAR/year outcome is), it doesn’t seem so implausible. Who are the current first basemen who are definitely better than him? Cabrera, Votto, and probably Davis and Goldschmidt. Well, which of them are younger than Freeman? None are. I would not necessarily expect either Votto or Cabrera to be as productive as Freeman in 2018, when they are 34 and he is 28. I don’t see a bunch of young guns poised to overtake him (please, don’t say Anthony Rizzo, who continues to be all promise and mediocre production) although undoubtedly one or more will. So saying that this guy, who was the fourth-most productive first baseman in baseball last year, has to approximately keep that up as he heads into his prime if he wants to earn his contract is not exactly terrifying.

But again, this weird “relative-to-other-first-basemen” method is pretty clearly inferior to just looking at what Freeman’s individual projections suggest. They suggest 4 WAR. This deal is fair.

Snowman
12 years ago
Reply to  Larry

We have the actual yearly salaries now.

In 2014, he’ll get $8 million (counting a signing bonus). That’s $2.25 million more than he could have gotten in arbitration.

In 2015 he’ll get $8.5 million. Let’s say that’s reasonably close to what an arb decision would have been.

And in 2016, what would have been his final year of arb, he’ll get $12 million. Again, let’s just give the benefit of the doubt and call this a break even salary.

The the potential free agent years kick in.
2017: $20.5 million
2018: $21 million
2019: $21 million.
2020: $22 million
2021: $22 million

Simply put, they’ve taken on a huge risk for a guy with average power, no range, and exactly one season with an OPS over .800 and at least 2 fWAR. They paid for a .370 BABIP, on the assumption that it will continue, and they paid for great hands at first base despite the fact that the use of those hands is limited by his awful range. Assumably they were not paying for his speed, since he was the one guy on the team who actually had slower footspeed than the catchers.

Snowman
12 years ago
Reply to  Larry

Oh, and with Liberty’s stewardship, this also guarantees that 2013 will be Craig Kimbrel’s final year as a Brave, and that either 2013 or 2014 will be Heyward’s. This will be damned near a quarter of the team payroll in those last five seasons, barring a surprise sale.

Bronnt
12 years ago
Reply to  Larry

I do not think the issue with Freeman is that he’s a big risk not to approach 20 WAR over the five years that were bought out-he has a good shot at getting to 18ish, and he could still really improve and maybe give the Braves 25 WAR over the period.

The issue for me is that, if you’re going to sign a guy for 8 years, you want a decent discount on his AAV, and I don’t think the Braves got that. They’re potentially going to be paying market value for him, or close to it, during those five seasons despite a willingness to work out a long-term extension with him well in advance of reaching those years. Maybe this was the cost of signing this extension, but if it was, then I don’t see the great rush to get him extended this year.

dovif
12 years ago
Reply to  Larry

I do not see a 25HR hitting bad Defense guy averaging 5WAR a year, he will need to hit .340 every year

Anon21Member since 2018
12 years ago
Reply to  Larry

dovif, how do you account for… I dunno, last year, when he hit nowhere particularly near .340 and had a 5-WAR year? Also, see above regarding “bad defense.” He’s actually a somewhat above-average defender for his position.

Snowman, this is getting tiresome. The salary they’re paying him does not assume that he will average his 2013 WAR over the life of the contract, nor does he need a .371 BABIP to reach the 5-WAR threshold.

Bronnt, I don’t really agree that the Braves did not get a discount on this deal. Below, you’ll see Dave estimates his free-agent price as something like 8/200, assuming he averages about 4 WAR per arbitration year. I might not go that high, but I think it’s hard to see a later extension that pays him like this and doesn’t contain a commitment past his age-31 season.

Snowman
12 years ago
Reply to  Larry

Ignoring all else (we obviously disagree, and any more would be just us repeating ourselves), I’m not at all sure how to take it when a person with whom I’ve never before interacted tells me it is getting tiresome because I expressed an opinion that I have never before expressed here.

That’s just some weird shit.

ReuschelCakes
12 years ago
Reply to  Larry

if you assume that Freeman was a free agent this year, yes…. but he is/was not

Hank G.
12 years ago

If teams start spending more for players’ younger, more productive years, does that mean that the price of older free agents will go down, or will there always be someone willing to overpay for their declining years?

jpg
12 years ago
Reply to  Hank G.

There will always be someone. Cano got a 10 year deal at 31 years old. Carlos Beltran, who has seen his base running and defense deteriorate to replacement level, just got a three year deal. The Phillies signed to a multiyear deal Raul Ibanez after his age 37 season. Bartolo Colon, at 40 and coming off of a PED suspension, got a two year deal from the Mets.

Mr. Jones
12 years ago
Reply to  jpg

Except that “Replacement level defense” and “replacement level base running” are not actual things.

Iron
12 years ago

Maybe I’m just not much of a risk-taker, but if I was a young baseball player offered 5/30 or 5/35, I’d have to think $30M is easily going to set me up for life and if it means I miss the chance to make more vs the risk I get hurt and get nothing, well set for life is set for life.

bookbook
12 years ago
Reply to  Iron

If all your buds are making $100 mill, Pulling down $30, which is only about $18 after taxes is not going to let you keep up.

(In all seriousness, if you know your earning days are likely over in your mid-thirties, you can’t get company health insurance to help cover your nagging sports injuries, and you’ve become accustomed to the fairly modest million-dollar homes in cities like DC and New York and San Francisco… you don’t necessarily feel “set for life” with 18 million dollars. Which is part of why the 1%ers get all grouchy when one points out how good they have it.)

Iron
12 years ago
Reply to  bookbook

$18M, properly invested, yields an annual income of at least $1M-$1.8M at pretty pedestrian rates of return. Health insurance premiums are not really going to be an issue.

larry
12 years ago
Reply to  Iron

except no athlete signs a $30 mil contract (i believe that was the original example) and immmediately invests all of the after tax proceeds.

GlobalAlpha
12 years ago
Reply to  Iron

I wouldn’t call annual income of 10% “pedestrian”. Do you have any idea what interest rate you can get on Treasuries? Below inflation. Dividend yields on stocks are also at all-time lows, at least there is some expectation that they will rise with inflation. Who are you, Bernie Madoff?

Mike
12 years ago
Reply to  Iron

Please direct me to these mythical investments that yield at least 10% annually. Seriously. I’m over the moon when I can get over 5% annually on most of my investments.

werthless
12 years ago
Reply to  Iron

A diversified equity portfolio has historically earned dividend-adjusted gains of between 8 and 12%.

Eric R
12 years ago
Reply to  Iron

“Health insurance premiums are not really going to be an issue.”

Especially since I believe 40 days on an MLB roster gets you health coverage for life!

Giants4eva
12 years ago
Reply to  Iron

A diversified equity portfolio has not generated 8-12% income, that would be the yield, not the total return. And that historical total return figure incorporates a tripling of valuation ratios. To keep up that rate of return would require P/E on the market to go from 25 to 75. Higher than the tech bubble. Ain’t gonna happen.

Ed
12 years ago
Reply to  Iron

You absolutely do not get health insurance for life. Here’s a story about Sal Fasano trying to make the majors for one more season just to get the health insurance.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/writers/jeff_pearlman/09/25/fasano/

John C
12 years ago
Reply to  Iron

Mr. Madoff, I am surprised that they allow you to access the Internet from prison.

dl80
12 years ago
Reply to  Iron

Ed,
The story about Fasano was interesting and pretty sad. However, he should be much better off now that the ACA is in place. Cheaper (not cheap, maybe, but cheaper than COBRA) private exchange premiums, and with no more pre-existing conditions or lifetime caps, his son should be able to get health insurance for the rest of his life.

byronMember since 2016
12 years ago
Reply to  bookbook

I think most athletes are underpaid for all the revenue they generate. That said, I think I just read that if you’re on a major-league roster for one day ever you get health coverage for the rest of your life, so that specific element doesn’t apply. But if you’re generating $400 million in marginal revenue and being paid $30 million for it, yeah, you deserve more.

nobleisthynameMember since 2019
12 years ago
Reply to  byron

Even if you only invest half of the $18MM and the investments are yielding only 1% that’s still means you’re set for life without ever having to work again.

This is why the 99%ers get grouchy when the 1% gets grouchy over “only” having $18MM.

nobleisthynameMember since 2019
12 years ago
Reply to  byron

Whoops, that was meant as a reply to Mike.

KCDaveInLA
12 years ago

Proof that not everything Dayton Moore does is horrible: look at that Sal Perez contract, keeping in mind that he might be the AL’s best catcher (now that Joe Mauer has moved to 1b). Five times that amount would still be a bargain.

Dave, what kind of ripple effect do you see in comparable players? (Thinking of Eric Hosmer on this one).

tz
12 years ago
Reply to  KCDaveInLA

Maybe not comparable to the extensions in this article, but more like what the TB front office did with Longoria super-early in his career.

So maybe the Perez deals shows that Dayton DID get something good from Tampa Bay after all.

TK
12 years ago

With caps on international signing and draft signing bonuses, if Freeman is a harbinger then how are small market teams going to compete? What will becomes the new market inefficiency to exploit? Cuban players?

Hank G.
12 years ago
Reply to  TK

Teams will still have control of their home-grown talent, although the arbitration years are going to get more expensive.

I want to see small market teams be able to compete, but I don’t see why it should be on the back of the players.

Mike
12 years ago

Wow, it’s been a while since I’ve thought about Antonio Alfonseca.

David
12 years ago
Reply to  Mike

I dont mean to pry, but you don’t by any chance happen to have six fingers on your right hand?

Do you always begin conversations this way?

alan h
12 years ago

I don’t think players are motivated to sign these contracts by performance risk anywhere near as much as by the risk of catastrophic injury. These are elite athletes in their early 20s with success at the highest level of competition – they are probably not wondering if they will still be good enough when they are 27.

Their team is most likely the only insurer available, and as a monopolist has considerable power over an individual (with very nonlinear benefit from wealth). Making half of what one would otherwise make for 5 years seems like a small price to pay for a guaranteed mid-8 figure payday. Once a person has earned such an amount, risk aversion likely diminishes greatly and they can more reasonably take the stance of (approximately) maximizing expected career earnings.

If agents offered players a 7-figure salary floor or a very large pension, a team’s power would be greatly diminished. Freeman’s contract may be as large as it is due to an expected future increase in MLB salaries overall and/or a new premium placed on offense that may be especially acute for the Braves.

Angelsjunky
12 years ago

I think you’re missing something here, Dave, or perhaps partially blinded by having too much knowledge. While I agree that there’s some degree of market correction going on, your assertion that Freeman “is not a superstar” is a bit overstated in that it relies primarily on advanced metrics, namely WAR. Now you and I and everyone reading this knows that Freeman is not (yet) a superstar because he’s had only one star-caliber season, 2013’s 4.8 WAR. Even if he stays within the 4-6 range, he’s more of an all-star than a superstar.

But this seems to assume that WAR is the go-to stat for such contract negotiations and defines superstar status in the eyes of baseball executives. While smart teams like the Braves certainly look at advanced metrics, I’m fairly certain that when talk of extending Freeman came up, the first question asked was not “What’s his WAR?”

The baseball world has just barely gotten used to OPS. When you look at Freeman outside of sabermetrics, you see a 24-year old who just hit .319/.396/.501 with 23 HR and 109 RBI, and is slowly but surely getting better defensively (OK, I cheated and looked at Def – but I’m assuming that those who watch the Braves can see his improvement). You don’t think, “that .371 BABIP is unsustainable” or “his Def was -8.7.” What you do think is “This is a young star just coming into his prime who could get even better, and is part of a core nucleus of homegrown players that could be Braves for the next 5-10 years.

So while I think you’re half correct that his contract was a market correction, the other half is that he actually DOES, or at least CAN if you squint slightly, look like a budding superstar from a non-WAR perspective.

Anon21Member since 2018
12 years ago
Reply to  Angelsjunky

I guess that’s possibly what’s going on here, but honestly, I think every front office knows more about accurate player valuation than Dave. That’s no knock on Dave, it’s just that baseball executives have access to analytical resources and most importantly, data sources that aren’t available to outside analysts. My prior is generally that teams are pretty great at evaluating and accurately valuing their own players, and the Braves have given no reason to doubt their competence.

emac2
12 years ago
Reply to  Anon21

People hired by clubS are usually less skilled than a large number of fans and media. Teams don’t do exhaustive searches for the best people. They recycle and add friends and family.

Pumpsie Green
12 years ago
Reply to  Angelsjunky

Are you saying the Braves measured not baseball ability but rather how the clean-cut (white) kid would sell when they moved out to the suburbs? I can’t believe you’d suggest such a thing. This is Atlanta, Georgia, after all, a place where this has never been … oh, never mind.

Anon21Member since 2018
12 years ago
Reply to  Pumpsie Green

No, he pretty clear didn’t suggest that. He was comparing different means of measuring performance, not suggesting the Braves took non-performance factors into account. If you want to suggest that, why don’t you? I might even agree with you.

Pumpsie Green
12 years ago
Reply to  Anon21

I thought he was poking around different measures for value. Clearly, the Braves place a very high value on Freeman, and it isn’t just for the hit-catch-run stuff, as this article shows. If all they wanted was the on-field, they probably could have found better value (McCutchen, et al). They also value whatever ‘homegrown’ and ‘core’ are euphemisms for.

Anon21Member since 2018
12 years ago
Reply to  Anon21

I don’t think you read the article very carefully, Pumpsie. Dave’s point is that players now are not going to accept McCutchen-level deals anymore, because they’re too weighted towards teams. Freeman and Andrus are symptoms of a market correction that is going to see more and more talented young players refusing to sell their free-agent years at the large discounts that characterized the wave of extensions signed over the past 4 years or so. From that perspective, the Braves are simply responding to a changed market for young players, and their decision to give Freeman what looks like a pretty fair deal based on his service time and reasonable projections for his future performance is not in need of any special explanation.

TKDC
12 years ago
Reply to  Pumpsie Green

If you’re looking for a racist history in baseball, you should look up north to the team you played for.

Michael Procton
12 years ago
Reply to  Angelsjunky

His “Def” may or may not be improving, but he’s been a solid, above-average defender since the day he arrived in the bigs. UZR doesn’t assign him value for saving errors from others, and therein lies Freeman’s strength. His huge frame and great hands are an asset, even if he’s not going to snare a liner two-thirds of the way to second.

Pumpsie Green
12 years ago

Do you think MLB will get younger if deals like this work out for both sides? More kids will forego college, knowing they can blast through the minors, start getting paid, and even get a shot at free agency well before they reach 30. And, teams may be more inclined to pay for prime years rather than decline years, even if they do hold a monopoly on those prime years.

Anon21Member since 2018
12 years ago
Reply to  Pumpsie Green

And, teams may be more inclined to pay for prime years rather than decline years, even if they do hold a monopoly on those prime years.

Kind of an interesting way of putting it; the Braves’ problem prior to inking this deal, of course, was that they had a monopoly on roughly the first half of his prime but not the second. They’ve been very aggressive in recent years about promoting prospects when they’re ready rather than basing promotion decisions on service time considerations, so it may be that they’re in an atypical spot with regard to seeing a lot of good players threatening to depart for free agency in their mid-20s.

Pumpsie Green
12 years ago
Reply to  Anon21

Yes, atypical, but I think we’ll see this become more of a norm. Probably not for teams like the Yankees or Dodgers, but more among those teams nestled around the 100M payroll mark right now.

Anon21Member since 2018
12 years ago
Reply to  Pumpsie Green

For the Yankees and Dodgers, if you’re confident you can afford to the player free-agent prices to stick around during your exclusive negotiating window, there’s no need to ever let a promising prospect rot in Triple A when he could be helping the big league club right now. Maybe the Braves, who are revenue-constrained, should have been more attentive to service-time considerations, but given the way their playoff races in 2010 and 2011 played out, I have a hard time saying Wren was wrong to view the marginal value of a win in each year as very high.

Jesse
12 years ago

Looking at it this deal looks alot like the Gonzalez Deal, While Gonzales has a bit better track record, but smaller track record. Both guys were prominent prospects coming off excellent season aided by high babip and signed deal covering their peak, only the braves got 2 more FA years and one less team controlled year for 55m. given how much the market has changed just over the last 3 years, the deals seem very comparable

Travis L
12 years ago
Reply to  Jesse

Adrian Gonzalez? He signed a bigger deal (7/154, all FA years) 2 year ago – before the big TV money started to kick in.

Freeman has had around 9 WAR the past 3 years. Adrian had about 17 WAR the 3 years prior to his big deal.

While I think the Freeman deal is fair if he produces 3-4 WAR for the rest of the contract, I fail to see how it’s similar to Adrian’s deal.

cthabeerman
12 years ago
Reply to  Travis L

I think he was speaking of Carlos Gonzalez. Adrian Gonzalez’s track record was pretty well established when he received his extension.

-C

Fred
12 years ago

Really thought provoking article! This is not meant to contradict your point, but I think it is important to remember that when considering pre fre-agency contracts, the risk/reward calculation for players vs. agents aught to be quite different. Is more costly for the player who turns down a guaranteed contract and has a devastating injury than it is for the agent of that player. The agent can still come out ahead in the end, because on a population level turning down cheap pre free-agency contracts is the “right” move.

jdbolickMember since 2016
12 years ago

Even if this does represent “the new normal” from agents’ perspectives, it’s hard to understand the incentive for the team to go along with it. The closer contracts get between players under team control and those entering free agency, the less incentive there would be for the team to assume the risk of a long-term contract for players under team control. That’s the problem I have with Freeman’s contract. He might be worth it and he might not, but the lack of an obvious discount causes me to wonder why on earth the Braves would make such a substantial commitment right now. If they believe they could wait and get a similar deal much closer to free agency, why not try that instead?

jdbolickMember since 2016
12 years ago
Reply to  Dave Cameron

Brian McCann is a 29 year old who just signed for $85 million over five seasons. Jacoby Ellsbury is a 30 year old who has established a significantly higher level of performance than anything Freeman has yet to achieve and signed for $153 million over seven seasons. James Loney is a 29 year old, ~2 win player who signed for $21 million over three seasons. Whether you agree with it or not, the market has not historically favored sub-.200 ISO first basemen, so the notion of Freeman getting “8/200” is comically absurd. Of course he can ask for whatever he wants, but the only chance of that happening is if the dollar becomes toilet paper.

Throwing out “8/200, easy” is so unrealistic that it appears you’re getting defensive about your column, not rationally assessing what I’ve said. Perhaps Freddie Freeman would get more than 20 million AAV as a free agent in 2017. I believe he’d get less because I don’t think he will sustain that ’13 performance. A lot more, though? That’s extraordinarily unlikely without a major change in his pretty established profile. And the reality is that the only significant difference between his 1.8 WAR in 2012 and his 4.8 in 2013 is the .076 gain in BABIP. The odds of a guy who had roughly the same offensive contribution in 2011 and 2012 seeing this huge BABIP-driven jump in 2013 and then sustaining it for 3+ years to come are infinitesimal.

The Braves are a mid-market team that can’t afford many more payroll mistakes, especially with B.J. Upton staying on the books longer than team control of Heyward and Simmons. The only reason you would ever give an eight year commitment to a player three years from free agency is if you believe the offer represents not only a discount, but a very substantial one because of the risk involved. Three years away from free agency. That’s an eternity in baseball. Three years ago Daric Barton posted the exact same 4.8 WAR.

a5ehren
12 years ago
Reply to  Dave Cameron

Maybe not 8/200, but 7/154 wouldn’t be out of the question.

I expect Heyward to get something like that when he hits FA for his age 26 (!) season.

jdbolickMember since 2016
12 years ago
Reply to  a5ehren

I do too, but Heyward has been a substantially more valuable player than Freeman thus far.

Jason B
12 years ago
Reply to  a5ehren

Although Heyward’s value may be harder to discern than Freeman’s; a lot of Heyward’s value comes from walks and defense (and baserunning, to a lesser extent) which is traditionally rewarded less (at least in arbitration, if not free agency) than the “traditional” metrics like BA/HR/RBI.

On the local drive-time radio, one of the hosts is a passionate, partisan Braves fan; when they were discussing the Freeman extension and he was asked for a word to describe Heyward, he said “underwhelming”. I think a lot of fans not familiar with some of the newfangled metrics would agree. So it will be interesting to see how their extensions compare (if Heyward is extended).

emac2
12 years ago
Reply to  Dave Cameron

Comparing a first basemen to a starting pitcher that is an international superstar?

I agree they’re both male humans that play baseball but their situations and impact are completely unrelated.

Anon21Member since 2018
12 years ago
Reply to  jdbolick

“If they believe they could wait and get a similar deal much closer to free agency, why not try that instead?”

Why would they believe that? As Dave’s article yesterday pointed out, this deal locks Freeman up for his prime and maybe just a year or so after, and avoids committing any money to him during his decline years. If Freeman plays well over the next three years—say, averages 3.5 WAR per year or more—there’s just no way he would agree to a 5-year deal at $22 million AAV in 2016. He might agree to $22 million AAV, but it would be for eight years or something like that. Then you have the dead money problem that comes into play with contracts like those being handed out to Cano, Ellsbury, and Pujols.

semperty
12 years ago

I just don’t get how they can offer someone like Freeman (with one great year, reliant upon a seemingly fluky BABIP) 8/135 before they offer it to Heyward. Sure JH has had some injury issues, but he’s still produced 2 WAR in all 4 seasons, and been upwards of 3 WAR in 3 of his four seasons. I get wanting to lock up one young asset and make them the face of your franchise, I just don’t get the decision they made.

Anon21Member since 2018
12 years ago
Reply to  semperty

If 8/135 is what it would have taken to extend Heyward, he would already be extended. Heyward wants to test free agency. His position in negotiations with the Braves so far has been “Give me what I could expect to receive in free agency, assuming I produce at 2012 levels from this point forward.” The Braves have so far not been willing (or able?) to do that. But let’s not suggest that the Braves wouldn’t have been happier to do this exact deal with Heyward; it takes two to tango.

obsessivegiantscompulsive
12 years ago
Reply to  Anon21

I don’t know about that. Heyward’s two year contract isn’t valuing his last two arb years very highly. Under the 40/60/80% rule on arb years percentage value of market value, his two year contract basically values him at $10M per year. If he’s wanting big money, he would have been better off going into arbitration and fighting for it, instead of signing that contract. He probably could have gotten $13.3M in his final arb year, that’s about what Hunter Pence got and I think Heyward has been a better player, overall.

Wil
12 years ago
Reply to  Anon21

Heyward wants to have a fully healthy year before signing an extension. That way he can maximize his value.

Michael Procton
12 years ago
Reply to  Anon21

Absolutely. Specifically, Heyward and his agents have apparently taken the position that his injuries shouldn’t count, because he’s otherwise been productive. Teams simply can’t take that kind of actual, proven risk on. Particularly not when compared to the kind of speculative risk they’re taking with Freeman in extending him.

Otter
12 years ago
Reply to  semperty

Amen. I hate this contract for the Braves, they’re paying a ton for a high BABIP which he might/probably won’t keep up. Unless Freeman can get up to 30-35 home runs, I don’t see how this ends well for the Braves.

The rule of thumb should probably be:
-Pitchers, take the money
-Position players, wait

Not cameron maybin
12 years ago

Maybin doesn’t belong on the bust list. 25 million over 5 million and he’s already been worth 7 million over the first two years even while being injured almost all of last year. In the year before that he was a 2+WAR player.

Matthew Murphy
12 years ago

The Braves have a great young team right now, but a lot of their big contributors are only under team control for another few years. It’s understandable that the Braves wanted to make sure they had at least one star-type player, a “face of the franchise” locked up through their move to Cobb County in 2017. I know the decision of who to extend is based primarily on performance and cost, but I can’t imagine that it hurt Freeman that he’s white, given the location of their new stadium: http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5484/12352489934_1e4cbe9be1_z.jpg (pink = white, blue = black)

a5ehren
12 years ago
Reply to  Matthew Murphy

The Braves fanbase is already overwhelmingly white, regardless of the actual location of the stadium.

Michael Procton
12 years ago
Reply to  a5ehren

…particularly the part of the fanbase that actually goes to and watches the games and buys merchandise, etc.

GlobalAlpha
12 years ago

Players are risk averse. Teams will be close to risk-neutral. A risk-sharing contract makes a good deal of sense and will provide benefits to both player and team. The exact discount if the contract will depend upon the degree of risk aversion held by the player. For any contract, there will be a level of risk aversion that justifies the price. Are you saying that the dozens of contracts signed earlier are I correct? I would think not; the more interesting question is how had the coefficient of risk aversion changed? Are players less risk averse now than they were previously? Is Freeman just an outlier on the risk aversion spectrum? Or are we seeing a shift in levels of risk aversion across players? Are fewer players singing these contracts at all, or waiting until longer in their careers to do so? That would be some evidence. I think that’s much more interesting than saying “hey players and agents were stupid before, now they are going to be smarter”.

obsessivegiantscompulsive
12 years ago

I don’t consider this a sign that the market has changed, but it certainly is going to be a huge test of a change. Freeman had a huge outlier in BABIP, and if he regresses, say, to his career BABIP (2013 balanced out his poor 2012 BABIP), his OPS will end up in the .800 OPS area, and which is what he hit in 2011-2012, and people and teams will see this contract as a huge bust not to be duplicated.

But if this was a break out year in terms of BABIP for him (like Votto had), then, yeah, I can see this contract being what young players will demand going forward.

Unfortunately, I don’t think the money will be there, it is a bit like musical chairs, only so many big money contracts can be signed, and even with the big money increase coming this year which will help pay for Freeman’s contract, once a team spends that money, there is no more money in the till until the next contract uptick or until one of their big money contracts end. And there is no guarantee that the cable money gravy train will continue for every team. I’ve read that LAD’s contract might be the last of them.

Shaun
12 years ago

What’s even more fascinating is that it’s a team like the Braves, a team known as one with a relatively low payroll budget, bucking the trend and paying a young player the going market rate.

Me
12 years ago
Reply to  Shaun

I think that makes it all the more telling. That’s a fairly shrewd front office.

jdbolickMember since 2016
12 years ago
Reply to  Me

Please distinguish between shrewdness in player development and shrewdness in business operations. This is the same team that gave Dan Uggla $62 million over five years and B.J. Upton $75 million over five years.

Anon21Member since 2018
12 years ago
Reply to  jdbolick

I don’t know that it makes sense to tag the B.J. Upton deal as a mistake. Yeah, it has completely blown up in their faces, but analysts of many and varied perspectives liked the deal fine when it was signed. What happened to Upton last year is really pretty bizarre, and I don’t think it’s a stretch to say that even the shrewdest front office could not have predicted his sudden loss of hitting ability.

jdbolickMember since 2016
12 years ago
Reply to  jdbolick

Neither Upton or Uggla were expected to decline so far so fast, but both being overpaid was very predictable. Prior to the Upton signing FanGraphs had estimated B.J.’s worth to be 4 years, $52 million.

Anon21Member since 2018
12 years ago
Reply to  jdbolick

The Uggla extension I’m not defending. That was a mistake when it was signed, and I think it was recognized as such.

When you say “Fangraphs” estimated Upton’s worth at 4/$52 million, where are you getting that? An actual analyst or a projection, fine, I’ll reconsider my view that the deal reflected a reasonable process. If you mean “the crowd,” all I can say is that the crowd is very stupid about free-agent contracts and think everyone is overpaid.

jdbolickMember since 2016
12 years ago
Reply to  jdbolick

I included the link. For whatever it’s worth, that link perfectly nailed Nick Swisher’s $56 million over 4.

Wil
12 years ago
Reply to  jdbolick

Oh please. Last year was the first year Uggla wasn’t worth his contract. People hate on the Uggla extension but prior to 2013 he had never been worth less than 2 WAR.

Anon21Member since 2018
12 years ago
Reply to  jdbolick

Sorry, I didn’t see that; the house style of comments doesn’t set off URLs at all.

Basically, the crowd occasionally lucks into one, but is generally very bad (specifically, too low) at free-agent deals. If you look at <a href="http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/fangraphs-crowd-the-top-47-free-agents/&quot; title ="this list", it’s missed low on the vast majority of free-agent contracts signed so far this offseason. It’s often been absurdly low (Choo at 5 years, $81 million?!). So to me, the fact that the crowd thought giving B.J. Upton 5/$75 million was a bad idea is not really evidence that the Braves did anything a shrewder front office would not have.

Anon21Member since 2018
12 years ago
Reply to  jdbolick

Oh, well done, Fangraphs tags. Let’s try again! http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/fangraphs-crowd-the-top-47-free-agents/

jdbolickMember since 2016
12 years ago
Reply to  jdbolick

Anon21, you’re conflating two very different things: what a player will receive and what they should receive. It only takes one team to blow away expectations of what a player will get, but that doesn’t actually mean they deserved to.

Wil: Technically true, although exceeding that mark in 2012 was based on a positive defensive value amidst a five year period where he had been consistently negative. I hope you’ll understand my skepticism regarding the accuracy of that. Again, Uggla’s decline was more precipitous than we expected and he could certainly see a modest rebound in 2014, but a less dramatic decline was foreseeable.

Anon21Member since 2018
12 years ago
Reply to  Me

Can you give me any reason to suspect that random Fangraphs readers have a better idea of what a player “should” receive than major-league GMs? Because if not, I’m going to trust that the people whose job this is have a better handle on actual player value than a group of (intelligent, to be sure) fans.

jdbolickMember since 2016
12 years ago
Reply to  Anon21

Do you mean besides the collective history of numerous MLB general managers handing out awful contracts?

Dead Opera Star
12 years ago

Pre-arb extending Kyle Seager is probably going to be way more difficult/pricey now, if this is any indication of how things are going to be from now on.

Bill McKinley
12 years ago

The player Freddie Freeman most reminds me of is John Olerud to this point in his career. If he goes on to have the same kind of career, both he and the Braves will be well served by this new contract. Freeman is a line drive machine and he uses most of the field. We likely have not seen his best year.

Baseball Reference says Freeman’s closest comp for his age 21,22,23 seasons is Eddie Murray each year. That is an indication of his upside.

Bill

jdbolickMember since 2016
12 years ago
Reply to  Bill McKinley

Murray is an understandable comparison but had a drastically lower K% throughout his career than anything Freeman has posted thus far. Olerud doesn’t fit for the same reason. Adam LaRoche and Lyle Overbay are more similar to Freeman overall during their first seasons but they broke into the majors much later, so those aren’t great comparisons either. It’s hard to find anyone who fits particularly well.

The K% struck me as interesting because it’s so different from the players Freeman is often compared to and seems at odds with his ability thus far to hit line drives. His contact rate and Z-contact rate are pretty ordinary as well. That led me to notice his Swing%, which ranks 20th among all major leaguers since 2010. The Z-Swing% is an even more extraordinary 3rd behind Josh Hamilton and Vladimir Guerrero. Essentially, Freddie Freeman is an extremely aggressive hitter who has a very good awareness of the strike zone and makes unremarkable contact. There actually is a first baseman who fits that profile just about perfectly aside from San Francisco not committing to him the way that Atlanta has to Freeman. It’s Brandon Belt.

Anon21Member since 2018
12 years ago
Reply to  jdbolick

The league K% in 1979, when Murray had a year very comparable to Freeman’s 2013 in terms of experience level and value, was 12.5%. The league K% last year was 19.9%. Eddie Murray’s K% in 1979 was 11.4%. Freeman struck out 19.2% of the time last year. Freeman is clearly somewhat more strikeout-prone relative to league average, but the difference isn’t “drastic” in light of the different hitting environments that he and Murray played through.

jdbolickMember since 2016
12 years ago
Reply to  Anon21

Hitting environments don’t cause an 8% difference in strikeout rate, so you’re grasping at enormous straws here. Freddie Freeman doesn’t strike out more because of his peers. He strikes out much more frequently than Olerud or Murray did because his contact skills aren’t on their level, but he does have the fortune to play in an era where teams don’t discriminate against batters for striking out. There’s no point in even bringing up the league average.

Anon21Member since 2018
12 years ago
Reply to  Anon21

How is there no point in bringing up the league average or the hitting environment? Are you completely ignorant of the way WAR is conceptualized and calculated?

And yeah, “hitting environments,” namely the greater share of innings going to extremely hard-throwing short-burst relievers, absolutely can cause an 8% difference in strikeout rate.

jdbolickMember since 2016
12 years ago
Reply to  Anon21

Did you just recently start watching baseball or are you perhaps in your early 20s? I ask because it seems you don’t realize that there were plenty of “extremely hard-throwing short-burst relievers” in the ’90s and ’00s. The league spike in strikeouts primarily derives from teams not emphasizing strikeout avoidance the way they used to. They don’t select against high strikeout batters if they are otherwise valuable, and they generally don’t pressure batters to cut down their strikeouts if they are otherwise valuable. For Freeman specifically, his first inning strikeout rate is roughly identical to his overall strikeout rate, and his K% in “high leverage” situations is slightly lower than his K% in “medium leverage” situations which is slightly lower than his K% in “low leverage” situations.

As for the rest, the league average isn’t relevant because we’re not saying which player was better in their era, we’re looking for players with similar skill sets to estimate how Freddie Freeman might age. Olerud and Murray having substantially better contact skills than Freeman has yet demonstrated means that they are pretty flawed comparisons. You’re attempting to excuse the major flaw in that comparison because you want to keep using it, facts be damned. As I noted by pointing out Freeman’s strong similarities to Brandon Belt, Freddie is not a high-contact, moderate-power first baseman. He’s a moderate-contact, moderate-power first baseman with very strong strikezone awareness who swings at pitches in the zone more aggressively than almost anyone else in baseball.

Anon21Member since 2018
12 years ago
Reply to  Anon21

The share of innings going to guys with 95+ mph fastballs has absolutely increased since the 1990s, both because there are more of them around and because bullpen innings as a proportion of overall innings continue to increase.

“The league spike in strikeouts primarily derives from teams not emphasizing strikeout avoidance the way they used to.”

Pardon me, but: prove it. Why should I care what you assert?

“As for the rest, the league average isn’t relevant because we’re not saying which player was better in their era, we’re looking for players with similar skill sets to estimate how Freddie Freeman might age. Olerud and Murray having substantially better contact skills than Freeman has yet demonstrated means that they are pretty flawed comparisons.”

Sure, we want similar players, but your saying that these players of different eras had “substantially better contact skills” begs the question. They’re not facing the same kinds of pitchers, so what we actually know is that some combination of skills or hitting environment is different between them. If it’s mostly skills, they’re poor comparisons, but if it’s mostly hitting environment, they may be pretty good comparisons.

jdbolickMember since 2016
12 years ago
Reply to  Anon21

Anon21, you’re the one who brought this up by very dubiously insisting that more “extremely hard-throwing short-burst relievers” caused an 8% increase in league strikeout rate. For you to then demand proof from me while providing none of your own is incredibly hypocritical.

Furthermore, I already provided proof specific to Freeman by showing the absence of a significant difference between his first inning strikeout rate and overall rate, as well as the fact that his rate in high leverage situations (presumably more common later in the game) is actually lower than in other situations. Freddie Freeman has a much higher K% than Murray or Olerud because he doesn’t possess their level of contact.

tz
12 years ago

I’m beginning to see why Scott Boras, of all people, had Elvis Andrus take the “lock-up” deal:

1. The Rangers value the “newfangled” stats
2. Not every other does
3. In addition to #2, enough teams will have made the market correction Dave’s talking about that there’s a chance that the free agent markup would go flat by the time Andrus hit free agency.

Put it this way, if Mike Trout just goes year-by-year to arbitration, I’d hate to hit free agency the same year he does.

Simon
12 years ago
Reply to  tz

There’s really no evidence to suggest that going to free agency at the same time as one really good player has any impact. 29 teams will still have exactly the same budget as before with no Mike Trout to spend it on after he goes to the Yankees or Dodgers for eleventy billion dollars.

John C
12 years ago
Reply to  Simon

He’ll never leave Anaheim unless he just wants to. Arte Moreno can spend just as much as the Yankees and Dodgers can. He’ll be happy to spend it on the best player in baseball.

Matt
12 years ago

What would be a reasonable extension for both sides for Josh Donaldson right now?

~5 WAR true talent player, less than 2 years of service time, one great year on his track record.

Not that it will happen, but an A’s fan’s gotta hope.

Jason B
12 years ago
Reply to  Matt

“~5 WAR true talent player”

Whoa there. Let’s see him repeat it a time or two. VERY few players are 5 WAR true talent players. (Not saying Josh isn’t, or can’t be, we just can’t definitively say that yet.)

Matt
12 years ago
Reply to  Jason B

That’s just a best guess at this point. He put up 8 WAR this past season. Projection systems come in at about 5 WAR. I think it’s reasonable to say that’s the best guess we have now for his true talent.

(Don't)Pitch To Contact
12 years ago

Freeman is not a bad defensive first basemen, if you actually watch him play his range is not bad and he saves a lot of bad throws, he is also really good handling a throw in the dirt.

Anon21Member since 2018
12 years ago

He has fine range to the line and good reflexes that allow him to make some pretty good plays on hard grounders or smoked liners. He has good hands and footwork around the bag, though this is often exaggerated by Braves fans. His range to his right is bad. Anyway, I agree with your bottom line: he’s not a bad defensive first baseman.

larry
12 years ago

as someone who also watches the brave a lot, i think you are only half right. He does save a lot of bad throws, ie he is really good at handling throws in the dirt, but his range is not good. He has a slow first step to the ball and is slow getting down to balls. But, the ones he can get to, he usually handles well.

Wil
12 years ago

IT’s just how they calculate first base defense. Of the primary 1st baseman last year, I don’t think any of them graded positively in the defensive metrics.

Jane
12 years ago

I have to believe that most of these haters are not watching braves games. If you point to his high Babip as a reason for doubting him than I doubt you. What do you think his batting average floor is? I ll bet that he hits 300 more times than not during the length of those eight years. If he can’t hit for average than what are the braves signing him for? I mean he can’t hit for power right? Only he hit 23 homers last year but i guess he will tap out there. Shit when he gets to thirty homers I guess we can complain about how he didn’t hit fourty. Come on guys don’t act like your not hating. He’s a freaking huge guy at the age of 24 who puts up quality at bats time after time and yes he does not have that much range but his hands are kotch man esque, really hate making that comparison. There are twenty five teams out there that wish they had this guy but keep hating on him and the braves it’s fine they Weill both keep doing their thing and us braves fans will be fine with that.

Breaking news
12 years ago
Reply to  Jane

—THIS JUST IN—

Jane *really* likes the Braves.

—END BREAKING NEWS—

Back to Spook Specter for the Sports!

Jane
12 years ago

O and let’s make sure to make another nick markakis reference even though nobody’s been compared to him pretty much ever

Big in Japan
12 years ago

I’m having a tough time seeing a “new normal” in this. This looks more like a Mike Sweeney overpay to me – a deal that everyone immediately describes as an overpay, and serves to remind GMs that you can’t pay top dollar for guys who only produce on offense, unless they’ve established they have a truly elite bat.

Who among us would be surprised if Freddie Freeman never exceeds his 2013 season? With the leveling of the aging curve, there’s no reason to expect that Freddie’s 24-26 is going be more productive than his 23 season. Yeah, he might learn to hit more homers, or he might continue to improve his glovework, but the truth is, the Braves paid full freight for ifs and buts.

If the Cardinals had given this deal to Matt Carpenter, I’d applaud, because he has a 7 WAR season under his belt. If the Orioles gave this deal to Manny Machado (after a healthy 2014), I’d understand, because his defense is so elite. But Freddie Freeman is a 1B with a 150 wRC based on a BABIP that he never once matched previously in his professional career. Regress his BABIP to .340, and he’s Allen Craig (who’s working on a 6 year/$31 million deal, incidentally).

Big in Japan
12 years ago
Reply to  Big in Japan

The Sweeney contract, for those who don’t remember this albatross:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/baseball/news/2002/03/29/sweeney_ap/

emac2
12 years ago
Reply to  Big in Japan

With the leveling of the aging curve you don’t expect him to get better after 23?

Are you 10? Baseball players don’t peak at 23. 23 only seems old when you’re very very young.

bilbovibrator
12 years ago

“it’s easy to make any argument look good by just cherry picking data points in your favor”
lol love this guy

jdbolickMember since 2016
12 years ago

I don’t pay for Insider, but is the ESPN title misleading or did Dave really write a column there suggesting that Freddie Freeman is Joey Votto 2.0? http://insider.espn.go.com/mlb/hotstove13/story/_/id/10423298/freddie-freeman-similar-career-path-joey-votto-mlb I’m in a weird spot because I don’t know if I should start laughing hysterically or not.

emac2
12 years ago

Terrible deal by the braves period.

They basically guaranteed him maximum dollars for every year of the deal while only gaining whatever inflation might occur in the interim.

In exchange, they take all the injury risk and all they get is a first baseman that will never contribute more production than his salary warrents.

This is how teams assure long-term mediocrity as production in excess of your contract is the difference maker.

I never thought I would see the braves make such a stupid deal at a stupid position. This will slow the deals for young players but there will still be some smart enough to give away a year or two of their careers in order to lock in financial security a couple of years sooner.

Only an idiot races to 100 million before they get to 1 million.

Anon21Member since 2018
12 years ago
Reply to  emac2

“They basically guaranteed him maximum dollars for every year of the deal while only gaining whatever inflation might occur in the interim.

In exchange, they take all the injury risk and all they get is a first baseman that will never contribute more production than his salary warrents.”

Why not read the comments before spewing this nonsense? At the current price of a win, he is projected to produce more than his maximum yearly salary under this deal next year, when he’s not even being paid the maximum yet. If he follows a normal aging curve, he’ll peak a bit above there. The Braves have built in a decent amount of expected upside simply from paying him less than his expected production. In exchange, they are taking on injury and underperformance risk, but this is not in any way a “terrible deal.”