ZiPS Midseason Movers and Shakers: Pitchers

One of the most frequent questions I receive about ZiPS is folks wondering how the long-term projections for X hitter or Y pitcher have changed compared to what they were preseason. Since we’re right around the midpoint of the season, this is a good time to review just how the first half of the 2024 season has shifted expectations for individual players. The methodology I’m using is simple: comparing the current 2025-2029 WAR projections versus the 2025-2029 WAR projections as predicted at the start of the season. I’ve only included good prospects and players who are currently relevant to the majors (or injured) so we don’t get a bunch of random Double-A pitchers who are slightly more or less below replacement level than they used to be gumming things up. I’m also not including the pitchers who’d be on the list because of season-ending injuries; a list of 15 pitchers who have worse long-term outlooks because they’re out for the season with Tommy John surgery or thoracic outlet syndrome isn’t particularly interesting.
Since I’m such a cheerful and upbeat fellow, let’s start with the gainers. I’m also including each player’s updated top three comps, because comps are fun, even if the individual players listed don’t really mean a lot to the projection. At the very least, it contextualizes expectations in a non-WAR manner:
Garrett Crochet is one of the biggest names likely to move this month, and he’s at the top of the most improved list. Some of this is simply more projected innings as a result of his conversion to the rotation – an unusually canny White Sox gamble – but more of it is due to simply dispelling concerns. Crochet had forearm tightness as early as the 2020 playoffs and then missed 2022 and most of 2023 due to Tommy John surgery. His brief return to the Pale Hose last year was solid only if you stop looking at his stats after your eyes hit the decent ERA. But he’s been legitimately excellent as a full-time starter this year. In a lot of ways, his success runs a parallel to another similar gamble the White Sox made a little more than a decade ago, when they moved Chris Sale to the rotation. As was the case with Sale, many predicted disaster for Crochet. His next team likely will monitor his innings because, well, all teams protects their starting pitchers these days. Between Crochet and Sale, maybe the White Sox have found an unusual market efficiency: pitchers with last names from the JOANN Fabrics word cloud. This projection includes Crochet’s dominant start against the Rockies on Sunday. Two scoreless outings that lasted just five innings are Crochet’s only non-quality starts since April.
| Year | W | L | ERA | G | GS | IP | H | ER | HR | BB | SO | ERA+ | WAR |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 2025 | 8 | 5 | 3.26 | 47 | 15 | 113.3 | 86 | 41 | 12 | 39 | 148 | 133 | 2.9 |
| 2026 | 8 | 5 | 3.21 | 48 | 15 | 115.0 | 87 | 41 | 12 | 38 | 148 | 134 | 3.0 |
| 2027 | 8 | 5 | 3.25 | 48 | 15 | 119.0 | 91 | 43 | 13 | 38 | 149 | 133 | 3.1 |
| 2028 | 8 | 5 | 3.29 | 49 | 15 | 117.7 | 92 | 43 | 13 | 37 | 145 | 131 | 3.0 |
| 2029 | 8 | 5 | 3.38 | 49 | 15 | 117.3 | 93 | 44 | 13 | 37 | 141 | 128 | 2.8 |
| 2030 | 8 | 5 | 3.48 | 48 | 15 | 113.7 | 92 | 44 | 13 | 36 | 134 | 124 | 2.6 |
The Tigers may be in the midst of a disappointing season, but that’s definitely not Tarik Skubal’s fault. Skubal is less likely to be moved at the deadline than Crochet, simply because I expect Detroit still hopes to contend while he’s cost controlled. Skubal’s repertoire fascinates me. While it’s fairly typical for pitchers to throw a lot fewer offspeed pitches with the platoon advantage, he also largely sheds his four-seamer as well. Instead, he throws sinker all over the zone as he transforms into a hard-throwing southpaw relief bully against lefties. Facing righties, he uses the whole kitchen sink, using the sinker then to threaten batters with broken fingers or hands. Skubal’s a legitimate Cy Young contender, and the further we get away from the flexor tendon surgery that kept him out from August of 2022 until last July, the less we should worry about his health mucking things up. Skubal’s teammate Jack Flaherty just missed the top 15 here, because even as he struggled in recent years, ZiPS hadn’t totally given up on the former Cardinal.
| Year | W | L | ERA | G | GS | IP | H | ER | HR | BB | SO | ERA+ | WAR |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 2025 | 6 | 5 | 3.19 | 25 | 25 | 141.0 | 120 | 50 | 13 | 31 | 149 | 133 | 3.4 |
| 2026 | 6 | 5 | 3.26 | 25 | 25 | 141.0 | 123 | 51 | 13 | 30 | 145 | 130 | 3.3 |
| 2027 | 7 | 5 | 3.38 | 26 | 26 | 151.7 | 135 | 57 | 14 | 32 | 152 | 125 | 3.4 |
| 2028 | 7 | 5 | 3.48 | 28 | 28 | 155.3 | 141 | 60 | 15 | 33 | 151 | 122 | 3.3 |
| 2029 | 6 | 6 | 3.61 | 28 | 28 | 152.0 | 143 | 61 | 16 | 33 | 144 | 117 | 3.0 |
| 2030 | 6 | 6 | 3.83 | 27 | 27 | 145.7 | 142 | 62 | 17 | 32 | 135 | 111 | 2.6 |
Tanner Houck is the best result of Boston’s apparent initiative to proselytize the virtues of split-fingered fastballs. He is probably never going to be a starter who whiffs 12 batters per nine, but he does the other fundamentals well; he throws a lot of first-pitch strikes, avoids walks, and induces enough grounders to keep the ball in the park. He’s certainly a candidate to sign an extension with Boston. Like Skubal, Houck has a teammate who just missed this list, Kutter Crawford.
| Year | W | L | ERA | G | GS | IP | H | ER | HR | BB | SO | ERA+ | WAR |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 2025 | 9 | 7 | 3.97 | 28 | 25 | 143.0 | 133 | 63 | 15 | 40 | 142 | 112 | 2.7 |
| 2026 | 9 | 7 | 4.01 | 28 | 25 | 143.7 | 136 | 64 | 15 | 40 | 139 | 111 | 2.6 |
| 2027 | 8 | 8 | 4.16 | 27 | 24 | 142.7 | 140 | 66 | 16 | 40 | 135 | 106 | 2.4 |
| 2028 | 8 | 8 | 4.30 | 27 | 23 | 136.0 | 137 | 65 | 16 | 39 | 126 | 103 | 2.1 |
| 2029 | 8 | 7 | 4.43 | 27 | 23 | 132.0 | 138 | 65 | 17 | 38 | 119 | 100 | 1.8 |
| 2030 | 6 | 8 | 4.70 | 24 | 21 | 118.7 | 128 | 62 | 16 | 36 | 104 | 94 | 1.4 |
I’m still not sure how Reynaldo López is doing it, as he’s basically a fastball-slider pitcher with only occasional cameos from his curve and changeup. I was skeptical coming into the season, but taking a bit off his slider has worked wonders; he’s added several inches of drop to the pitch from the past. It’s hard to overestimate his value to the Braves this year. With Spencer Strider out for the season, a failure of López in his return to starting likely would have had some fairly serious repercussions to the rotation. ZiPS is still hedging a bit on his starter/relief status, but it doesn’t make a big difference in the projections.
| Year | W | L | ERA | G | GS | IP | H | ER | HR | BB | SO | ERA+ | WAR |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 2025 | 6 | 3 | 3.50 | 42 | 15 | 105.3 | 92 | 41 | 12 | 39 | 110 | 124 | 2.7 |
| 2026 | 6 | 3 | 3.67 | 39 | 14 | 98.0 | 88 | 40 | 12 | 38 | 100 | 118 | 2.4 |
| 2027 | 5 | 3 | 3.76 | 36 | 13 | 91.0 | 83 | 38 | 11 | 36 | 91 | 116 | 2.0 |
| 2028 | 5 | 3 | 3.98 | 34 | 12 | 81.3 | 77 | 36 | 11 | 35 | 80 | 109 | 1.6 |
| 2029 | 4 | 3 | 4.15 | 33 | 12 | 78.0 | 76 | 36 | 11 | 36 | 74 | 105 | 1.3 |
| 2030 | 4 | 3 | 4.54 | 30 | 11 | 69.3 | 72 | 35 | 11 | 35 | 64 | 96 | 0.8 |
I wrote about Cristopher Sánchez last week, so you can get more on him at the link. His teammate Ranger Suárez has nearly put himself into the same tier as Zack Wheeler and Aaron Nola, and if the season ended today, I’d likely pick Suárez if I were a Cy Young voter. (We don’t find out the voting assignments for a couple more months.) Like Houck, Suárez is a fundamentally sound pitcher, and his plate discipline stats largely support his being one of the lowest walk pitchers in baseball. Suárez, who is scheduled to reach free agency after next season, has earned a lot on his next contract because of this year’s performance.
| Year | W | L | ERA | G | GS | IP | H | ER | HR | BB | SO | ERA+ | WAR |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 2025 | 6 | 4 | 3.52 | 30 | 27 | 156.0 | 144 | 61 | 16 | 49 | 145 | 124 | 3.5 |
| 2026 | 6 | 4 | 3.67 | 29 | 26 | 149.7 | 143 | 61 | 16 | 47 | 135 | 119 | 3.1 |
| 2027 | 5 | 4 | 3.79 | 28 | 25 | 145.0 | 143 | 61 | 16 | 46 | 128 | 115 | 2.9 |
| 2028 | 5 | 4 | 3.91 | 27 | 23 | 135.7 | 137 | 59 | 16 | 44 | 117 | 111 | 2.5 |
| 2029 | 5 | 4 | 4.09 | 27 | 23 | 132.0 | 138 | 60 | 17 | 44 | 111 | 106 | 2.2 |
| 2030 | 4 | 4 | 4.27 | 23 | 20 | 118.0 | 127 | 56 | 16 | 41 | 97 | 102 | 1.7 |
Amusingly, Michael King was talked about like he was a bust as a starter with the Padres back in April, but he’s been solid since then, with a FIP under 3.00 over the last two months. He’s had to take the velocity down a notch in his longer starts, but his arsenal has survived the conversion to the rotation. Meanwhile, 120 or so miles up the coast, who would have thought that Tyler Glasnow would be the healthy rock in a top team’s rotation? So far so good for the Dodgers’ big pickup from the Rays, and ZiPS is more confident in his ability to stay on the mound moving forward.
Jordan Hicks has shed some velocity and strikeouts in his move to the rotation, but a good no. 2 starter is simply more valuable than a hard-throwing, but erratic, reliever. Chris Sale looks as good as he did a decade ago, and Seth Lugo is showing that his slop-throwing success in 2023 wasn’t a fluke. Corbin Burnes has been even better than ZiPS projected, and Paul Skenes has adjusted to the majors as quickly as the most optimistic predictions. Cole Ragans is rapidly making his case for being a legitimate ace for the Royals, and they’d be smart to lock him up as soon as possible. Some people may be surprised that Shota Imanaga is this low on the list, but remember, ZiPS was already over the moon for him coming into the season, seeing him as only slightly inferior to Yoshinobu Yamamoto.
On the negative side, DL Hall was one of those polarizing pitchers in ZiPS with a wide array of potential outcomes, similar to Tanner Scott and Michael Kopech. Even so, I can’t remember ZiPS going this south on a pitcher after only a few starts, but it makes sense when you consider that Hall’s upside has disappeared due to his mediocre velocity and unimpressive strikeout rate, leaving only the projection system’s greatest fear regarding Hall: way too many walks. The good news for the Brewers is most of their other gambles have paid off this season, and Joey Ortiz — the other half of Milwaukee’s return in the Corbin Burnes trade — has been so good that the Brewers don’t even need Hall to work out for the swap to have been worth it. It would still be nice, though.
| Year | W | L | ERA | G | GS | IP | H | ER | HR | BB | SO | ERA+ | WAR |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 2025 | 3 | 4 | 4.37 | 28 | 16 | 68.0 | 61 | 33 | 9 | 33 | 79 | 100 | 0.8 |
| 2026 | 4 | 4 | 4.13 | 31 | 18 | 76.3 | 68 | 35 | 10 | 36 | 89 | 106 | 1.1 |
| 2027 | 4 | 4 | 4.00 | 33 | 19 | 83.3 | 73 | 37 | 10 | 38 | 96 | 109 | 1.3 |
| 2028 | 5 | 4 | 3.95 | 34 | 19 | 84.3 | 73 | 37 | 10 | 39 | 96 | 110 | 1.3 |
| 2029 | 5 | 4 | 3.96 | 34 | 19 | 84.0 | 73 | 37 | 9 | 38 | 95 | 110 | 1.3 |
| 2030 | 4 | 5 | 4.00 | 34 | 19 | 83.3 | 73 | 37 | 9 | 38 | 92 | 109 | 1.3 |
The pitcher Wilmer Flores quietly moved onto the Tigers’ prospect list over the last few years, and raised some eyebrows this spring with velocity that had suddenly jumped into the high 90s. Moved to the bullpen in Triple-A this year because the Tigers have a deep rotation, Flores had control problems to start the season before he landed on the IL with a sprained shoulder in mid May. He might have serious bounceback potential; there’s a chance that at least some of his struggles could be attributed to his falling into the dugout on a foul ball back in March that left him with a shoulder contusion. Though if that’s the case, it’s concerning that he was allowed to pitch for six weeks with the injury.
| Year | W | L | ERA | G | GS | IP | H | ER | HR | BB | SO | ERA+ | WAR |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 2025 | 4 | 6 | 4.86 | 25 | 15 | 79.7 | 79 | 43 | 9 | 33 | 62 | 87 | 0.5 |
| 2026 | 4 | 6 | 4.67 | 25 | 15 | 81.0 | 78 | 42 | 8 | 32 | 63 | 91 | 0.7 |
| 2027 | 4 | 6 | 4.46 | 25 | 15 | 84.7 | 79 | 42 | 8 | 32 | 66 | 95 | 0.9 |
| 2028 | 4 | 6 | 4.40 | 26 | 15 | 86.0 | 79 | 42 | 8 | 31 | 68 | 96 | 1.0 |
| 2029 | 5 | 5 | 4.36 | 26 | 15 | 86.7 | 80 | 42 | 8 | 31 | 68 | 97 | 1.0 |
| 2030 | 5 | 5 | 4.36 | 26 | 15 | 86.7 | 80 | 42 | 8 | 31 | 68 | 97 | 1.0 |
Alexis Díaz has struggled with command issues this season, and it’s surprising that the Reds have more or less carried on with business as usual for their closer. He’s never been Bob Tewksbury, but walking six batters per nine innings is too many for any pitcher in any role, and it becomes an even larger problem given that he’s allowing a lot more contact than he did in either 2022 or 2023. I’m not sure about the root cause of these woes, but whatever it is, it has made Díaz a riskier proposition.
| Year | W | L | ERA | G | GS | IP | H | ER | HR | BB | SO | ERA+ | WAR |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 2025 | 5 | 7 | 4.57 | 63 | 0 | 65.0 | 50 | 33 | 8 | 33 | 72 | 98 | 0.5 |
| 2026 | 5 | 6 | 4.45 | 60 | 0 | 62.7 | 48 | 31 | 7 | 31 | 69 | 100 | 0.5 |
| 2027 | 5 | 6 | 4.40 | 58 | 0 | 61.3 | 47 | 30 | 7 | 31 | 66 | 101 | 0.5 |
| 2028 | 5 | 6 | 4.47 | 57 | 0 | 58.3 | 46 | 29 | 7 | 29 | 62 | 100 | 0.4 |
| 2029 | 5 | 6 | 4.55 | 56 | 0 | 57.3 | 46 | 29 | 7 | 29 | 60 | 98 | 0.3 |
| 2030 | 4 | 6 | 4.75 | 52 | 0 | 53.0 | 44 | 28 | 7 | 28 | 54 | 94 | 0.2 |
I thought Jordan Montgomery was a nice little signing for Arizona, but so far, he hasn’t come close to expectations. While he didn’t enter the season as a Cy Young candidate, he also didn’t have an array of red flags. I’m also not convinced that signing so late in the winter can still be used as a viable justification. After all, arguably his two best starts this season were his first two, and if anything, he’s pitching worse now than at any point this year. Montgomery never had velocity or strikeouts to spare, so his decline here is extremely worrying.
| Year | W | L | ERA | G | GS | IP | H | ER | HR | BB | SO | ERA+ | WAR |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 2025 | 8 | 7 | 3.90 | 27 | 27 | 152.3 | 154 | 66 | 17 | 48 | 130 | 108 | 2.4 |
| 2026 | 7 | 7 | 4.02 | 24 | 24 | 136.7 | 142 | 61 | 16 | 45 | 113 | 105 | 1.9 |
| 2027 | 6 | 6 | 4.18 | 21 | 21 | 122.7 | 131 | 57 | 15 | 42 | 100 | 101 | 1.5 |
| 2028 | 4 | 5 | 4.40 | 16 | 16 | 90.0 | 100 | 44 | 12 | 33 | 72 | 96 | 0.8 |
| 2029 | 3 | 5 | 4.83 | 13 | 13 | 72.7 | 85 | 39 | 11 | 30 | 56 | 87 | 0.4 |
| 2030 | 2 | 4 | 5.16 | 9 | 9 | 52.3 | 65 | 30 | 9 | 24 | 39 | 81 | 0.1 |
ZiPS had long been the biggest believer in Triston McKenzie, but he’s been an utter disaster this year in his return from back/shoulder and elbow injuries that kept him off the field for most of 2023. So disastrous, in fact, that the Guardians optioned him to the minors right as I was running Jordan Montgomery’s projection. If you’re going to survive as a fly ball pitcher throwing 91 mph, your control has to be impeccable. And, well, that hasn’t been the case. Hopefully they’ll get him back on track at Triple-A. ZiPS may still be too optimistic.
| Year | W | L | ERA | G | GS | IP | H | ER | HR | BB | SO | ERA+ | WAR |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 2025 | 7 | 6 | 4.11 | 23 | 22 | 111.7 | 101 | 51 | 15 | 43 | 106 | 102 | 1.5 |
| 2026 | 6 | 7 | 4.08 | 22 | 21 | 108.0 | 101 | 49 | 15 | 41 | 102 | 103 | 1.5 |
| 2027 | 6 | 7 | 4.05 | 21 | 20 | 106.7 | 101 | 48 | 14 | 40 | 100 | 104 | 1.5 |
| 2028 | 6 | 7 | 4.01 | 20 | 19 | 103.3 | 100 | 46 | 14 | 39 | 96 | 105 | 1.5 |
| 2029 | 6 | 6 | 4.05 | 20 | 19 | 102.3 | 100 | 46 | 13 | 40 | 94 | 104 | 1.4 |
| 2030 | 6 | 6 | 4.15 | 19 | 18 | 97.7 | 98 | 45 | 13 | 39 | 88 | 101 | 1.3 |
Two Phillies prospects, Mick Abel and Griff McGarry, both make the list, and Andrew Painter, who is likely out until 2025, would have been the organization’s third member here if I’d included pitchers with serious injuries. That’s obviously a concern for Philadelphia, but the emergence of Sánchez has cushioned the blow considerably (and McGarry had long since been downgraded as a prospect anyway). Joe Musgrove, who has been quite hittable this year, is here only because the bone spur that currently is bedeviling his elbow is not expected to keep him out for the remainder of the season. I thought Blake Snell was a terrific deal for the Giants, but he’s been erratic this season and serves as a reminder that what BABIP giveth, BABIP taketh away.
Jacob Misiorowski would have been higher on this list of decliners a month ago, but his early season walk problems seem to have waned, though ZiPS still doesn’t think he’s going to succeed in the minors as quickly as it thought back in March. The Mike Soroka comeback isn’t looking too good right now, and his ceiling’s coming down quicker than a booby-trapped roof in a treasure hunt movie. Domingo Germán and Daulton Jefferies both have been beat up by Triple-A hitters this year, with Jefferies also experiencing that across multiple stints in the majors. Joe Boyle and his high-90s fastball earned him a spot in Oakland’s rotation, but command worse than Maxime Weygand netted him a trip back to the minors, where things haven’t gone much better.
Dan Szymborski is a senior writer for FanGraphs and the developer of the ZiPS projection system. He was a writer for ESPN.com from 2010-2018, a regular guest on a number of radio shows and podcasts, and a voting BBWAA member. He also maintains a terrible Twitter account at @DSzymborski.
Is it safe to say that this means ZIPS is not buying any of the Nats trio of young guys in Gore, Irvin, and Parker? I’d have to imagine they didn’t have strong projections before this year.
Irvin is in the 20s (3.8 –> 6.4), Gore in the 30s (9.1 –> 11.1) and Parker in the 90s (7.0 –> 8.1)
Gore is going to be a star pitcher I believe. Along with Taj Bradley in Tampa.
Irvin has out pitched him this year, so far.
Seeing Greene and Skubal highlighted in this series feels like it’ll be about the high point of the season for us lol 🙁
Two loaves is better than none!
Eh. The White Sox are about to trade their loaves for some flour, then hope they can find the yeast.
*waits for updates about Yamamoto*
Was Gavin Stone close to making this list?
So Burnes, Skubal, Sanchez (FV35+), Suarez (FV40), Glasnow, Crochet, Imanaga are among ZIPS’ projected WAR leaders for the next 5 years. Who else? Yamamoto, Steele, Grayson Rodriguez?
Given Sanchez, Suarez, and the Nationals’ Irvin and Parker — seems like a lot of pitchers are vastly overperforming their prospect grades. Would be fun to read a piece from Longenhagen explaining if this is a trend or just fits with a few guys each year having a velocity increase or finding a formula that works.
Eric is a tough grader in general, he very rarely will grade a prospect as a 60. Pitchers carry the added burden of an injury risk so I believe that their grades are generally lower.
I think that’s part of it. Only SP’s, Closers, and everyday position players can make the top 100, so you’d expect 29% to be pitchers. (5 starters + 1 closer) / (5 + 1 + 9 position players) There are currently only 21 pitchers in the top 100, so I think you’re right.
Strider, Webb, Kirby, and Skenes are probably on the top-10 of Zips next-5 year projections as well.
Corrections: 6/15 = 40%, so that underscores that Eric seems to build in injury risk so that pitchers are dramatically underrepresented in the top 100.
Also, I wrote below that the Twins have 2 55’s. It’s actually the Rays who have a 60 and 2 55’s.
Pitching scouting is just hard in general because a pitcher can completely change their game so quickly. If a pitcher adds a new pitch or gets better command that can drastically change their performance in a short period of time.
There are two parts of this. First: Eric is generally a much tougher grader than other prospect writers and is especially tough on pitchers. IMO this is a case of double-penalties where the FV value system penalizes pitchers *and* Eric knocks half a grade off of every pitcher anyway.
Two: projecting pitchers is super hard. There are a lot of elite pitchers who were first round picks but it is totally normal to have a ton of great pitchers who were not highly touted. I first noticed this back when Chris Archer and Corey Kluber were two of the better starters.
Where are these grades coming from? From their initial grades right after they were drafted? Because from their 2021 Top 100 list you can see Skubal on there as a 60FV. In the 2020 list he was a 50FV. He wasn’t even listed as a 35+ in the 2019 list.
I don’t think there’s any problem with Skubal’s initial rating or really any longshot prospect rating. Predicting any pitcher’s value is difficult. His teammate Mize was the #1 overall pick and he has outperformed him. Skubal was hurt in college and his first stint in pro ball he threw 80% fastballs. He has had a questionable history and repertoire and it took him being established at each level to prove people wrong. His whole success was based on if he could get away with throwing a fastball as often as he did. And since his debut he added 2.5mph which puts him as the 5th hardest throwing starter in the game. Absolutely nobody could have reasonably predicted this success from a 9th round prospect.
fantastic stuff, dan!
This is the kind of quality content that makes FG the wonderful place that it is!
Noah Shultz is their recent clone. He could be a good one.
Crochet now leads MLB in fWAR and trails only Lugo in bWAR. He and Skubal both have 2.5 years of control remaining. A month ago, I thought Cease’s return or slightly better would be fair for Crochet. Now that he’s had 5 dominant starts since then, I’m thinking an FV60 and FV55 is achievable.
The Dodgers have 2 55’s in DePaula and Ryan. The Padres have Salas (60) and Devries (50). Orioles have Basallo (60) and Mayo (55). Twins have a couple 55’s.
In my head I assign outsized value to salas because of positional scarcity–would truly be a crazy preller move
I get the positional scarcity and the age, but considering how poorly he’s hit this year, I think there’s a very real chance that he completely flames out.
I don’t think either is going to bring quite that much. A 55 and a couple 40+ seems about right. Maybe they’ll get a crazy overpay, I guess we’ll see!
To be clear, I think that valuation is reasonable. I just don’t see anyone meeting the ask. Dodgers and O’s have a fairly long track record of not trading their best prospects, Twins got burned the last time they traded for pitching and aren’t in desperate need. Padres certainly do have a track record, so maybe?
Skubal absolutely should. Crochet no only because he’s already surpassed his single season high in innings going back to high school.
The wild card is that he’s barely pitched so his innings limit is super low. So the Dodgers and Orioles are not trading that for Crochet but you can never count out Preller to make a big splash. The Braves are the other team who would be willing to take that risk, but they don’t have the same caliber of prospect as Salas.
Yankees dodged a bullet when Snell didn’t accept their contract offer. Yikes.
Sitting out spring training killed him.
Listening to Scott Boras killed him. Biggest loser in the off season was Scott Boras.
I have egg on my face as a Yankee fan. I wanted them to sign Snell…whew !!
I assume I’m not the only one that saw Wilmer FLores and assumed that hitter Wilmer had gotten beaten up in a mop-up position player appearance and Dan was throwing him in as a joke
(FWIW, Flores has never made it to the mound in his 12 years in the majors)
I realize that ZiPS doesn’t have a lot of data to go on with Skenes, that there is significant injury risk with any pitcher, and that he pitches for a franchise that has historically bad luck. That being said, give me the over on 12.1 WAR the next 5 years.
I hate to say it, so I’m not going to outright; but, there’s a high chance that one thing happens to him. The thing that happens to a lot of guys these days.
A little surprised Jared Jones is not on this list of movers.
Luis Gil, too
What great names in those comps! Max Lanier, Johnny Antonelli, Charlie Root! A festival of good-but-not-great hurlers.
Montgomery has been bad and still has CC Sabathia as a comp. I wouldn’t have expected CC as a comp even before the season. I’m a Chris Sale for HoF guy and even I’m floored by those comps.
Imagine the White Sox rotation: Garret Crochet, Erick Fedde, Dylan Cease, Reynaldo Lopez, and Lance Lynn..
That would easily be the best rotation in MLB!
And rather than being the worst team they would instead be….. the 3rd worst…
[face palm]
Since you guys are going to ask a lot about the other gaienrs for sure, let’s just go on a big ol’ list.
Soriano, Blanco, Gray, JJones, Yamamoto, Dees, Wheeler, Irvin, Flaherty, Tyler Anderson, Turnbull, Gil, Crawford, Kikuchi, Gilbert, Keller, Pennington, Quantrill, Gore, Cortes, Webb, Fedde, Gibson, Eovaldi, Yariel, Morton, Lively, Jh Diaz, Irvin, Trevor Williams, Rodon, Weaver, Pena, Littell, Clase, Ryan, Urena, Troy Miller, Dedniel Nunez, Poteet, Rea, Booser, Koenig, Lynn, Estrada, Jax, Woo, Nick Martinez, Coulombe, Kirby, Spiers, Jason Alexander, Kelly, Darvish, Criswell, Jay, Miller, Fried, Weathers, Schmidt, Burr, Cease, Stone, Severino
I haven’t filtered out the fringey minor leaguers in that list. A number project to be below replacement still.
Really surprised Skenes is on this list, but Jared Jones isn’t. What am I missing?
The full list that Dan posted directly before your comment.
Save for a handful of appearances Misiorowski and the strike zone have only a passing acquaintance. Wish the young man the best in his journey towards greater command as he certainly has time. Doesn’t change that seeing Van Poppel as the top comp elicited quite the heavy sigh.
I have a very hard time seeing him as a starter, even as a five and five. I suppose anything is possible if Jordan Hicks is a starter—maybe if the Brewers take a couple ticks off of his fastball he will have better command? They will keep him as a starter just to give him more reps but I think he’s probably going to be an elite reliever. The comps here (some good, some not) are guys like Alex Reyes, Adam Ottavino, Trevor Megill, and Dellin Betances.
Happy to see Glasnow on this list.
“I’m also not convinced that signing so late in the winter can still be used as a viable justification. ”
It can and should be for both Monty and Snell.
McKenzie is pitching through a torn elbow ligament. Can’t believe his agent allowed him to be sent down.
I kinda expected a few Nats on this list. Irvin’s particularly. I wonder where they rank?
I should have read the comments first.
I believe if Trevor Williams had stayed healthy, he would have made the top10 here if not the top 5. I’m looking eagerly for his return.