Postseason Preview: The 2019 World Series
On May 23, the Washington Nationals lost a matinee to the Mets in heartbreaking fashion, taking a lead 4-3 with a three-run eighth inning only to give up three runs of their own in the bottom of the frame. The loss dropped the Nationals to 19-31, a whopping 10 games back of the division-leading Phillies. They had been outscored by 40 runs on the season, and Dave Martinez’s seat was getting hot in only his second year as manager.
On Tuesday night, the Nationals will play in the World Series. It’s a change in fortune so extreme that it begs for explanation, and at first glance the explanation is easy. The Nationals have star power but lack depth, the exact kind of team “built for October.” Their starting lineup and top four starting pitchers are phenomenal; the less said about the backups and bullpen, the better. The kind of Nationals team losing 6-4 on a Tuesday afternoon in Queens is simply not the same team playing now.
That’s a convenient explanation, but it’s also wrong. Stephen Strasburg threw seven innings that day, and no regular had the day off. Wander Suero was the only reliever to pitch, and he wasn’t one of the relievers who weighed the Nationals down this year; he had a 4.54 ERA and 3.07 FIP over 71.1 innings, a solid season for a middle reliever.
No, the Nationals sent out their best, their co-ace starter backed by the A-squad, and they lost to a Mets team playing Adeiny Hechavarría, Carlos Gómez, and Juan Lagares all at once. That same team survived the Brewers, outlasted the Dodgers, and walked all over the Cardinals on their way to the first World Series appearance in franchise history. The convenient story isn’t always the right one. Washington simply started playing better.
After that bleak day in May, the Nations went 74-38 to finish the regular season. They outscored their opponents by 189 runs, scoring the most runs in the National League and allowing the third-least. The talent at the top of the roster shone through; the combined brilliance of Strasburg, Max Scherzer, Anthony Rendon, Juan Soto, and all the rest was so great that no amount of bullpen incompetence or lack of bench depth (36-year-old Howie Kendrick played the second-most innings at third base for them this year) could hold the team down.
Shockingly, that 74-38 record wasn’t the best in baseball. The Houston Astros, their World Series opponents, went 74-37 over the same stretch, a scant half-game ahead. They scored four fewer runs than the Nationals and allowed one more. The two hottest teams in baseball are facing off in the World Series, and if you don’t think about it too literally, you could even say they’re constructed from the same blueprint.
The Do-Everything Third Baseman
Anthony Rendon and Alex Bregman have such similar games that I wrote an article about it before the season started. They’re both having their best seasons this year, and each of them does everything well. Impressed by Rendon’s 12.4% walk rate and 13.3% strikeout rate? Wait until you see Bregman’s comical 17.2% walk rate and 12% strikeout rate.
Like Bregman’s .592 slugging percentage, the seventh-best mark in baseball? Rendon’s .598 places him fifth. Do you enjoy Rendon’s slick defensive play at third base, all soft hands and cannon arm? Bregman looks great out there himself, and he filled in at shortstop throughout the season when Carlos Correa missed time.
The biggest way the two players differ is in their public personas. Rendon comes across as preternaturally calm, the kind of person who might, after a particularly rough day at work, frown slightly. Bregman seems to exult in playing the heel, flexing and posing for the camera in the dugout after his heroics. Both are a joy to watch, and both are coming into the World Series at the peak of their powers, with excellent postseason offensive numbers to back up their MVP-level regular seasons.
The Number One Overall Pick Hurler
Gerrit Cole is the Platonic ideal of an ace. He throws literally 100 miles an hour, breaks off curveballs that make you question physics, and pairs his top-notch arsenal with a bulldog demeanor on the mound. Watch Cole, and you immediately understand why he’s great; you might even wonder how people ever square him up.
Stephen Strasburg will likely finish second in Cy Young voting, behind only Jacob deGrom. He’s having perhaps his finest year, impressive for someone who has compiled 36.7 WAR in his career. He doesn’t inspire awe in quite the same way as Cole, but he’s an absolute artist on the mound, with a gorgeous curveball and lethal changeup that combine to carve batters up.
Not too long ago, both of them could have been considered disappointments. Cole never quite made good on his promise while he was a Pirate; his stellar 2015 was more exception than rule. His trade to the Astros was significant, but not because he was the best pitcher in baseball; it was because everyone wanted to see what the Astros could do to transform a pitcher with Cole’s raw stuff.
Strasburg was the game’s most heralded pitching prospect. He arrived in the major leagues fully formed, striking out 14 in seven dominant innings in his first start. He signed a $175 million contract with the Nationals, and has had an ERA above 3.5 only twice in his 10 major league seasons (3.6 and 3.74). And yet, it always felt like there was more in the tank. Before 2019, he’d only made 30 starts in a season twice, and he only managed 130 innings in an injury-shortened 2018.
After the seasons Cole and Strasburg put together, no one’s doubting them anymore. Cole is a free agent after the season, and Strasburg could join him if he opts out of his current contract. They’ll be the two most sought-after pitchers on the market, and they’re both entering the World Series in the midst of dominant postseasons; Strasburg has thrown 22 innings with a 1.64 ERA, while Cole has a 0.40 ERA in 22 and two-thirds innings of his own.
The Former Tiger Cy Young Winner
Max Scherzer might go down in history as the best free agent pitcher signing of all time. His worst season out of his five with the Nationals was worth 5.6 WAR, and he’s won two Cy Young Awards to pair with the one he won in Detroit. The next season he has an ERA above 3.00 for the Nationals or strikes out less than 30% of the batters he faces will be his first.
For his part, Justin Verlander might go down in history as the best waiver-deadline trade acquisition of all time. He may not win a Cy Young this year due to the brilliance of his own teammate, and he was denied last year by Blake Snell, but it’s hard to overstate how impressive he’s been with the Astros. When Houston traded for him, the general consensus was that he was a decent pitcher with an overpriced contract. A year later, the Astros signed him to an extension with a higher yearly value.
Both Scherzer and Verlander have been among the game’s very best for a decade, including five years when they overlapped in Detroit. They’ll both be interesting test cases in what it means to have a Hall of Fame career as a starting pitcher; both have the hardware and rate statistics that make them unquestionably belong, but both lack the counting stats that we associate with the Hall. A World Series title for Scherzer, or a second for Verlander, would be a feather in their eventual candidacy’s cap.
The Former Diamondback Who Is Really Good But Not As Good As The Other Guys
When Bryce Harper reached free agency last year, you could have called it the end of an era in Washington. The only National ever to win an MVP award was headed out of town, and the team would have to find a way to replace him. Their plan, as it turned out, was to already have three good outfielders and use the payroll space Harper had occupied to sign Patrick Corbin.
Corbin was tremendous in 2018 for Arizona, and even if you thought he’d never replicate those numbers again, he represented the best pitcher available in free agency. The Nationals brought him in to be an absurdly overqualified third starter (he finished fifth in Cy Young voting in 2018!), and he delivered. His 2019 couldn’t quite match his 2018, but it was still one of the 25 or so best pitching seasons in baseball this year, exactly what the Nationals needed to turn their rotation from a strength into a seemingly unfair advantage.
The Astros must have liked what the Nationals did in signing Corbin, because they brought in their own Diamondback at the trade deadline this year. Zack Greinke, Corbin’s teammate in the desert, isn’t quite at his peak anymore; he’d been good but inconsistent since signing with Arizona in 2016. Probably 25 teams in baseball would be happy to have him as their best pitcher — in Houston, he slots in a comfortable third, which is a preposterous thing to say about someone worth 5.4 WAR this year.
The Lefty Wunderkind
Juan Soto burst onto the national radar this postseason with his delightful antics at the plate and timely hitting against the Brewers, but he’s been excellent for two years now. He’ll turn 21 this Friday, which means that he’ll be legally allowed to drink champagne alongside his teammates if the Nationals prevail, and all he’s done before his 21st birthday is bat .287/.403/.535 with 56 home runs in around 1000 PA. The list of hitters as good as Soto at such a young age is basically comprised of Hall of Famers.
The list of the best hitters 22 and under in 2019, though, doesn’t have Soto at the top. Yordan Alvarez, the Astros rookie, sits there, with a ridiculous 178 wRC+ over nearly 400 plate appearances. Alvarez spent the first part of the season in the minor leagues, which kept him from qualifying for the batting title, but he hit .343/.443/.742 in Triple-A before being called up and .313/.412/.655 in the majors. He’s had a quiet postseason, but he’s a fearsome hitter. Expect to see a lot of off-day appearances from Patrick Corbin to face Alvarez, because the Nationals aren’t exactly flush with lefty specialists.
…
That’s a fun way to look at this series; the two hottest teams in baseball, constructed in an eerily similar way, are facing off for all the marbles. That would be the wrong takeaway, though. The teams might have a lot of similarities, but they have even more differences. The Astros are startlingly deep; we haven’t even talked about José Altuve, George Springer, Yuli Gurriel, or Carlos Correa yet. The Nationals get strong production from their lineup even aside from Rendon and Soto; Howie Kendrick is having a postseason to remember and Trea Turner is relatively unheralded but excellent. Heck, Victor Robles was supposed to be the breakout Nationals prospect before Soto blew up, and he’s having a solid year as well.
The Astros have a deep bullpen that compiled a 3.75 ERA this season, and they’re so confident in it (or nervous about their fourth starter, Jose Urquidy) that they threw a bullpen game against the Yankees on Saturday. The Nationals are using their ace starters wherever possible in relief, which should tell you everything you need to know about their bullpen; Dave Martinez trusts Sean Doolittle and Daniel Hudson, but that’s about it.
The arbitrary endpoints also blur the story in the Nationals’ favor. Yes, both teams have played at a 107 win pace since late May. The difference is that the Astros were already 15 games over .500 before May 23, while the Nationals were 12 games under. It’s not even fair to call what the Astros did a 107 win pace; they actually won 107 games this year, while the Nationals won 93.
The Astros and the Nationals are both deserving league champions. They have star power to burn and some fun superficial similarities that will make for wonderful stories throughout the series. But make no mistake: the Astros are the favorites. Convenient framing and selective use of statistics makes them sound like peers, but that’s not the case. ZiPS gives the Astros a 59.7% chance of raising another flag to fly forever.
For the Nationals, a 40% chance of winning the World Series must sound pretty good. We only gave them a 22.2% chance of making the playoffs at their lowest point. For the Astros, a 60% chance of winning the World Series sounds like business as usual. They were the best team in baseball by acclamation before the year, and they’ve held serve so far. The World Series should be excellent, and it should be close, and Houston will likely prevail, even if I picked the Nationals to win it all before the postseason started. Here’s to a great series!
Ben is a writer at FanGraphs. He can be found on Bluesky @benclemens.
Does anyone expect Strasburg to actually start game 1? All indications are that Schezer will start game 1 and Stras game 2…. It’d be nice to see the ZIPS projections for that scenario.
Also, don’t think Stras has a chance to finish 2nd in the Cy Young. That’ll probably be Ryu. Stras might finish 4th(Flaherty with his final half of the season has a real chance to finish 3rd).
I would be extremely surprised if Ryu or Flaherty finished ahead of Strasburg. They simply didn’t accumulate the value he did—-they didn’t approach his volume, and they were comparable on a rate basis, independent of park and defense—-Stras led league in IP, was 2nd in Ks to DeGrom, first in NL in Ws (I know, I know, but there remain dumb Win-centric voters), and then he was superior to Ryu and Flaherty in FIP and xFIP. He beats out everybody except DeGrom and Scherzer in both bWAR and fWAR I believe. He finished first in NL—indeed, ahead of DeGrom—in WARP for those who like that. Not as many folks vote solely based on ERA, which is basically what you would have to do to elevate Ryu and Flaherty ahead of Strasburg. IMO Scherzer is the only person I can see an argument for *possibly* finishing second, just due to his excellence in overall value and rate stats…..but I still think Strasburg is the fairly easy choice for 2nd after DeGrom (who is the easy choice for 1st.)
except that traditional voters don’t really see it the way you talk about… Voters don’t look at things like that at all…
You can down vote me all you want. By the Tango tracker- which values what voters actually care about:
de Grom 83.5
Ryu 74.6
Flaherty 72.3
Strasburg 70.6
To act like voters don’t vote based off of ERA is frankly ignorant. Far more of them do so than don’t. You can have a conversation about should they or shouldn’t they- but reality is that they do.
Just look at last season. A major reason why Snell beat Verlander was ERA being 0.63 better than Verlander. Even though Verlander had better FIP and more innings and more strikeouts.
Dude relax. You don’t need to throw a fit and call people ignorant. Just pointing out that the voting pool is increasingly progressive each year and that Ryu/Flaherty’s case is tied solely to one stat, with disadvantages in basically all others. It’s not a slam dunk prediction wise. At one point people only looked at Ws, then they looked mostly at ERA, and they’re tending to look at more things now. What you say is certainly possible….I just think there are probably enough older folks who think “18 wins!” and enough younger folks who think “superior in all categories but one!” But I mean, we’ll see. I certainly think if you’re going to be better in one category, ERA is the best one to do it in.
I just don’t think voters have moved off of ERA anywhere near as much as you think they have. last year with deGrom was ALL about ERA. Last year with Snell was ALL about ERA. 2017 Kluber was ALL about ERA. Arrieta/Greinke over Kershaw 2015- ALL about ERA.
I would also argue that the voting pool hasn’t gotten increasingly progressive this decade. You say King Felix. Well yeah he won, but he also led the league in ERA by 0.45 over Price who finished 2nd.
Looking this decade, only once did the Cy Young winner have an ERA 1/3 of a run or worse than the runner up. 2016 Scherzer over Lester.
Good for you, steve. You’re right and you’re right. I didn’t upvote because i’d prefer the minuses for your intelligent comments show what kind of a crowd we have here. If you’d prefer upvotes, lemme know.
I just think too often in here folks talk like how it should be done and not how it is in reality. Sorry but a guy with an ERA a full run behind Ryu just about has no chance of finishing ahead of him.. WAR, FIP, etc. are great- but to a majority of award voters- it’s utterly meaningless. If award voters mirrored what we hear on the MLB network- I’d have a different opinion. It’s not though.
I think that the problem here, steve, is that the majority of fangraphs readers want to have their own cy young and mvp voting and then decry the actual results, and they don’t like the fact that you’re jumping the gun and discussing what you think the actual results will be.
I think it’s they want the voting to go their way, and when it doesn’t, they want to decry it….
I just think when you have a writer here say that Strasburg is the likely 2nd place guy in the award- it takes it too far. Could he finish 2nd? Maybe. But historcially, that’s just not been the case at all.. I don’t know too many folks that would say it’s a likely right now. Also, have to remember the postseason doesn’t count one iota.
I don’t think that the issue is that the people downvoting you want the cy young voting to go their way. I think the issue is that they are focusing on demonstrating that they know more about baseball than people who don’t read fangraphs to the extent that they aren’t carefully reading what you are writing, they are assuming that you are defending the use of era in determining the cy young winner, and so they are downvoting you to demonstrate to themselves that they are more knowledgeable than you are.
I think it was the Wins… which is even worse. I think you could blame FG too as he was their guy. The FG guy wins every time right? The Cy Young race is super messed up in this era.
actually it’s pretty easy. Go look at ERA and it’ll tell you a lot about the race…. Wins a bit if they have 20 or more. Innings really only as a disqualifier if they don’t have at least 180.
So you’re saying awards voters are too advanced to decide based on Wins (I agree…see DeGrom last year)…..but…. they’re *not advanced enough* to look beyond just the single stat of ERA? Cant say I agree with that take. Maybe a few people vote like that, but IP, Ks, FIP, and increasingly, WAR seem to matter to many voters/writers/folks you see talking on MLB Network etc. about this stuff, especially since they’ve opened up voting to non old school types. But I mean, we’ll see. My personal guess is 1. DeGrom 2. Stras 3. Scherzer 4. Ryu 5. Corbin/Buehler/Gray……something like that.
deGrom’s win had EVERYTHING though to do with ERA. If his ERA was at 2.25 instead of 1.70- he would have had a whole hell of a lot tougher chance to win…
Also, using MLB network analsyts as logic for this is a joke. They are as much advanced metrics folks as you can see. But they aren’t the electorate.
Jayson Stark’s ballot from last month should give you pause….
1 deGrom
2 Sonny Gray
3 Flaherty
4 Scherzer
5 Ryu
More specifically his HR rate. That is what fueled his ERA. It has proven to be unsustainable which is beautiful.
I think pitcher wins have been demonized (appropriately) enough that it has seeped into the minds of a large majority of voters. And while they may look at other stats, as you mention, I do think a lot of voters still value ERA, possibly more so than they should.
I think where wins come into play is like last season’s AL where Snell got 20. But if it’s something like 18 vs 14- it’s just not that big of a deal….
Chaz, steve is giving specific data regarding past cy young votes in support of his argument while you aren’t. Can you?
Do award voters really care a flip about FIP?
not most of them.
I think the danger we see here is that folks here listen to MLB Network and think that’s the electorate. But it’s really not. Last year the most advanced metrics electorate had only I think 13/30 voters. With several of the award votes only having 8-9 voters out of the 30.
I think voters mostly just read what FG has to say. Evidence points that direction. That is to say that they are using FG WAR I imagine.
There is also a social-psychological aspect to it. Reading fangraphs makes you feel like you’re more serious and intelligent than the average baseball fan. Many readers don’t care about this but many readers do. I teach in a university and it’s the same phenomenon, many people hang around universities or even make a career in a university largely because it makes them feel like they are more intelligent than other people. Many fangraphs readers think that the only point in mentioning ERA in a fangraphs post is to say that it’s stupid so that you can demonstrate that you’ve gone beyond that intellectual stage; if you mention for any other reason, like Steve did here, you get downvoted. It’s the same thing with for example Trump in universities–if you mention Trump in a university lecture in any context other than say how awful he is, some people will go ballistic.
Scherzer is starting Game 1. They haven’t announced it officially but reading tea leaves from Nats beat reporters and Rizzo…..its going to be Max, Stras, Corbin. Strasburg is the better pitcher right now overall, but I suppose there is an argument to be made that Astros lineup is fairly RHH, and Scherzer has less balanced splits than SS. Also game theory to consider regarding maybe Nats—even if they think Strasburg is their best starter at this moment—that beating Cole is almost impossible right now. My own perspective is that while Cole has the distinct advantage over Max in Game 1, that Strasburg has an excellent chance to out-duel Verlander in Game 2, even with Astros superior offense—so Nats starters obviously with a tougher task.
Strasburg was better down the stretch when Scherzer struggled, but I don’t really agree he is a better pitcher overall.
I think Stras might be better as of this moment. Please look at Scherzer’s monthly splits. He was a wreck after his injury. It is clear as day. Maybe he is good now, but I think it is more likely that Max is on the decline than that he has gotten back to being the best pitcher in the NL which he was before he got hurt.
I think he’s finally back to being healthy. His last 2 starts pretty darn special- 14 ip with 5 hits, 5 walks, but 18 k’s. 1 run given up. Have to remember for Scherzer- he missed all that time in August- so right now he’s where normal pitchers are innings wise in early to mid September.
“The Nationals are using their ace starters wherever possible in relief, which should tell you everything you need to know about their bullpen” In the NLCS it was 1/3 of an inning from Corbin and that’s it, right? I doubt we see anything but some Corbin out of the pen for a single lefty out this series. And, in a potential game 7, I could see Scherzer coming out of the bullpen.
The NLCS only went four games and the starting rotation was just absolutely dominant. They pitched well and deep. Davey Martinez had no reason to pitch his starters in relief.
Should the WS play out differently (and it likely will) we’ll see more games with bullpen strategies similar to the NLDS.
Not really though. the LDS sets itself up for pitching guys in relief. Best of 7 series really don’t.
The 2018 Red Sox disagree. Anyway, I do think the only starter you will see out of pen in a pre elimination game scenario is Corbin for Alvarez (watching him in ALCS, he seems frankly designed to wave over Corbin’s slider.)
The only 2 starters that they used out of the pen- David Price(in the marathon) and Chris Sale(to close out game 5). I guess Eduardo Rodriguez who had thrown 1/3 inning in game 3 as well(but there again due to the Marathon was only reason he started).
It is better to use the entire post-season as a reference for starter use out of the bullpen. In 2018 all of the Red Sox starters worked at least once in relief during the the three series. I wonder how many remember that Sale pitched the 8th in Game 4 of the ALDS against the Yankees as well as closing out the WS Eovaldi started in the ALDS and then started and relieved in the ALCS then was used in relief in the WS. Porcello appeared in relief twice , Price once and Rodriguez several times before starting in Game 4 of the WS.
What’s going on with the minuses here?? Are there a lot of first-timers here because of the world series?
Narratives are powerful and people don’t like it when they get contradicted.
“What’s going on with the minuses here??”
When 19 of 71 comments are by the same person, it tends to get irritating.
And Chazf has 17 posts in the same thread. Is there a problem with that as well?? Or is it just that you don’t like what I’m saying?
Yes but steve was getting downvoted from the instant he started commenting. That doesn’t normally happen here.
Its not exactly the WS – this happens quite a bit. Whenever an article starts to trend I imagine.
There is a World Series effect though. People pop in who haven’t been on Fangraphs before. I suspect there are a lot of Nats’ fans who haven’t been here much before. What’s weird is that steve is a Nats’ fan himself and he’s getting downvoted.
Not such a big difference for innings, but a huge difference in ERA
Nats NLDS average starter outing: 6 IP, ERA 2.63
Nats NLCS average starter outing: 6.4 IP, ERA 1.40
Nats NLDS average innings from starters from the pen: 0.6, ERA 18
Nats NLCS average innings from starters from the pen: 0.1, ERA 0
Which makes his point true. These teams aren’t going bullpen games if they have a choice. That narrative has played itself out for this year.
lol I think you see what you want sometimes. Bullpens have not been a critical part of either one of these teams success. The teams that have abused their staffs are out.
Well this is wildly misleading:
“That’s a convenient explanation, but it’s also wrong…..That same team survived the Brewers, outlasted the Dodgers, and walked all over the Cardinals on their way to the first World Series appearance in franchise history. The convenient story isn’t always the right one. Washington simply started playing better.”
So…here’s what actually happened. During the 19-31 opening stretch, Rendon, Soto, Turner, Zimmerman (IOW the 1, 3, 4, and 5 hitters), and Anibal Sánchez all spent time on the IL or missed significant time. The team turned around the week Rendon returned and Turner came back from a broken finger he suffered in opening series of year. To say “the same team” “simply started playing better” at a 110 win clip for 5 months and then killed it in the playoffs because you picked a single game they lost where the regulars were back and Strasburg started is…..WILDLY misleading.
The truth is the Nats started the year thoroughly hobbled by any standard. Now, does a deeper team that is less top heavy survive that stretch better than 19-31? Of course they do. But the team you’re seeing right now is not the team that went 19-31. Beginning with Turner’s HBP on Day 2, they got pretty clobbered by 2 months of high impact injuries.
which coincided with the toughest part of the schedule for the entire season.
True. Forgot to mention that (although you could argue September was hardest.) But, again, these two factors—injuries and schedule—suggest the “they simply started playing better” is not the correct thesis at all.
Hmmm…I don’t know.
Turner was hurt most of that time
Sanchez only missed about 1.5 starts
Soto missed 10 games
Rendon missed 14 games
Zimmerman had negative WAR so I’m not sure his loss mattered much.
All in all, it doesn’t seem to me that the Nats had any sort of extraordinary injury issues. I’ll bet that if we went team by team, we could find similar injury issues on just about every other team. It’s certainly not enough to explain such a dramatic turnaround.
part of the problem is that for a period there from Apr 26-May 10- you had all 3 of them gone(Turner, Soto, Rendon) for part of it- 2 of 3 for some of it. And they go 4-11 in those games.
So how would the Astros do if Bregman, Altuve, and Springer were out like that?
Correa, Altuve, and Springer were all out together(as well as backup IF), and Alvarez was still in minors for a decent portion of it from late May to late June. Astros were 13-6 in those games.
Stros are a much deeper team. I think everyone agrees they are better set up to deal with injuries. They are ALSO a better team when everyone is healthy. But neither of these is relevant to why the Nats were able to turn around to post a nearly identical win/loss after that point.
I think that would be obvious. The data is cherry picked to include when the Nationals were red hot, and exclude when they played poorly. One could easily look at after July 26 when Correa returned, and see that Astros finished season on a pace 12 wins greater over a full season than the Nationals.
I don’t really think you can be “red hot” for 5 months/120 games. That term really suggests they’ve been playing at an unsustainable clip given their talent level. I think this Nats team—when 95% healthy and not having to test their terrible* position player depth or rely on some of the worst relief pitchers in baseball for high leverage innings, as they did for the first two months (Rosenthal, Barraclough, etc)—are, while plainly not as good as the Astros, are in fact a 95-100 win team…add in a few lucky one run wins and you’ve got your Astros-like clip. On the other hand, the collection of talent on the field for those two months was probably the talent level—when u consider the injuries and the hideous players they threw out there, and the injured/diminished PLAY of folks like Sanchez—of a barely below .500 team, and they probably had 3-4 one run games blown by said hideous relievers and got unlucky, so 23-27 becomes 19-31. But i mean….we’re not talking about the same dudes playing like the Tigers then playing like the Astros (as the article suggested)….the wild swing in data simply supports a change in the underlying talent on the field (and…there was a considerable change in the talent actually playing on the field….like….****the idea that 1/3 of your games Rendon and Soto are out, then 100% of your games Turner is out and Sanchez is either pitching hurt or out, and you’ve got literal statistical anomaly “search for infinity ERA” relievers like Rosenthal flipping games to Ls….that that isn’t going to slam your first couple months given ur sub replacement AAA backups….I don’t get it. This all seems obvious to me. This was not just statistical variation or something. The personnel changed.
I didn’t say the Nationals were red hot for 5 months. It looks like they were red hot for about 30 games or so (about a 115-win pace). After that stretch, Nationals played at a 100-win pace. While that is great, it isn’t nearly identical to the pace Astros were playing.
So yes, the data is cherry-picked to include the best from the Nationals and exclude when they played poorly while not doing the same for the Astros.
“And they go 4-11 in those games.”
Which means they were 15-20 in the other “first 50 games”. Which is far, far, far worse than 74-38.
Another way to look at it. They lost about 70 games from Turner, Rendon, and Soto during that span. 70 games lost by those 3 players is worth about 2-3 WAR. Which means they would have been about 21-29 or 22-28 had those 3 been healthy.
See my above comment at top (sorry…misplaced it). I would just add that the Nats also got historically*** hideous bullpen work during these two months. And no, it didn’t improve a LOT, but it did go from “this is so bad that nobody has ever seen anything like this, with Trevor Rosenthal and Barraclough not being able to record an out and blowing like 4 run leads…to…oh, a refreshing, merely 4.5-5.00 bullpen ERA! once they got rid of those dudes.
Sanchez was pitching hurt until he went on the IL. Had an ERA of like 5. Came back and has been like sub-3 ever since. and again, top heavy team with no depth can easily be worse than what you’d calculate with WAR, particularly if its all at once. Add in that they were throwing super high leverage innings of Rosenthal and Barraclough who were their big off-season acquisitions and they blew like 4-5 games on their own, and there u go.
Listen. I watched every game because i have problems…..the Nats had a collision of minor injuries but all at the same time, plus a tough part of schedule, and it snowballed. Talking about WAR for certain players and how other teams fared with similar injuries just doesn’t capture the situation….the Nats are extremely top heavy with depth problems. They had Wilmer Difo and a not-ready-at-all Carter Kieboom playing SS for 2 months, plus people like Andrew Stevenson and other horrible backups….these are worse than replacement level players…I assure you. It was a combo of things—injuries, schedule, lack of depth, and yes….some bad play too…..all I’m saying is to say that the Nats basically just suddenly started playing bette with no real explanation is simple nonsense. They got totally healthy, got into a better part of the schedule, and took off.
Needless to say, tomorrow they begin the very toughest part of their schedule.
Sorry but I will continue to disagree. The Indians are also top-heavy with little depth. They were also devastated by injuries. They had to use lots of players that were replacement level or worse. Jose Ramirez was useless for much of the season. Trevor Bauer didn’t come close to repeating his 2018 magic. 37% of their games were started by guys who were complete nobodies (Rodriguez, Plutko, Plesac, and Civale). Etc, etc, etc. And yet they NEVER went 19-31 over a 50 game stretch or anywhere close to that.
The pluses of playing in the putrid AL Central.
Did the Astros say if they’re going to play Alvarez in the field in Washington? That seems like a rather crucial decision for this series.
Well Game 3 will be Corbin, who is murder on Lefties. I highly doubt the Astros will stuff Alvarez into the field for that opportunity. Sanchez in Game 4 and Max in Game 5…..definitely possible….I imagine that he would have to start looking a bit better at the plate early in the WS for them to deal with him as a defensive liability. As of now, why would you do so when he’s looked so lost against Yankees pitchers who are inferior to what he’s going to see vs DC?
Should the Nats consider starting Corbin in game 1, then Max and Stras to maximize their change of winning game 2&3 ?
maximize their chance. They will get at least one guaranteed start. Seems like a good idea to avoid using your best starter against Cole at this point.
I agree with that, but I really don’t think it will happen. But I guess that is why they play the game. While Cole right now looks like the GOAT, I don’t think a solo shot or two off of him and Scherzer being dominate is too far out of the realm of possibility.
Re: Comparing Bregman vs. Rendon:
The biggest difference for me is that Bregman generally needs to pull the ball more to harness his power, whereas Rendon has easier power (i.e., more carry) to the gaps and center. They are both absurdly good at squaring up quality pitching.
That’s exactly right. I do think Bregman, due to age mostly, is *currently* the better defender and base runner by a hair—- Rendon has already gone from “basically the best 3B in baseball not named Arenado” to merely excellent as he entered his prime. I personally think right now Rendon is the *tougher out* (he has no weakness or hole in his swing and, much like Bregman, I’ve seriously never seen a player more incredible at somehow never chasing out of the zone)…..BUT if I needed DAMAGE, I would want Bregman up there. Rendon sprays more doubles all over the place while Bregman yanks more homers. But yeah I mean….when either of these guys makes poor contact, it’s borderline shocking. They just barrel every pitch they swing at. It’s truly extraordinary. Bregman will be a Hall of Famer. Rendon not sure…outside chance maybe. He would have to age really gracefully (totally possibly given his skill set.)
“Strasburg was the game’s most heralded pitching prospect. He arrived in the major leagues fully formed, striking out 14 in seven scoreless innings in his first start.”
Strasburg did strike out 14 batters in 7 innings, but he also gave up 2 runs on four hits including one home run. This is one of the top 5 most famous games in Nats history, so not really just a gotcha fact check. It was a big game.
https://www.fangraphs.com/wins.aspx?date=2010-06-08&team=Nationals&dh=0
That’s my bad, and I’ve updated the article to reflect it.
I was at the sold out game. Crowd was electric. Definitely a formative moment in the Nats narrative: ie Tanking is over.
alas he got hurt 2 months later…. which allowed them to finish getting the #6 pick in 2011. Which was some guy named Rendon.
Totally agree. The first game at Nats Park to ever have a postseason atmosphere. (That includes opening night.)
The Nats weren’t tanking. They just stunk.
they sure looked like they tanked….. And if they weren’t tanking, the results led to the tanking revolution.
this game brings back all the “should they shut him down” narrative that was so big back then.
something else I find interesting, the matchup contains the best pitching and the best hitting free agent heading into the offseason.
has that ever happened? There was the article going over how rare Cole’s situation is, but Rendon is a top MVP candidate, also in his late twenties, could also win a ring.
Looking pretty impressive for you to have picked the nats to go all the way this year. I started writing that i think they’ll win this year after game 2 against the dodgers.
Even as a Nats fan, I think this task is too tall. Could absolutely happen. They’ve been that good for a while and Max and Stras (particularly Stras) have pitched out of their mind. I think Astros in 6 is a reasonable prediction (the current betting odds—biggest WS favorite since Red Sox-Rockies) seems too extreme to me. My one specific prediction about the WS I will make: I think for the Nats to win, Soto has to be a monster. I think if he slumps like he did vs Cards (where they didn’t need him, and it’s all good since he personally got them past WC game and LAD)…..they have no shot.
Where I’m excited as a nats fan is with Scherzer. Yes it took him a while to get back to good form. But he clearly in the last 2 starts was in good form…. And right now he’s got only 192.1 innings this year. That is way lower than he normally is at obviously.
That can be huge.
I’m not a nats fan and i think they’ll win. Not at all sure but i definitely have a feeling. Coming back not once but twice from a two-run deficit in the 8th inning of a must-win game loosens a team up and spooks its opponents. The astros haven’t looked awesome at all–if they had played the rays in an even-up series where morton could start twice the series might well have had a different ending, and they were outscored by the yankees but had two walkoff wins. And even aside from their brushes with death i think the nats are in a better psychological state–they’ve got a great combination of enough-experience-that-they-won’t-panic, they’ve-never-gotten-nearly-this-far-so-they-don’t-have-past-memories-of-choking-at this-stage, and they-haven’t-won-it-all-yet-so-they’re-still-hungry. The astros on the other hand mostly have won it all and may be complacent at the very end. This is really dating me but the general feeling reminds me of the 1971 series when the pirates beat the orioles. Of course this is all touchy feely but that’s what i feel.
Scherzer and Verlander are not going to be interesting test cases for HoF because they are going to be shoo-ins.
Three Cy-youngs is just going to be too many silverware for the voters to ignore and
Verlander is really on his way to be a inner-circle kind of guy.
Greinke might be a more interesting case, but he has been making it less interesting (by continuing to perform surprisingly well)
Re Nats pitching strategy….so….i think of the 4 Nats starters, Corbin is actually the best matchup for Astros (despite Stras pitching the best, given the RHH heavy Stros lineup, I like Max as the toughest for HOU bc he just kills righties, then Stras, then Sánchez), given Corbin is left handed and also he has seemed a bit fatigued perhaps due to irregular usage. So…… I personally would go with SANCHEZ in game 3 and corbin in 4. Not only how he has been pitching….but I kind of like Sanchez’s change of pace after top two guys a lot and frankly I would prefer him in a possible game 7 with corbin as a lefty relief option.
Here’s something crazy to consider. How many future Hall of Famers do you guys think will be playing in this World Series? Now granted, it’s mostly about this particular Astros team, but still, just consider……
Astros Likely HOFers: I feel like FOUR Astros are pretty solidly on a HOF track (Verlander, Greinke, Altuve, Bregman)
FOUR Astros with Outside Chance, but still realistic possibility: Springer, Correa, Cole, Alvarez.
Nats Likely HOFers; Scherzer, Soto (yes, long way off, but if we consider other people with his production through ages 19-20 it’s expected barring injury I would say.)
Nats Outside Possibilities: Strasburg, Rendon (I think these two are roughly equal in likelihood.)
It is entirely possible there will be around TEN Hall of Famers in this World Series. INSANE.
Interested in others thoughts re above guesses/projections bc it’s a fun game.
3 I think are close to locks- Verlander, Greinke, and Scherzer…..
The others all have good chances but still a long ways to go.
Second that. Those 3 are locks. Rest are all up in the air, but Altuve has a good a shot as anyone except the 3 locks.
I think out of the 10 guys listed here, I’d put the over/under on future Hall-of-Famers at about six, with the three locks + Altuve getting there quick, plus 1 to 3 of the other six.
Then, you have to look at the outside chances of some others like Turner, Robles, Kyle Tucker, Osuna….who knows maybe even JOSH JAMES ;)… and I’ll go out on a limb and say there will be seven Hall of Famers from among these two teams. Just as likely to have ten HOFers as four of them.
I’d even put Rendon on about the same level as Altuve.
I’m not sure how close Greinke is to being a lock. I also think it makes sense to have more than two categories. I think Scherzer and Verlander are near-locks already. Even 2-3 mediocre seasons would make each an airtight lock. Greinke is the next closest. Everyone else has a lot of work to do. In some ways Soto has advantages (the supreme ability at age 19-20 mentioned). But Altuve and Rendon are closer as they’ve already booked a lot more. Strasburg is unlikely, Springer is a giant stretch, and Alvarez is painfully too early to say.
I’d set the over/under a bit lower. 5 or 5.5. Shit happens, man.
Greinke in the JAWS is right there already. He’s #2 in active pitchers- just behind Verlander. There’s only 5 guys in JAWS ahead of him that aren’t in the Hall of Fame. Roger Clemens and 4 guys that pitched in the 1800’s.
Greinke in Jaws 60.1. Verlander is 60.2.
saw it’s official- Scherzer game 1, Strasburg game 2.
Amazing how under the radar trea Turner still is. He had a fantastic season, despite missing some games, and he’s truly one of the most well rounded players in baseball right now. Yet his name is nary heard outside of Washington DC
yeah, and the amazing part of his season this year is that he did it, and he wasn’t really all that healthy this season.
Going to be strange for the World Series to see a team with not a single left handed pitcher on the roster in the Astros.
can’t believe the Astros are 1st WS team since 1903 to not have a single lhp on their pitching roster….
Your point about Bregman playing the heel make me laugh. I have never thought anything of him until lately and I totally agree with your assessment. He annoys me despite his baseball prowess. I hadn’t really thought about what it was but she does have some WWE in him.