2018 Trade Value: #11 to #20

Corey Kluber lurks menacingly… in the hearts of major-league batters!
(Photo: Erik Drost)

As is the annual tradition at FanGraphs, we’re using the week of the All-Star Game — while (some of) the industry pauses to take a metaphorical breather — to take stock of the top-50 trade assets in the sport. For more context on exactly what we’re trying to do here, see the honorable-mentions post linked at the top of the page.

For this post and the others in this series, I’ve presented a graphic (by way of the wizard Sean Dolinar) breaking down each player’s objective skill level (represented, in this case, by a five-year WAR projection from ZiPS), contract/team-control details, rank in last year’s series, and then year-by-year details of age/WAR/contract through 2023, although a couple players have control beyond those five years. For those readers who are partial to spreadsheets rather than blocks of text, I’ve also included all the players we’ve ranked so far are in grid format at the bottom of the post.

The ZiPS WAR forecasts did influence the rankings a bit: for players who were bunched together, it acted as an impartial tiebreaker of sorts, but the industry opinions I solicited drove the rankings.

With that said, let’s get to the next 10 spots on the Trade Value list this year.

Five-Year WAR +17.2
Guaranteed Dollars
Team Control Through 2024
Previous Rank
Year Age Projected WAR Contract Status
2019 22 +2.3 Pre-Arb
2020 23 +3.0 Pre-Arb
2021 24 +3.8 Arb1
2022 25 +4.0 Arb2
2023 26 +4.1 Arb3
Pre-Arb
Arb

Torres was our 12th-ranked prospect entering the year and, while that top tier has mostly stayed where they are (except for party-crashed Juan Soto), there’s been a shuffle of the name up top. Torres is one of the players to whom I refer in the introduction who wouldn’t have appeared on this list before the season began (although he would’ve been in the mix for an honorable mention) but whom it would be insane to exclude now. The difference? Just 63 big-league games. If Torres had no pedigree and was pulling some Shane Spencer or Bo Hart business, this wouldn’t be the case, as his age, pedigree, and track record have all suggested this sort of thing was on the table.

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Torres has about as much pedigree as possible, having been the top July 2nd prospect in his class when he was 16, a distinction he shared with White Sox RF Eloy Jimenez (among the honorable mentions), who also originally signed with the Cubs and was traded for pieces to win a title. We mentioned before the season that Torres had sneaky power that could emerge soon, but even we’re a little surprised it emerged this quickly. Here starts a run of low-service-time, big-upside bats who could trade spots over the next year just like those players at the top of this past winter’s prospect list.

Five-Year WAR +19.2
Guaranteed Dollars
Team Control Through 2024
Previous Rank
Year Age Projected WAR Contract Status
2019 20 +3.6 Pre-Arb
2020 21 +3.2 Pre-Arb
2021 22 +3.7 Arb1
2022 23 +4.2 Arb2
2023 24 +4.5 Arb3
Pre-Arb
Arb

If Torres’s emergence was somewhat surprising, Soto’s was outright shocking. Eric wrote recently about how little precedent there is for what Soto is doing and how quickly he’s doing it. We’ve had some sources tell us we had him too low in the winter at 50th on our top 100, but he entered the season with just 83 pro games and something short of elite pedigree, so we thought it was a little aggressive. Then we slotted him in the top 10 on the power of his outburst in the big leagues and some said we should have him even higher despite relatively modest speed and defensive ability.

It appears those most aggressive voices may be correct on Soto, as they were touching on the rareness of the bat and approach. It’s generally good prospecting business to stay skeptical of young hitters because, by definition, only a small collection will actually become generational type bats, but that’s on the table for Soto right now.

Five-Year WAR +18.3
Guaranteed Dollars
Team Control Through 2024
Previous Rank
Year Age Projected WAR Contract Status
2019 20 +2.0 Pre-Arb
2020 21 +2.9 Pre-Arb
2021 22 +3.9 Pre-Arb
2022 23 +4.4 Arb1
2023 24 +5.1 Arb2
Pre-Arb
Arb

The prospect parade continues with another Latin hitter who possesses about all the pedigree one can have. Vlad’s issue is obviously his precocious physicality and future defensive home, but he makes since next to Soto as both are mostly bat-first players in the long-term and Vlad has both a little more/cheaper control (depending on how Toronto uses him this summer) and a longer track record of glowing reports. I don’t have historical ZiPS, but I’m guessing that 5.1 WAR projection at age 24 doesn’t happen for many players with no major-league service time.

Five-Year WAR +22.1
Guaranteed Dollars
Team Control Through 2024
Previous Rank #HM
Year Age Projected WAR Contract Status
2019 21 +3.3 Pre-Arb
2020 22 +3.9 Pre-Arb
2021 23 +4.5 Arb1
2022 24 +5.2 Arb2
2023 25 +5.2 Arb3
Pre-Arb
Arb

We’ve now reached the conclusion of the prospect-explosion portion of the list. If my chats are any indication, the current worry among Braves fans is that Acuna’s performance over the last two weeks will prevent him from making the Hall of Fame, so I think they’re doing okay in the scheme of things. We ranked Acuna ahead of Vlad Jr. this offseason since they project to be of similar quality but Acuna’s skillset is more versatile and will likely age a little better.

ZiPS generally agrees with that ranking, given that Acuna is a year older and has some MLB data to consider. We expected Acuna to hit somewhere around 105 to 110 wRC+ and he’s at 99 right now during a slump, so I’d say his MLB career has been a success, a sort of proof of concept, since falling flat on his face was a possibility.

Five-Year WAR +21.0
Guaranteed Dollars
Team Control Through 2023
Previous Rank
Year Age Projected WAR Contract Status
2019 26 +4.4 Pre-Arb
2020 27 +4.1 Pre-Arb
2021 28 +4.3 Arb1
2022 29 +4.1 Arb2
2023 30 +4.1 Arb3
Pre-Arb
Arb

You may be surprised to find Chapman this high. He actually didn’t start the process ranked among the players you see here, but it slowly became clear that he’s earned it. As for pedigree, Chapman was always seen as a toolsy guy with plus power, plus defense at third base, and a top-of-the-scale 80 arm. The swing and overall offensive ability haven’t always been totally promising, though. To his credit, Chapman attended Fullerton, where they aren’t the most progressive when it comes to coaching hitters, so the possibility has always existed — as it does for Stanford hitters — that some of his offensive upside was obscured by a suboptimal approach.

Continuing the theme in this installment, it’s unlikely that anyone was projecting 6.2 WAR for Chapman through his first 165 big-league games. Some have questioned his fielding metrics, which suggest that Chapman’s among the best defenders in baseball. He’s leading the league both in UZR (+12.6) and DRS (+22) this year, but we’re still at basically a season-long sample, so it’s reasonable to regress these figures a bit if we’re looking for true defensive talent level.

Even if you do that, though, Chapman has always been at least a plus defender. And even if you give him a +5 to +10 by the metrics, he’s at something like 4.7 WAR in 165 games, which is about where ZiPS has him pegged if you build in a little bit of offensive regression, as well. Either way, he’s much better than anyone was expecting and is the type of player who provides value by contributing in all phases of the game (he’s also solidly above average as a baserunner) and not just overwhelmingly in one or two categories, so is a candidate to be overlooked. While the players just behind him have more pedigree and possibly more upside, it’s in the more traditional sense of scouting upside, whereas Chapman has already demonstrated he was wrongly underrated — all that in a sample that’s now meaningful, where he does the little things that are hard to measure in the minors. He should also age pretty well.

Five-Year WAR +22.8
Guaranteed Dollars
Team Control Through 2023
Previous Rank
Year Age Projected WAR Contract Status
2019 22 +3.5 Pre-Arb
2020 23 +4.2 Pre-Arb
2021 24 +4.9 Arb1
2022 25 +5.1 Arb2
2023 26 +5.1 Arb3
Pre-Arb
Arb

I may be a bit biased here, not because I worked for the Braves, but because I was the first to hop aboard the Albies bandwagon. That said, this list was pretty heavily shaped by the industry, so this is at least the range in which Albies belongs by their criteria, as well. The concern with Albies is that his overall profile (a surprisingly aggressive and power-based approach relative to the size) has few major-league comparables (an issue with Jose Altuve as well) and that he could be more susceptible to slumps than a more traditional player who’s easier to coach or diagnose.

For this reason, you could argue he should move to No. 20 on this list, behind the more traditional prospects. He appears higher than that, however, because, like Chapman, he’s already proven that his skills works at this level (where he’s produced 5.3 WAR in 150 games). Moreover, there’s an argument to be made (one which I share with others in the industry) that uniqueness in elite players is actually a positive. I won’t bore you with my whole Black Swan theory, but the concepts I’ve applied to pitchers with unique skills/frames can easily be applied to the collection of bite-sized hitters who’ve emerged in the big leagues.

I do have some concern that Albies’s current approach is contingent on his elite bat control and athleticism (which typically starts declining around 25-27), but his control years run through age 27, so even if you build in some slumps, nagging injuries, and an early decline, he’s a really safe bet to put up at least 2.5 to 3.0 wins due to the strong speed/defense/baserunning profile. Oh, and he can play an average shortstop, too, if you need that.

Five-Year WAR +19.7
Guaranteed Dollars
Team Control Through 2022
Previous Rank #26
Year Age Projected WAR Contract Status
2019 24 +3.7 Pre-Arb
2020 25 +4.0 Arb1
2021 26 +4.1 Arb2
2022 27 +3.9 Arb3
Pre-Arb
Arb

Benintendi’s appeal, which fits the theme of this installment in the series, is the combination of tools, performance, and pedigree that he offers. It took him a little longer than some hoped to hit is stride at the plate, but he’s done it this season and still has 4.5 years of control left. Benintendi is somewhat unique in that he was a consensus top-10 pick out of Arkansas but came so out-of-nowhere during that spring that some teams didn’t know he was a draft-eligible sophomore four months before the draft.

So, as prototypical as Benintendi appears to be as an athletic, do-it-all corner outfielder, three and a half years ago, he was essentially a nobody. He and Juan Soto, combined with the star-studded list of players who fell off of last year’s list show you how fickle these lists can be and how some seemingly minor adjustments can be worth $100 million to a club and/or player.

Five-Year WAR +27.7
Guaranteed Dollars
Team Control Through 2021
Previous Rank #3
Year Age Projected WAR Contract Status
2019 25 +5.3 Arb1
2020 26 +5.5 Arb2
2021 27 +5.7 Arb3
Arb

Seager was a tough one to peg, both because he’s obviously not going to be traded anytime soon but also because how quickly he bounces back from Tommy John surgery will dictate how much value he has. He was third on this list last year, and represents the rare and coveted big shortstop who can do everything. At this point, you’re looking at three years of control where you hope you’re getting the five- to seven-win player from 2016-17, but there’s really no way to project that with confidence. Given that Seager is an elite performer and is 24, it’s probably best to take the over on projected return and performance when he resumes play, but you could argue to rank him almost anywhere in this top 20.

Five-Year WAR +24.6
Guaranteed Dollars $13.0 M
Team Control Through 2021
Previous Rank #10
Year Age Projected WAR Contract Status
2019 33 +6.0 $13.0 M
2020 34 +5.3 $13.5 M
2021 35 +4.8 $14.0 M
Team Option

If you count yourself among those readers who thought Max Scherzer was ranked too low at No. 41, maybe I could interest you in some Klubot. He’s also an older right-hander with a couple years of control who’s proven he can take over a playoff series while also headlining your regular-season staff. The difference that drives the ranking is that Kluber makes essentially one-third as much as Scherzer, thus making him an ace that any team could afford and not just the league’s biggest-market clubs.

Five-Year WAR +26.6
Guaranteed Dollars
Team Control Through 2021
Previous Rank #4
Year Age Projected WAR Contract Status
2019 27 +5.8 Arb2
2020 28 +5.6 Arb3
2021 29 +5.2 Arb4
Arb

Bryant was another tough ranking, as you could lean on history and the ZiPS numbers to leave him in the top 10 or you could look at a two-year decline in WAR, defense, baserunning, wRC+, ISO, etc. and think he’s already peaked, settling at a current true talent level of something like four wins. I split the difference here, as I don’t have a strong feeling which side is more accurate in projecting his future, but a 26-year-old hitter feels a little safer than a 32-year-old pitcher, even if I flip-flopped them about a dozen times throughout this process. The fact that there’s very little chance any of the players in this range will be traded anytime soon makes these rankings more about your favorite flavor of player than any real-world trade packages.

2018 Trade Value, 11-50
Rk Pv Player Age 2019 2020 2021 2022 2023
11 4 Kris Bryant 26 +5.8
Arb2
+5.6
Arb3
+5.2
Arb4
12 10 Corey Kluber 32 +6.0
$13.0 M
+5.3
$13.5 M
+4.8
$14.0 M
13 3 Corey Seager 24 +5.3
Arb1
+5.5
Arb2
+5.7
Arb3
14 26 Andrew Benintendi 23 +3.7
Pre-Arb
+4.0
Arb1
+4.1
Arb2
+3.9
Arb3
15 Ozzie Albies 21 +3.5
Pre-Arb
+4.2
Pre-Arb
+4.9
Arb1
+5.1
Arb2
+5.1
Arb3
16 Matt Chapman 25 +4.4
Pre-Arb
+4.1
Pre-Arb
+4.3
Arb1
+4.1
Arb2
+4.1
Arb3
17 HM Ronald Acuna 20 +3.3
Pre-Arb
+3.9
Pre-Arb
+4.5
Arb1
+5.2
Arb2
+5.2
Arb3
18 HM Vladimir Guerrero, Jr. 19 +2.0
Pre-Arb
+2.9
Pre-Arb
+3.9
Pre-Arb
+4.4
Arb1
+5.1
Arb2
19 Juan Soto 19 +3.6
Pre-Arb
+3.2
Pre-Arb
+3.7
Arb1
+4.2
Arb2
+4.5
Arb3
20 Gleyber Torres 21 +2.3
Pre-Arb
+3.0
Pre-Arb
+3.8
Arb1
+4.0
Arb2
+4.1
Arb3
21 49 Aaron Nola 25 +4.6
Arb1
+4.7
Arb2
+4.7
Arb3
22 27 Christian Yelich 26 +4.2
$9.8 M
+4.2
$12.5 M
+3.8
$14.0 M
+3.9
$15.0 M
23 21 Chris Sale 29 +6.5
$13.5 M
24 J.T. Realmuto 27 +3.5
Arb2
+3.4
Arb3
25 37 Jacob deGrom 30 +6.0
Arb2
+5.7
Arb3
26 11 Cody Bellinger 22 +3.7
Pre-Arb
+4.6
Arb1
+4.8
Arb2
+4.9
Arb3
+5.3
Arb4
27 18 George Springer 28 +4.2
Arb2
+3.9
Arb3
28 19 Willson Contreras 26 +3.7
Pre-Arb
+3.8
Arb1
+3.6
Arb2
+3.4
Arb3
29 34 Noah Syndergaard 25 +4.6
Arb2
+4.8
Arb3
+4.6
Arb4
30 Shohei Ohtani 23 +3.1
Pre-Arb
+4.0
Pre-Arb
+4.3
Arb1
+4.6
Arb2
+4.8
Arb3
31 12 Gary Sanchez 25 +2.5
Pre-Arb
+2.7
Arb1
+2.7
Arb2
+2.6
Arb3
32 Eugenio Suarez 26 +4.2
$7.0 M
+3.9
$9.2 M
+3.6
$10.5 M
+3.6
$11.0 M
+3.3
$11.0 M
33 Mitch Haniger 27 +3.2
Pre-Arb
+3.0
Arb1
+2.9
Arb2
+2.8
Arb3
34 Rhys Hoskins 25 +3.2
Pre-Arb
+3.4
Pre-Arb
+3.3
Arb1
+3.2
Arb2
+3.0
Arb3
35 Blake Snell 25 +3.2
Pre-Arb
+3.4
Arb1
+3.4
Arb2
+3.1
Arb3
36 24 Jose Altuve 28 +5.3
$16.5 M
+4.8
$26.0 M
+4.9
$26.0 M
+4.5
$26.0 M
+3.9
$26.0 M
37 Andrelton Simmons 28 +4.9
$13.0 M
+4.7
$15.0 M
38 8 Anthony Rizzo 28 +4.6
$11.0 M
+4.4
$14.5 M
+4.0
$14.5 M
39 Fernando Tatis, Jr. 19 +1.2
Pre-Arb
+2.1
Pre-Arb
+3.4
Pre-Arb
+4.0
Arb1
+4.6
Arb2
40 Walker Buehler 23 +2.8
Pre-Arb
+3.0
Pre-Arb
+3.0
Arb1
+2.8
Arb2
+2.9
Arb3
41 33 Max Scherzer 33 +6.5
$35.0 M
+5.6
$35.0 M
+5.2
$35.0 M
42 17 Buster Posey 31 +4.9
$21.4 M
+4.3
$21.4 M
+3.6
$21.4 M
+3.1
$22.0 M
43 HM Odubel Herrera 26 +3.0
$5.0 M
+2.8
$7.0 M
+2.7
$10.0 M
+2.7
$11.5 M
+2.7
$12.5 M
44 Victor Robles 21 +2.5
Pre-Arb
+2.8
Pre-Arb
+3.1
Pre-Arb
+3.1
Arb1
+3.2
Arb2
45 HM Rafael Devers 21 +2.5
Pre-Arb
+3.2
Pre-Arb
+3.8
Arb1
+3.9
Arb2
+3.8
Arb3
46 Jose Berrios 24 +2.8
Pre-Arb
+2.9
Arb1
+3.2
Arb2
+2.9
Arb3
47 Trevor Bauer 27 +4.2
Arb2
+4.2
Arb3
48 48 James Paxton 29 +4.9
Arb2
+4.7
Arb3
49 Jean Segura 28 +3.0
$14.3 M
+3.0
$14.3 M
+2.9
$14.3 M
+2.7
$14.3 M
+2.4
$17.0 M
50 Kyle Tucker 21 +2.2
Pre-Arb
+3.0
Pre-Arb
+3.7
Pre-Arb
+3.7
Arb1
+3.7
Arb2
Pre-Arb
Arb
Team Option





Kiley McDaniel has worked as an executive and scout, most recently for the Atlanta Braves, also for the New York Yankees, Baltimore Orioles and Pittsburgh Pirates. He's written for ESPN, Fox Sports and Baseball Prospectus. Follow him on twitter.

131 Comments
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dl80Member since 2026
7 years ago

Anyone surprised by no Carlos Carrasco? I’m assuming he won’t be top 10. But he’s perpetually a top 15-20 pitcher and is super cheap for the next 3 years, only due a max of $27m from 2019-2021. And if he gets hurt, 2020 and 2021 are team options. Or am I wrong and he is top 10?

DKH
7 years ago
Reply to  dl80

Carrasco was in the HM article as a player that isn’t returning on the trade value list.

LenFuegoMember since 2025
7 years ago
Reply to  dl80

Carrasco was listed in the Honorable Mention post.

rhdx
7 years ago
Reply to  dl80

He is already 31 years old and only has 2 years of control left after this. Not sure any rebuilding team would want him for that much.

dl80Member since 2026
7 years ago
Reply to  rhdx

I missed him in the HM article somehow, but he actually has 3 years of cheap club control after this year

RoyalsFan#14321Member since 2024
7 years ago
Reply to  dl80

Do you just miss someone saying Ol’ Cars Cars’ O Car?

Baseball Anagrams
7 years ago

I know I will 🙁

Anyhow, see y’all tomorrow……

Goms
7 years ago

I think Kluber will take a precipitous fall on this list next year

emh1969
7 years ago
Reply to  Goms

I’m honestly a bit surprised that Kluber is this high. His K/9 has dropped sharply this year while he’s also allowing more home runs. Still a great contract/value but there are some definite warnings signs.

Goms
7 years ago
Reply to  emh1969

The contract saves him because even if he is a #3 production wise next year he’s still a good value. I think he’ll be more of a true #2 next year (you COULD argue that’s what he is right now) but with the contract that will be just fine.

1grm
7 years ago
Reply to  Goms

His xfip is at 3.05, I would still consider elite/#1 material. His BB/9 has fallen to 1.14 (career 1.91) which reduces the damage of less strikeouts

southie
7 years ago

You were so early on Albies his name wasn’t even Ozzie yet.

bensnider94
7 years ago

That picture is mesmerizing. I can’t stop staring

Jon
7 years ago

A general question – since we’re talking about trade value here (and not overall career prospects), could a player be penalized for being TOO young? For example, you could argue that Vlad would be worth more to the Jays if he played in the majors from age 22-28 than from 20 to 26, since those extra two years in the minors would likely mean that his overall major league production (over the timeframe of Toronto control) would be better.

I know it’s a loaded question because a guy who’s that advanced at 19 is by definition amazing (and they’d never let a guy spend 2+ years hitting .400 in AAA) , but I guess what I’m asking is: all things equal, if today Vlad was 22, put up his current AA numbers two years ago, and spent 2 years in AAA with the same numbers, would he be ranked more highly?

Or in other words, can the value of true prodigies be hurt by coming up too early and having some growing pains even if that’s best for their overall development?

LenFuegoMember since 2025
7 years ago
Reply to  Jon

I don’t think you look at it as being penalized, but sure, any player is going to have higher value from age 22-28 than age 20-26 – that’s just the way body and skill development works for human beings. Does that give a team like Toronto (which is not a contender this year and probably will not be in play to sign Vlad to a blockbuster deal when he becomes a free agent) an incentive to delay Vlad’s major league clock from starting? Yeah, it sure does.

ThomServo
7 years ago
Reply to  LenFuego

Age curves are getting younger, now peaking around 25-26. Many skill sets, particularly physical ones, peak and begin decline in the early 20s.

Role expansion lags talent/performance level, which can delay counting stat outbreaks- obscuring the issue and adding to the degree that reputation lags behind performance.

These trends are even more extreme in their tendency towards young age curves when caught PED users are removed from the sample.

Jays upon my feet
7 years ago
Reply to  Jon

Its a valid point. It leaps to mind for me in the case of a Manny Machado, who was very good at 20, but became a monster at 23, and of course now is in his prime (and traded due to his TC running out).

With Vlad, however, I’m not sure this principal would apply. Given the body, and the physical maturity to date, I’d rather have TC over the early 20’s.

bosoxforlifeMember since 2016
7 years ago
Reply to  Jon

I wish i could give you 10 thumbs up for this question. The situation is raising its head this coming off season as the Orioles and the Nationals are forced to relinquish control of players that are in their prime without getting full value for finding them, and then developing them. The idea has been introduced that all players should get a shot at free agency before they are 30 to give late developers a shot, deGrom and Donaldson for example. Perhaps a universal age, or a sliding scale determined by the age the player first reached the majors, to reach free agency in some form, might be equitable for both these situations.

TJ177
7 years ago
Reply to  bosoxforlife

Did the Nationals really find Harper? He was the most consensus #1 pick there ever was.

CC AFCMember since 2016
7 years ago
Reply to  bosoxforlife

Yeah, I’m gonna skip feeling bad for the Orioles and Nationals for getting six years of below market, superstar production from those guys.

WalterBishop
7 years ago
Reply to  CC AFC

Exactly. I will never understand why so many americans accept this slave mentality towards work

scooter262
7 years ago
Reply to  WalterBishop

The reason is that these guys are far from slaves. Yes, they do make far less than their fair-market salary would be. But they also make far more than the average American. I’m not saying its right, but I am saying that these facts combine to lessen people’s outrage over these guys only making a couple million dollars as opposed to tens- or hundreds-of-millions during their cost-controlled years.

RoyalsFan#14321Member since 2024
7 years ago
Reply to  scooter262

In Machado’s and Harper’s case, they are indeed making plenty of tens of millions during their cost-controlled years.

/just sayin’

carterMember since 2020
7 years ago
Reply to  WalterBishop

Bro, Harper left high school early.

WalterBishop
7 years ago
Reply to  Jon

Cool question. Prodigies would be hurt by delaying their ascent to the majors. 1) ability to make money 2) Injury risk

No company should play with people’s lives for the bottom line. Of course it happens all the time but thank god for the unions.

Pepper Martin
7 years ago
Reply to  WalterBishop

It’s not playing with people’s lives. Just playing with their livelihoods. Which literally every for-profit company does for the bottom line.

RoyalsFan#14321Member since 2024
7 years ago
Reply to  Pepper Martin

As do most government angencies with their employees, and at least one non-profit does (to my personal knowledge)

coopatroopa
7 years ago
Reply to  Jon

My initial thought when reading this comment was that being younger can only make the player more valuable. The team has control over not just the initial six-year major league window, but also when that window starts. You say “they’d never let a guy spend 2+ years hitting .400 in AAA,” but in hindsight do you think it might have helped a player like Byron Buxton who struggled in the majors before getting sent back down?

On the other hand, if you went around and asked every GM if they could magically make any one of their prospects one year older physically without changing anything else about their development, do you think they’d take you up on the offer? I’m sure many of them would, especially GMs on the hot seat. My intuition tells me some would rather seniorize (ageify? enolden?) fringe guys to help fill major league holes rather than their very top guys but either way it’s an interesting question to think about.

MarioLopez
7 years ago
Reply to  Jon

I also think this type of list penalizes players for being amazing right out of the gate. Take Kris Bryant for example. Tomorrow the top 10 will come out with Trea Turner over Kris Bryant. There is only 1 year of control difference between them which is also reflected in their ages; Bryant is 26 and Turner 25. Bryant is on pace for his career worst season, 4.5 fWAR, while Turner is on pace for his career best, 4.6 fWAR. Does 1 year really make Turner, who’s ceiling thus far appears to be the Bryant’s floor, more valuable to most teams? I’d argue that alone it wouldn’t especially since Bryant’s value is primarily tied to him being a terrific hitter who before this year was a good baserunner and decent defender whereas Turner virtually all the value comes from elite defense and speed.

But because Bryant was so good early on, he is most likely going to set the arbitration salary record each year. Turner on the other hand is going to be paid well, but not close to the levels Bryant will be paid, probably a 20-30 million difference in total when it is all said and done. And that, coupled with the extra year, is enough to make Turner more valuable to most teams. As bizarre as it sounds, being the inferior player for 3 years has made Turner more valuable.

MattabattacolaMember since 2026
7 years ago
Reply to  MarioLopez

Ill make it more simple: 2 players, same war pace, one plays short and is one year younger. The other plays 3rd and will be a free agent a year earlier hmmm

Mario MendozaMember since 2017
7 years ago
Reply to  Mattabattacola

War already accounts for position so trea doesn’t get extra credit over Bryant for playing short

mikejuntMember
7 years ago
Reply to  Mario Mendoza

WAR adjusts for position, but there’s a lot more good third basemen than shortstops, especially as players age and good shortstops move over.

Both players may improve your chances of winning by similar amounts, but if there’s more of one on the market the rarer one will be more valuable from a $$$ perspective.

For example, you’d pay more for a 5 win catcher (say, prime Posey) than a 5 win right fielder. There was only one catcher that good most of the time; there were several outfielders.

slamcactusMember since 2024
7 years ago
Reply to  MarioLopez

What the player is penalized for is his price. Bryant’s $10.8 million salary was a record contract for a first-yr arbitration eligible player, and he’ll get big raises every year from here. So Bryant is 3.5 years, all expensive. Turner still has 1.5 free years and his 3 years of arbitration will probably cost a little more than half of what Bryant figures to make.

Tough call between Bryant for 3.5 years and ~$60 million vs. Turner at 4.5 years and ~$35 million (very rough estimates there).

MarioLopez
7 years ago
Reply to  slamcactus

Yeah thats probably a better way of saying what I was trying to get at. I was viewing the gap in how much they’ll make through arbitration as being driven by how much better Bryant was in his early years of team control than Turner has been. Unlike what was suggested above I don’t see many teams (if any) choosing Turner at 4.5/35 vs Bryant at something like 3.5/40 just because Turner is slightly younger and can play SS because Bryant has been so much better when healthy thus far in their careers.

BacterunMember since 2025
7 years ago
Reply to  MarioLopez

I’d say Trea Turner has already shown a ceiling higher then Bryants Floor, look at his 73 games in 2016, that’s almost a 7 WAR pace. Now I dont think Trea is going to be more valuable per year than Bryant, but his ceiling is definitely higher then a 4.6 WAR guy. Also of note ceiling is a tough thing to pin down because pretty much any MLB player can just figure something out and turn from roster filler to star (Jose Bautista) or develop a skill that the consensus thought was improbable (Jose Altuve being a power hitter).

carterMember since 2020
7 years ago
Reply to  MarioLopez

Bryant can’t hit the ball nearly as hard as Turner.

jdbolickMember since 2024
7 years ago
Reply to  Jon

This is an interesting question but one based on a faulty premise. It’s not that being 21 makes someone a better player than being 19, it’s that the 21 year old has more experience and therefore more developed skills. Physically, they’re going to already be near their peak strength and speed without factoring in nutrition and weight training. That’s why things like ISO and BABIP don’t peak late, they decline immediately from age 21 onward. For players that produce elite high minors performance at age 19, I’m not sure how much skill development would take place if they spent an extra two years beating up on inferior competition. That skill development probably has to take place at the major league level, where they would also have access to superior coaching, nutrition, and weight training. So a team that delayed a prospect’s ascension wouldn’t necessarily have more of that player’s prime during the team’s control.

RoyalsFan#14321Member since 2024
7 years ago
Reply to  Jon

Do you think Vlad’s rating on /this/ list is hurt by his relative youth? He hasn’t taken an MLB PA yet, ,and he’s considered to be amongst the top 20 most valuable players…

Jon
7 years ago

No, not really. I mean I guess he could have been a few spots higher if he was 22 and spent the previous 2 years setting AAA hitting records, but it was more just a theoretical question.

coldbagel12Member since 2018
7 years ago
Reply to  Jon

I don’t think any player will lose sleep over a decreased trade value. To use the Bryant/Turner comparison, Bryant is making more money in his career because he started earlier. And the team can recoup some of the “lost” value of a player who starts early by, well, trading them, like how the Orioles jut got extra value out of Machado by trading him in his last year.

Jon
7 years ago
Reply to  coldbagel12

Oh, of course not. As someone else mentioned above, from the player’s perspective, he starts getting paid (even if it’s the minimum) faster, doesn’t risk a serious injury in the minors, and just in general gets to be in the major leagues.

It’s a lot more interesting from the team’s perspective, where the factors include such disparate things as:
– service time manipulation (better to keep him in the minors)
– player development (may or may not be better)
– wanting the years of player control to coincide with the team’s window of contention (may or may not be better)

In Vlad’s case, you’d think the Jays would want to keep him down at least until late April or May of next year. I’m surprised they are moving him to AAA so aggressively. If he destroys the league, it will be a lot harder to make a case for starting him in the minors next year.

OddBall Herrera
7 years ago

Top 10 speculation:

Bregman
Jose Ramirez
Trout
Betts
Correa
Judge
Lindor

I was thinking Severino since he hasn’t appeared yet, but I don’t know why he’d go so much higher than Nola or Snell with similar or fewer years of control left.

Maybe Freeman since he may have established his contract as a big bargain?

That’s 9…

OddBall Herrera
7 years ago

Oh, Turner

HappyFunBallMember since 2019
7 years ago

Top-10 are (in some other order I’m sure):

2017 – Player
1 Carlos Correa
2 Mike Trout
5 Francisco Lindor
6 Aaron Judge
7 Trea Turner
9 Mookie Betts
14 Freddie Freeman
15 Jose Ramirez
35 Luis Severino
38 Alex Bregman

OddBall Herrera
7 years ago

I mean, I get why Severino > Snell. Track record. It’s the (assumed) gap between Severino and Nola I find very curious.

james123Member since 2024
7 years ago

Severino has 4.5 years remaining, versus 3.5 for Nola. Also, Severino has been slightly better over the last year and a half or so.

OddBall Herrera
7 years ago
Reply to  james123

4.5? The place I checked had them with the same 3.5 years of control left. If that’s the case that would explain it.

james123Member since 2024
7 years ago

Yea, Severino spent some time in the minors in 2016 which got him the extra year. He misses the cut off by two days. If you check out last year’s list they have it right.

seton
7 years ago
Reply to  james123

The gap between Sevy and Nola is a lot IMO. Sevy is

1. younger
2. has more team control
3. better the last 2 yrs
4. put up over 200 innings last yr if u include the postseason (something that Kiley has mentioned that Nola has yet to do or come even close)

Sevy was always going to be in the Top 10 and seemed that he was going to be the top pitcher which turned out to be true.

OddBall Herrera
7 years ago
Reply to  seton
Pepper Martin
7 years ago

They’re missing the fact that Severino has a 4th year of arbitration:
https://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/NYY/new-york-yankees-salaries-and-contracts.shtml

Joey Butts
7 years ago

I made the same mistake last year, for the same reason. Spotrac is insistent that Sevvy is only under control through 2021.

mikejuntMember
7 years ago

Sportrac sucks.

james123Member since 2024
7 years ago

here’s my prediction for the top 10:

1.JRam
2.Lindor
3.Judge
4.Trout
5.Bregman
6.Betts
7.Severino
8.Correa
9.Trea Turner
10.Freeman

Chris
7 years ago
Reply to  james123

American League is loaded up top.

Groundout
7 years ago
Reply to  james123

Trying to predict is too much fun to pass up:

JRam
Judge
Lindor
Trout
Bregman
Correa
Severino
Turner
Betts
Freeman

bosoxforlifeMember since 2016
7 years ago
Reply to  Groundout

I will join the list that puts Jose Ramirez at the top. That contract is well beyond incredible in value to the Indians.

scooter262
7 years ago
Reply to  james123

Trout needs to give the Angels another year at $1 million or so, in order to get back to the top of the list.

Pepper Martin
7 years ago
Reply to  james123

1. Ramirez
2. Judge
3. Lindor
4. Betts
5. Correa
6. Severino
7. Trout
8. Bregman
9. Freeman
10. Turner

Nathan
7 years ago

I think Soto is too low on this list. Obviously we have a small sample of big-league games from him and he could regress, but he’s been better than basically anyone ever at his age. Just cherry-picking 200+ PA/age-19-and-younger seasons and sorting by wRC+ gives:

https://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=all&stats=bat&lg=all&qual=200&type=8&season=2018&month=0&season1=1903&ind=1&team=0&rost=0&age=14,19&filter=&players=0&sort=18,d

OddBall Herrera
7 years ago
Reply to  Nathan

Agreed, I’d minimum put him over Vlad and Acuna but that’s probably splitting hairs since they are all clumped together.

There’s something about Soto that is not only jaw dropping in terms of what he’s doing and how quickly, but also in terms of how plausible/sustainable it all seems due to his underlying skills. So people mention hall of fame in the context of Acuna and I think “Weeeeell, he’s got some things to sort out before we go there” but Soto…man, that guy seems like he’s going to be hitting .300+/30+ for the next ten years.

willl
7 years ago

If you want to get nit-picky, Soto still has a lot of room for improvement defensively. He’ll never be an elite defensive CF, but even his fundamentals on reading balls and positioning himself in LF could be improved quite a bit. But that’s really it…

TJ177
7 years ago
Reply to  Nathan

Judging by who he is next to we can reasonably assume he is likely to:
– get his career cut short by a bean ball
– be hated due to a prickly personality and propensity to spike people on the bases
– not run out ground balls and cheat with his dad to win HR derbies

I think he’s listed too high

sadtromboneMember since 2020
7 years ago
Reply to  Nathan

Pretty much everyone has been too low on Soto throughout this whole process. He was destroying the minors as a teenager, hitting better than Eloy Jimenez and just a bit below Vlad Jr. The reason he wasn’t getting love was because he didn’t have elite raw power, but the guy was ridiculous. That, and some thing called “pedigree” which Kiley mentions a lot here and is often used as a justification to avoid revising the opinion of a player.

Now, I don’t think anyone could have predicted that he was going to tear up the league this quickly, but how high would you rank a 4-5 fWAR player in his first season of team control, and who is quite possibly going to improve because he’s only 19 (yes, nineteen!) years old? I would put him at the best spot in this installment. I certainly wouldn’t trade Ramirez or Judge for him, but I’d take him over Corey Seager pretty easily, and (likely) over Bryant as well.

OddBall Herrera
7 years ago

I have to think that the only thing that would keep Albies behind Seager is risk aversion. More control, isn’t destined to lose a chunk of that time to TJS, and I’d argue a more complete player.

Seager’s ascent into superstardom is every bit as speculative (and perhaps less) than Albies’. There’s still a lot of projecting going on there, and I’m honestly a little skeptical he really gets into that upper echelon.

majnun
7 years ago

He was third in the MVP voting last year

southie
7 years ago

Plus you’d have to think Albies will stop swinging at everything as he matures.

TKDCMember since 2016
7 years ago
Reply to  southie

Is that a good thing or a bad thing?

CC AFCMember since 2016
7 years ago

After you mentioned Albies’ “surprisingly aggressive and power based approach relative to his size,” I happened to look and realize his current season numbers are strikingly similar to Rougned Odor’s 2015. Rougned was actually even better than Albies at making contact at that point.

Obviously not expecting Albies to regress like Odor did (or to land sweet punches on takeout sliders) but maybe a counter data point for caution.

Free Clay Zavada
7 years ago
Reply to  CC AFC

He can only aspire to land a top tier haymaker like that at some point

Latch-Key Kid
7 years ago

This seems to be putting a TON of trust in the defensive stats re: Chapman that I just can’t share. I can’t imagine the A’s calling up the Yankees, Nats, Jays, or Braves and offering Chapman for any of the 4 guys listed immediately behind him and not hearing laughs as the line goes dead. Or the Dodgers with Bellinger or the Phils with Hoskins. I get that he’s generally underrated by casual fans and is, in fact, a very good and valuable piece. But the 16th most trade value in all of baseball? Nah.

chavezfanMember since 2021
7 years ago
Reply to  Latch-Key Kid

It’s not just defensive metrics for Chapman, though – it’s the eye test and every single scouting report on him. He is an absolutely elite defender at a premium position with more than five years of cheap team control remaining.

In his first full season, Manny Machado posted a 102 wRC+. Granted, he was only 21, so that made him more of a Top 5 Trade Value guy, but Chapman is at a 117 wRC+ in his first full season with the same elite defense as Machado. And that’s with room to grow in the bat – he has a .184 ISO, but averaged well over .200 in the minors and posted a .238 mark last season. If not for the time he missed with injury this season, he’d be on pace for a 7.0 fWAR season. Even if you don’t fully believe the metrics, he’d still be on at least a 5.0 fWAR per 162 pace in his first full season with 5 affordable years ahead of him. That’s at least Top 25 Trade Value. Dude’s a stud.

Latch-Key Kid
7 years ago
Reply to  chavezfan

Sure. I am in no way saying he’s a scrub or shouldn’t be on the list somewhere. I still don’t believe that if the A’s call up the Yankees and say “We’ll give you Chapman for Torres” that the answer isn’t an immediate “no thanks.” I get the rationale for why other, better players are ranked lower and why they might not be seen as having as much value. But I genuinely can’t see (at the very least) any of the teams who have the 5 guys immediately behind him in the rankings agreeing to a swap. So it’s hard for me to see how he has more trade value than them.

ThrasiusMember since 2016
7 years ago
Reply to  Latch-Key Kid

I understand that my argument is an appeal to authority. However, Kiley has mentioned a few times that the list generally represents industry consensus, albeit with some inherent assumptions, particularly regarding each team’s finances and spot on the win curve. I’m willing to take him at his word. So I think you and Kiley may both be right, in a general sense.

TrevorCap
7 years ago
Reply to  Latch-Key Kid

To be clear, though, the 6.2 WAR mentioned in his first 165 games is already a conservative estimate of his defensive ability, because DRS has his as 8 bWAR over his first 165 games so as Kiley mentioned, even if you think he’s a +5 or +10 defender that would only get him down to a 5 win player. Given that his actual stats were 41 DRS and 22 UZR for his first full year, you’d have to think he was significantly less than half as good with the glove as our best estimates say he is. That would mean an extreme pessimist would say that in his first year in the bigs, Matt Chapman was ONLY the 20th or so best position player in baseball in his first year and also is still more than 2 years away from arbitration.

OddBall Herrera
7 years ago
Reply to  Latch-Key Kid

“Or the Dodgers with Bellinger or the Phils with Hoskins.”

Oh man, you’re right that the deal would never happen, but I don’t think it’s for the right reasons. I think it’s because, if offered, the Phillies/Dodgers would simply blink at shipping out their name brand ‘future of the franchise’ guy.

It is not hard to look at Chapman and see the next Arenado style offensive force + defensive whiz at 3b in the making.

willl
7 years ago

The difference again comes back to age. Chapman is 25. When Arenado came up as a defensive whiz with unrealized potential in his bat (2013), he was 22. By age 25, Arenado was putting up his second straight 40 HR season to go along with that elite 3B defense.

Towel
7 years ago
Reply to  Latch-Key Kid

To quote John Sickels, “Not to put too fine a point on it, but Chapman is one of the best defensive third basemen I’ve ever seen”

FGs is already being conservative with his defensive metrics, BR thinks he’s an 8 WAR player over his first 162 games.

sadtromboneMember since 2020
7 years ago
Reply to  Towel

To be fair, this is one more exhibit in “Baseball Reference uses defensive statistics in a wacky way.” He’s good, but the frequency of extreme values (both positive and negative) for DRS suggests some underlying problems.

carterMember since 2020
7 years ago
Reply to  Towel

If you’ve ever watched Chapman on the field you’d understand. There is not one player in the game who makes the plays he does.

Walter
7 years ago
Reply to  carter

Chapman is so good, A’s fans wish the 3rd base foul line was moved a few degrees to the left!

jdbolickMember since 2024
7 years ago
Reply to  Latch-Key Kid

You are correct and it’s because teams do not pay half as much for defensive WAR as they do for offensive WAR. Remember that Andrelton Simmons with $53 million over five years remaining on his contract was traded for Sean Newcomb, Erick Aybar, and Chris Ellis.

sadtromboneMember since 2020
7 years ago
Reply to  jdbolick

I don’t disagree with the idea that’s how teams operate, but look how that turned out! That would have been bad even if Simmons didn’t take his offensive game to the next level.

jdbolickMember since 2024
7 years ago
Reply to  sadtrombone

Sure. Everyone said it was a stupid trade at the time, and it was, but we’ve seen the same trend in free agency. Teams simply do not pay as much for defense.

sadtromboneMember since 2020
7 years ago
Reply to  Latch-Key Kid

Chapman obviously doesn’t have the longevity of Beltre (he couldn’t possibly!) but he’s potentially the best defender in the league for his position and not a bad hitter either. Chapman’s ranked about right for me.

bananas
7 years ago
Reply to  sadtrombone

Beltre was a stud MLB 3rd baseman before he could legally drink beer

Walter
7 years ago
Reply to  bananas

This is useful information when it comes to who’s the better player or who’s going to have the best career, but it doesn’t really impact trade value that’s generally looking no further than 5 years out. Chapman is likely in his peak, so is unlikely to improve like a guy that makes a splash in the league at 20/21, but he’s plenty young enough to not be expected to regress over the next several years as well.

RoyalsFan#14321Member since 2024
7 years ago
Reply to  Latch-Key Kid

I’ll take Chapman over Torres in WAR for the next 4 years – and given the way that defense is paid, will make him immensely more valuable here…

Walter
7 years ago

This is a great point. His Arb price will be substantially lower than others on this list.

WalterBishop
7 years ago

I know fantasy and real baseball are far different. But Matt Chapman? 11-49 are players rostered and more likely considered keepers in my 12 team Keep 6 league…Chapman is and has been for a while on the waiver wire.

josephd10
7 years ago
Reply to  WalterBishop

You’re right. Fantasy is a much different consideration.
Chapman, however, is tied for 14th in MLB WAR and is playing his first full season. He’s arguably the best defensive player in baseball at a premium position and has an above-average bat. He belongs here.

WalterBishop
7 years ago
Reply to  josephd10

I’ll have to keep him on my radar. Just seemed out of place to me for the reasons I stated above.

burts_beadsMember since 2025
7 years ago
Reply to  WalterBishop

This list has literally nothing to do with fantasy baseball.

WalterBishop
7 years ago
Reply to  burts_beads

Yeah, hence the first statement in my post. Lighten up for fucks sake

Stoppage in Udders
7 years ago

Really surprised Kenta Maeda didn’t appear at the beginning of this list or among the HMs. He undoubtedly has some injury risk tied to him, but any concerns on that front should be mitigated by the structure of his contract (3 million per year guaranteed, with incentives for innings and GS). He’s controlled very cheaply for the next 5 years and his cash stream is arguably more predictable than that of an Arb player.

Seems to have taken a step forward in the K department this season (11.2 k/9 as a starter) and by the end of this year will probably have averaged about 3 WAR per season since being in the league. I feel like he’s been completely forgotten about.

Uncle SpikeMember since 2020
7 years ago

Geesh, that is a ridiculous contract. Even if he hits all his incentives (200+ innings, 32+ starts), he maxes out at $11.125M.

Stoppage in Udders
7 years ago
Reply to  Uncle Spike

It’s in the argument for best contract in baseball. The guy is pitching like a #1.5 starter (not quite an ace, but better than many #2s). I mean, 11.2 K/9 this year? 2.76 FIP this year? As a starter? With a solid history of good command? And a 3.56 FIP over 400 total MLB innings? If he were ever traded the haul should be insane. He’s getting paid like a reliever for the next five years and that’s if he maxes out his incentives!

Rainja182
7 years ago

Today I learned that Vlad Jr is hitting .400 in MiLB this year. That is all.

Les Vegetables
7 years ago

It’s scares the crap out of me that the Yankees have 2 of the 10 most valuable assets in baseball, along with 2 others in the top 50, and can probably add another $50-60 million onto there payroll without batting an eye.

mrenick1974Member since 2018
7 years ago
Reply to  Les Vegetables

astros have 2 in the top 10, 2 more in the top 50 but I guess the extent of their payroll flexibility remains to be seen.

Cheeknbut
7 years ago
Reply to  mrenick1974

Astros have 3 more in the top 50

mrenick1974Member since 2018
7 years ago
Reply to  Cheeknbut

Totally forgot about Tucker

seton
7 years ago
Reply to  mrenick1974

i dont blame you. tucker shouldnt have been on the list in the first place.

Pepper Martin
7 years ago
Reply to  Les Vegetables

As a Yankee fan I quite enjoy it.
EDITED TO ADD: Also, the Yankees can add VASTLY more than $50-60 million to their payroll after this year. They’ve stayed under the luxury tax threshold and thus reset their tax rate for next year, which allows them a whole lot more in the way of financial flexibility going forward. Obviously they have a whole bunch of young players getting raises, but right now for 2019 they only have $86 Million committed next year ($26 to Stanton; $22 to Tanaka; $21 to Ellsbury, and $17 to Chapman).

RoyalsFan#14321Member since 2024
7 years ago
Reply to  Pepper Martin

They are running towards the first $1B (billion) outfield, with Harper/Stanton/Judge, with nowhere to stash Trout in 2021…

I’m kind of impressed.

EasyenoughMember since 2016
7 years ago
Reply to  Pepper Martin

Oh man. That Ellsbury contract…

TJ177
7 years ago
Reply to  Les Vegetables

And those two top 10 assets were ones that anyone in the league could have had. Virtually every team (including the NYY) passed on Judge in the draft and Severino wasn’t one of the 20 best IFAs the year that he signed

#feelsbadman

Baron Samedi
7 years ago

If J.A. Happ doesn’t appear on the next list, Kiley officially more biased than Cameron.

SpiggyMember since 2025
7 years ago
Reply to  Baron Samedi

Wut.

Baron Samedi
7 years ago
Reply to  Spiggy

rofl simmer down virgins

WalterBishop
7 years ago
Reply to  Baron Samedi

1 thing I have learned about 99% of baseball geeks is they are humorless losers. Ever post on Rotoworld? Jesus it’s scary how sad some of these people are .

TKDCMember since 2016
7 years ago

There must be a lot of stock put in this season when comparing Kris Bryant and Freddie Freeman. They both have three years of team control left, and Bryant will be cheaper (not a lot, but still) and he has (real) positional flexibility. The only thing Freeman seems to really have is that he’s been a little better on offense over the past few years and he is hitting elite this year while Bryant is merely really good. Again, comparing Altuve to Freeman, it just surprises me that there is such a difference between the two.

tung_twista
7 years ago
Reply to  TKDC

Came here to say this.
Bryant’s ZiPS (ROS) 2.3 WAR / Steamer (ROS) 2.4 WAR
Freeman’s ZiPS (ROS) 2.1 WAR / Steamer (ROS) 2.1 WAR
They are effectively tied, but with Bryant being two years younger and slightly cheaper, it is quite surprising.

I think it shows that teams still pay for offense more than defense and non-SB baserunning.
(Fun fact: From ’15 to ’17 Bryant is ranked 5th in BsR despite having only 28 SB)

agam22Member since 2017
7 years ago
Reply to  TKDC

They’re also essentially right next to each other on the list, so tie goes to the guy having a better season right now

TKDCMember since 2016
7 years ago
Reply to  agam22

This is an extremely fair point. Freeman is most likely 10th or very close to 10th.

kid
7 years ago

I don’t quite see it with Acuna. Loud tools, but big holes in the swing and poor on-base ability early on. What if he’s essentially BJ Upton 2.0?

Free Clay Zavada
7 years ago
Reply to  kid

That’s Melvin to you.

agam22Member since 2017
7 years ago
Reply to  kid

He’s 20. And even if he is Melvin Upton, he put up 6 years with the Rays averaging about 4 wins a season while he was team controlled. It might be a disappointment for how highly rated a prospect he is, but that kind of production for Arb and pre-arb prices is still insane value.

kid
7 years ago
Reply to  agam22

1) I’m not knocking *Melvin* Upton at all, who was a valuable player. I do think it’s worth pointing out that during his best years he was a very good defensive CF. And Acuna, in his young career, has not been (though he’s supposed to be 45/50 Fielding). I’m not going to pass judgement on the whole of Acuna’s defensive abilities after a quarter of a season, so I’m considering him “Average” for now.

2) I can’t help but feel that we’re again guilty of falling in love with the Siren Song of the up-the-middle prospect. Again, we don’t have to look back further than a guy like Byron Buxton to see how this profile can go way south. I think it’s recency bias that removes us from considering this outcome, given that Acuna’s MLB start has been relatively “hot”, which causes us to overlook how scary that plate discipline really is. I think the community at-large is a bit starstruck, and that with a little worse batted-ball luck we’d feel a bit differently. For the 17th most valuable Trade Asset, I want someone who is *guaranteed* to smack the crap out of a baseball.

agam22Member since 2017
7 years ago
Reply to  kid

“For the 17th most valuable Trade Asset, I want someone who is *guaranteed* to smack the crap out of a baseball.”

Yeah that’s the thing, MLB teams don’t. They want someone that they can be fairly sure will smack the crap out of a baseball (or just provide value) while also being cheap and team controlled for a long time. That’s why Matt Chapman is #16

RoyalsFan#14321Member since 2024
7 years ago
Reply to  kid

Bj Upton was really really good.

mersilis
7 years ago

Has anyone analyzed surplus value by team? For active players, you could apply a $/WAR constant to ZIPS or other WAR projections for years under contract and subtract contract value. For prospects with FV 45 and higher, you could use the Point of Pittsburgh research (https://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/valuing-the-2017-top-100-prospects/ ).

It would be interesting to see which teams have the greatest assets and how much of it sits in their present vs. their future.

shaq_diesel
7 years ago

Wow. So Archer off the list all together? After a dozen rough starts?

carterMember since 2020
7 years ago

Forgot where I read it, but a year ago I read someone saying that Matt Chapman was the best defensive player ever. The guy didn’t say 3rd base, simply the greatest defensive player of all time. Which for a guy who plays 3rd base is shocking. He has actually proven him right thus far (in his defensive peak). If and when he turns the corner to being an above average corner bat he might be in the short conversation for best player in the MLB not named Trout.

carterMember since 2020
7 years ago

Super struggle with Bryant as well. Here is the thing: His batted ball profile is below average. Not below average for this list….just below average. He has below average exit velocity, below average max velocity, below average max distance, etc. But the difference with him is it was obvious it was a conscious decision he made, since when he came into the league he would of been/was a statcast darling. He made decisions to cut K’s and put the ball in play, so one would venture he could make the decision to stop being a slap hitter again since with no noticeable change to body he has gone from a power hitter only to a guy who has pitchers on the team (Lester) who consistently hit the ball harder than he has in 3 years.

ThomServo
7 years ago

“The fact that there’s very little chance any of the players in this range will be traded anytime soon makes these rankings more about your favorite flavor of player than any real-world trade packages.”

IMO this isn’t true. Likelihood of being traded is not related to a player’s potential trade value. Additionally, over a 5-year view, no player is actually untradeable. If empirical analysis were done, the band of ‘percentage chance to be traded over the next 5 years’ would be similar for all players, with a small standard deviation. As far as being traded ‘soon,’ it depends on what is meant by soon, but neither Kluber nor Bryant stand out as great examples of guys with minimal chance to be traded soon. Kluber and Bryant both have 3 years left on their deals, Bryant will be 30 the first year of his next contract and Kluber will be 36. The Cubs certainly have shown a reluctance to give big contracts to aging and declining players, as with Arrieta, WS or not. Cleveland has been a bit more open to signing older and declining players, but even so Kluber will be 36 to start his next contract, and age at which many club legends who lose effectiveness jump around to their last couple clubs.

If the Cubs and Indians aren’t going to resign Kluber or Bryant, than they would be fairly realistic trade candidates as they go into the 2021 season.

Corey Seager is also a player who could be traded, as the Dodgers are too well informed to refuse to move anyone. If he does not regain an elite production level in the next two years, or if he moves off SS, he’s actually another guy who could very realistically move. To be fair, however, the authors point seems to be that he won’t be traded while recovering from TommyJohn (or immediately after), which is a fair point. Even so, his trade value shouldn’t be rendered difficult to determine simply due to injury. An injured player is worth less, unambiguously the trade value is lowered, and injured players don’t get traded often because front offices do not like the optics of being seen to possibly ‘sell low.’

Even if a front offices knows that a player has been diminished by injury, fans often need to visually see that a player has been diminished before they will give the front offices an easy time for trading a star. Seager’s actual trade value right now is diminished, and far from being an unsolvable riddle, the percentage decline in performance from injury can be estimated at highly predictive levels, and so too can the lost value from time on the DL be estimated at highly predictive levels.

Seager is very likely ranked too high, as I believe fangraphs projections do not factor in injury, while most internal MLB projection systems do. Further, Seager is a fairly likely regression candidate- his 3 great seasons all came with a BABIP of .350 or higher, he derives a lot of his value from fielding and baserunning. While his outstanding accomplishments are already in the books, at 6’4″ 220 lbs and entering his mid 20s, Seager’s body type is highly predictive of a substantial decline in fielding and running ability. While his bat has been very good, apart from BABIP, his hitting number have yet to be truly elite. At 3B, and factoring in a year off due to injury and potential swing complications from arm injury, he’s more likely a 12 WAR projection over the next 3 years. Projections of 5.3, 5.5, and 5.7 seem to overcredit him, whether this overvaluation is by empirical methodology that ignores injuries and body types, or just a tip of the hat to Seager’s star status among the industry, it is likely over optimistic.

This line of thinking, i.e. that the likelihood of a trade in the near future effects actual trade value, seems to be a traditionalist idea, overly reliant on survey-style analysis of market participants. Some front offices, obviously, are still traditional and incompetent, therefore some traditional front offices have trouble coming up with an idea of trade value if they think the player won’t be traded. But enough competent front offices are well informed that market prices have stabilized generally, converged to equilibrium prices, and have otherwise become easier to project, not harder. Enough front offices value players on the basis of surplus value, from essentially WAR figures, that nearly every trade and free agent deal roughly corresponds to typical surplus value figures.

frazier15n
7 years ago

Still scrolling to find the Matt Chapman questions, such as who the hell would trade Juan Soto or Vlad Jr. to get Matt Chapman, as in: is there a single organization that would make that move?

Walter
7 years ago
Reply to  frazier15n

Would the A’s trade a 5+ WAR player for a guy in AA, no matter how good? A lot can go wrong with even the best prospects, Chapman on the other hand has already proven he belongs.

carterMember since 2020
7 years ago
Reply to  Walter

Athletics are like the forgotten team in the MLB. Guys are good who get very little attention.

Forrest Gumption
7 years ago

If anyone wants to question the defensive metrics on Matt Chapman, I invite them to watch literally any game. He’s the best since Robinson at 3B and is seriously challenging top dog Andrelton for overall best defender in MLB.